Spoilers Crisis on Infinite Earths Discussion (CW Event Spoiler Thread)

[Noname Given]

We don't know he made Lex a hero at all. That's merely what it seems to be at the moment. How that actually shakes out could be very different than first impressions. The fact that everyone thinks Lex his a hero could be due to something else that has nothing directly to do with Oliver.

With regard to lex luthor being a hero; remember that the Brandon Routh Superman was supposed to be the Paragon of truth; and that for the Spectre's restart to work all the Paragons had to concentrate on the remaining scrap of the Book of Destiny.

My conjecture is that lex himself somehow managed the rewrite of himself as a hero /good guy. Like all the other Paragons; He still remember the original reality/multiverse too.

No matter how it plays out it does give the Supergirl writing staff an interesting character to used for future storylines.

They could even bring back Oliver/The Spectre. That character always works better if no one believes he exists, so that could be the explanation as to why he decided to appear as if he was actually dying to Barry and Sarah.

 

[tomalak301]

I'm sorry but I was disappointed in that. For one, the Arrow episode was confusing as hell, and then Arrow is actually killed off with two episodes to go IN HIS OWN SHOW and WHERE THE HELL WAS CISCO?

I probably would have enjoyed Part 5 better if Cisco was there but Caitlin and Barry acted as if Cisco didn't exist. Maybe this was the way to get the actor out of the show and they did it in the worst way possible. Also, no Ralph or Iris?

 

[Aragorn]

If you've ever wondered if websites deliberately make spoilers unavoidable, the answer is yes.

 

[Dick Whitman]

Overall my only real disappointment in the whole event was the Anti Monitor vs Spectre fight. The two just standing on a cliff side and shooting energy from their hands???

Obviously the show does not have a feature film budget. I think the actual problem is Arrow crew not used to filming such surreal sequences. We did not need to see them as giants in space. Seeing their silhouettes superimposed over a unnatural sky and crosscutting back and forth to the others watching on. With no clear shots of what is exactly happening would have been mysterious and more interesting.

After that I was surprised they did go with Anti Monitor as an actual giant in the finale.

 

[CorporalClegg]

The writing wasn't very strong, but it was so Goddamn fun that I don't care.

So, solid A from me.

 

[DigificWriter]

Arrow is actually killed off with two episodes to go IN HIS OWN SHOW

One, technically, because Episode 8x09 is the "Green Arrow and the Canaries" backdoor pilot.

This isn't really news, though, so I'm not sure where the problem lies.

 

[CorporalClegg]

One thing though, given Sara's convo with Barry, I was actually expecting it to end with the surprise return of Laurel Prime. I was actually a little surprised when it didn't.

 

[tomalak301]

One, technically, because Episode 8x09 is the "Green Arrow and the Canaries" backdoor pilot.

This isn't really news, though, so I'm not sure where the problem lies.

What's not news? That the series finale will not have its lead character because he's dead? You may not have a problem with it, but I'm confused as hell and as someone who has seen all of Arrow, I'm going into the finale wondering why they killed off the lead character before said finale. Now maybe the finale will be good, we'll have to see. I just wish a bone was thrown somehow because the series will be ending in two weeks.

I also know about the backdoor pilot.

 

[Xerxes82]

I've mostly jumped ship on the Arrowverse shows. But I did watch this, and it honestly wasn't bad. Maybe a little crowded, but that's to be expected.

Loved the Ezra Miller cameo. I can't believe they managed to keep that a secret. Well done.

And they restored Diggle's daughter! I got a moment of genuine delight from that.

My biggest question moving forward: Superman. Sons? One is presumably Jon, matching up with the current comic incarnation. But the other? Chris? Conner? Something completely original? I'll admit I've not followed the news on the coming Superman and Lois show, so maybe it's old news, but it caught me by surprise and I'm curious which direction they'll go. (Also, Superman probably the only one of these I'll check out going forward.)

 

[DigificWriter]

What's not news? That the series finale will not have its lead character because he's dead?

Oliver will be in the Arrow Series Finale.

 

[Noname Given]

I'm sorry but I was disappointed in that. For one, the Arrow episode was confusing as hell, and then Arrow is actually killed off with two episodes to go IN HIS OWN SHOW and WHERE THE HELL WAS CISCO?

I probably would have enjoyed Part 5 better if Cisco was there but Caitlin and Barry acted as if Cisco didn't exist. Maybe this was the way to get the actor out of the show and they did it in the worst way possible. Also, no Ralph or Iris?

They did that for the Brainiac 5 characters as well. Probably a budget /cost-saving measure. I'm actually impressed they did as much as they did with all the cameos that they managed to get in there.

If you're wondering how to explain it in universe, remember only the Paragon's were aware of what actually happened, so all the missing characters were somewhere else doing something else and the Martian Manhunter hadn't gotten to them yet to pass on the memories of what occurred.

I actually thought the speed force bit in episode 4 was nicely done; and I liked how they handled The Spectere character during it. YMMV.

 

[tomalak301]

They did that for the Brainiac 5 characters as well. Probably a budget /cost-saving measure. I'm actually impressed they did as much as they did with all the cameos that they managed to get in there.

If you're wondering how to explain it in universe, remember only the Paragon's were aware of what actually happened, so all the missing characters were somewhere else doing something else and the Martian Manhunter hadn't gotten to them yet to pass on the memories of what occurred.

I actually thought the speed force bit in episode 4 was nicely done; and I liked how they handled The Spectere character during it. YMMV.

Do you read the comics? As someone who doesn't read the comics, I was trying to understand what was happening. They were in the speedforce, each paragon was in a specific memory, and what was Spectre?

 

[Reverend]

Calling it right now: Sara Diggle is making a comeback!

^Well at least I got something right!

...Well that and Earth's 1 & 38 merging, but I'm pretty sure most everyone saw that one coming. Kinda interested to see how this plays out in the rest of Supergirl's season. I mean Lex is alive again/never died, right? And now he runs the DEO? Kinda short circuits Lena's plot, no? Not that I'm complaining, that plot kinda needs short circuiting.

One complaint: John didn't get a visit from a ring....

 

[Dick Whitman]

One thing though, given Sara's convo with Barry, I was actually expecting it to end with the surprise return of Laurel Prime. I was actually a little surprised when it didn't.

We know Earth 2 Laurel appears in the Backdoor Pilot, But is she still from the same Earth 2 that now Stargirl, along with the JSA is on? The easiest thing would be have been to merge Laurel from Earth 1 and 2. Obviously a new history in which she survives and takes a dark turn as Black Siren but redeems herself.

How about Jay Garrick and Earth 3? Doubt they will go there but they could say Earth 2 and 3 merged as well. With Shipp guest appearing with the JSA.

Many questions on characters that were assumed to be involved and not at all. Elseworlds seemed to set up Dr Destiny and Psycho Pirate. PP is big part of the Crisis comic. Reverse Flash was teased since that show began but history was rewritten with the changed future Newspaper. Fans claimed he was in previews specific for this too though. I do not remember.

I guessing not enough time. It was crowded enough with what aired. Makes me wonder what was cut, if anything? Stuff is normally cut from any episode. With so much to cover, I bet little bits were. More than normal.

Obviously only Arrow is ending. Lots of time for some of these questions to be answered and missing characters to pop up in aftermath episodes.

 

[DigificWriter]

With Oliver having completely remade the universe, I think Laurel's Season 4 death may have been nullified, but we'll see.

 

[Professor Zoom]

I assume that Digificwriter predicted with certainty that there would be no merging.

Ah yes, he did, on December 8th.

there will be no admission of being wrong.

Edited to add: wow. He admitted it. Someone mark a calendar.

I’m glad they combined. Why not? Stories can still happen, they stories did happen even if they no longer did. It’s only going to be people who take it too seriously that will have a hard time. Much like when COIE was a comic. All this has happened before...

 

[Awesome Possum]

GLEEK!

 

[DigificWriter]

Several others also predicted that there wouldn't be a merger, including @Christopher.

 

[Aragorn]

I don't watch any of these shows but I do watch the crossover events. Does this merger fundamentally change the Black Lightning show?

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

I don't watch any of these shows but I do watch the crossover events. Does this merger fundamentally change the Black Lightning show?

Its is strongly suggested, and...

I'm not seeing how the merging of the Earths makes either Freeland's crisis with the ASA and Markovians or Supergirl's problems with Leviathan at all meaningless going forwards any differently than merging the worlds would affect Flash's problems with Bloodwork.

It makes it meaningless in a few, important ways: one, Jefferson is behaving like he had not a care in the world and he was attending some cosplayer convention. The world he comes from is in complete chaos, and nowhere near a resolution. Further, the ideology and genuine sociopolitical awareness of the Black Lightning series is so set apart in tone and direct message/effect from the CW-DC shows that the only way to merge it with the rest is to effectively destroy all that the Akils and Oz Scott worked so hard to bring to the filmed superhero concept--a unique voice that was its own and not shared by any other CW-DC show by any stretch of the imagination. Their work is threatened with being grafted to weaker content/characters and losing its purpose, and yes, it has its own purpose unlike any other CW-DC series.