Could Neelix' colony join the federation?

[Infern0]

would this be practical, they live apart as their own people, seperated from talax, and are self sustaining, but ultimatley vunerable.

if they joined the federation, starfleet could establish a presence nearby, slipstream allows for this, it could be "mutually beneficial" for starfleet to get a foot in the delta quadrant, and the talaxians get the protection and support of the federation

just throwing it out there as a hypothetical...

 

[GalaxyClass1701]

With slip stream starting to be used more I don't see why not.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

And perhaps they could help retake Talax itself. If Neelix, as a native Talaxian, asks for Federation help, this would be permissible under the Prime Directive. AFAIK.

 

[Soma]

Sure, they could join the Federation. However, they wouldn't contribute anything of value, as there are only a few hundred of them and they are technologically primitive.

 

[ProwlAlpha]

Thats not how the Federation works. As far as that was shown, any planet can petition to be a member of the Federation from planet like Kesprytt to a strategic planet like Bajor to a mineral rich planet like Coridan.

 

[BillJ]

If this ever becomes central premise of a TrekLit book... we'll know that it's the end of the line. I can think of about a thousand other loose ends that would be far more interesting to follow up on.

 

[Christopher]

If the Federation continues to explore the Delta Quadrant via slipstream, then having a "home" port in the quadrant would definitely be of value.

 

[Truth]

If the Federation continues to explore the Delta Quadrant via slipstream, then having a "home" port in the quadrant would definitely be of value.

Thats a great point and it would actually help his people. Startflleet could turn it into a base. That means shipping lanes, stores, places for the crews to eat off hours, dealing with starfleet other races would have to interact with the planet,, have would be come a major hub , of bussiness and trades, with any race wanting to do business with starfleet, plus they would have a constant protection force

 

[Sci]

Well, the thing to remember is that planets don't join the Federation; states (that is, the political association possessing the legal right to govern a territory, make binding law upon all citizens, and possessing the monopoly on the legitimate use of force) join the Federation. So, for instance, Vulcan is not, strictly speaking, a Federation Member; the Confederacy of Vulcan is a member. (Similarly, Rhode Island is not a state in the Union. The State of Rhode Island and Providence Plantations is a state in the Union.)

I suppose whether or not Neelix's colony could join the UFP as a Member would depend upon whether or not Federation Membership has an initial population requirement. It probably also depends on whether the colony is considered an independent and sovereign state in its own right or as territory of the Talaxian state.

If it's not Talaxian territory but is still not large enough to join the Federation as a Member, I'm sure the Federation would be willing to make the colony a protectorate.

 

[rfmcdpei]

Well, the thing to remember is that planets don't join the Federation; states (that is, the political association possessing the legal right to govern a territory, make binding law upon all citizens, and possessing the monopoly on the legitimate use of force) join the Federation. So, for instance, Vulcan is not, strictly speaking, a Federation Member; the Confederacy of Vulcan is a member. (Similarly, Rhode Island is not a state in the Union. The State of Rhode Island and Providence Plantations is a state in the Union.)

I suppose whether or not Neelix's colony could join the UFP as a Member would depend upon whether or not Federation Membership has an initial population requirement. It probably also depends on whether the colony is considered an independent and sovereign state in its own right or as territory of the Talaxian state.

If it's not Talaxian territory but is still not large enough to join the Federation as a Member, I'm sure the Federation would be willing to make the colony a protectorate.

The Talaxian state no longer exists, or if it does as a creature of the Haakonian Order.

Federation protectorate status is more likely than membership; Neelix's colony is very small and dependent, and certainly lacks the heft of the various planet-based states.

And I don't see the Federation getting involved in trying to free Talaxian civilization form the Haakonians: why would it do that? A military crusade on the far side of the Delta Quadrant is improbable for so many reasons.

 

[Christopher]

There's also the fact that the colony is way too far from Talaxian/Haakonian space to constitute an entity under its governance. It's independent simply by its location. (And don't get me started on how absurd it was to have Talaxians 40,000 light-years from their territory at all, which pretty much make a mockery of all the extraordinary leaps Voyager had to make to get that far. I tend to assume that the Talaxian colonists either made use of a Sikarian trajector -- 40 kly was the stated maximum range of that technology -- or found the Vaadwaur subspace corridors.)

 

[TerraUnam]

I thought the Voyager fleet might make Neelix's little station a "home port" of sorts and that would not be a surprise given what we have seen in the novels so far, anything else is pure speculation and frankly seems over the top at this point.

Plus as home port it gives the novels an excuse to keep revisiting Neelix as a character without straining credulity, which seems more important from a writing standpoint.

 

[Sci]

Well, the thing to remember is that planets don't join the Federation; states (that is, the political association possessing the legal right to govern a territory, make binding law upon all citizens, and possessing the monopoly on the legitimate use of force) join the Federation. So, for instance, Vulcan is not, strictly speaking, a Federation Member; the Confederacy of Vulcan is a member. (Similarly, Rhode Island is not a state in the Union. The State of Rhode Island and Providence Plantations is a state in the Union.)

I suppose whether or not Neelix's colony could join the UFP as a Member would depend upon whether or not Federation Membership has an initial population requirement. It probably also depends on whether the colony is considered an independent and sovereign state in its own right or as territory of the Talaxian state.

If it's not Talaxian territory but is still not large enough to join the Federation as a Member, I'm sure the Federation would be willing to make the colony a protectorate.

The Talaxian state no longer exists, or if it does as a creature of the Haakonian Order.

I'm afraid I never saw that early VOY episode -- was the Talaxian state actually dissolved and Talaxian territory annexed by the Haakonian Order, or does the Talaxian state continue to exist as as vassal state of the Order in, say, the way Vichy France (formally, the French State) continued to exist as a vassal state of the Third Reich?

And I don't see the Federation getting involved in trying to free Talaxian civilization form the Haakonians: why would it do that?

Indeed, the general Federation attitude seems to be that they won't get involved in occupation situations between foreign states -- Bajor, for instance, had to liberate itself on its lonesome before the Federation would intervene.

There's also the fact that the colony is way too far from Talaxian/Haakonian space to constitute an entity under its governance. It's independent simply by its location.

Well, sure, de facto. But it might be legally considered a territory of the Talaxian state on paper, even if that legal status doesn't reflect reality. I'm not saying it would, just that it's a possibility.

 

[Christopher]

I'm afraid I never saw that early VOY episode...

You really ought to. "Jetrel" is one of the best episodes of the series.

-- was the Talaxian state actually dissolved and Talaxian territory annexed by the Haakonian Order, or does the Talaxian state continue to exist as as vassal state of the Order in, say, the way Vichy France (formally, the French State) continued to exist as a vassal state of the Third Reich?

All that's been stated is that the Haakonians "conquered" Talax ("Jetrel"), that Talax "surrendered unconditionally" after the use of a weapon of mass destruction (ibid.), and that Talax is "controlled by the Haakonians" ("Homestead"). So it's ambiguous. "Conquer" can mean to acquire by force, but it can also mean to defeat or subdue. "Controlled" seems to imply something like Vichy France, that it's regulated from without but still exists as a separate entity, but that could just be the speaker's Talax-centric way of interpreting it, a refusal to admit that their nation has been subsumed. And for what it's worth, the backstory in "Jetrel" was a clear parallel for Japan's surrender after the atomic bombings in 1945, and Japan continued to exist as a distinct nation. For what it's worth.

Well, sure, de facto. But it might be legally considered a territory of the Talaxian state on paper, even if that legal status doesn't reflect reality. I'm not saying it would, just that it's a possibility.

I doubt the Talaxian state or the Haakonian Order even knows this colony exists. They're too far away to be in communication with them.

 

[Turbo]

Christopher, I hadn't thought of either of those two. They're much better than my theory; I'd figured it was a generation ship which found a wormhole Voyager missed. The Sikarian trajector actually makes a lot more sense.

I always thought that it would be logical for Neelix's colony to become a Federation outpost.

 

[timothy]

have yet to read destiny or typhon pact . But , I am assuming slipstream in star trek works the same as in andromeda . I don'nt see why they could'nt reach nelix's colony . also porterico is a protecterate of the us so is gaum on I believe the midway islands . unless we gave them back to Japan . I feel for them right now after the earth quake and sunami and there nucular problems . Now is the federation going to share slipstream with its allies the klingons or is it going to stay strickly within starfleet.

 

[Sci]

also porterico is a protecterate of the us so is gaum

No.

The Commonwealth of Puerto Rico -- not "Porterico" -- is an unincorporated organized territory of the United States. So is Guam. They are also referred to as insular areas.

The other insular areas include the Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana Islands, the United States Virgin Islands, and American Samoa. Though American Samoa is considered an unincorporated unorganized territory rather than an unincorporated organized territory. Aside from American Samoa, all of the citizens of Puerto Rico, Guam, the U.S. Virgin Islands, and the Northern Mariana Islands are United States citizens; American Samoans are considered U.S. nationals but not U.S. citizens.

on I believe the midway islands . unless we gave them back to Japan .

Guam is the largest island in the Mariana island chain and the largest island in the Micronesia region of the Pacific.

The Midway Islands are part of the Hawaiian archipelago and are a territory of the U.S. There are no permanent inhabitants.

None of these communities are protectorates. A protectorate, in modern international law, is a sovereign state which has entered into a voluntary relationship with a more powerful sovereign state who agrees to protect the weaker state in return for some agreed-upon obligation.

Examples of sovereign states which may reasonably be described as protectorates of the United States include the Republic of the Marshall Islands, the Federated States of Micronesia, and the Republic of Palau, all of which have entered compacts of free association with the United States.

I feel for them right now after the earth quake and sunami and there nucular problems . Now is the federation going to share slipstream with its allies the klingons or is it going to stay strickly within starfleet.

The Federation isn't sharing slipstream with anyone, as established in Typhon Pact: Zero Sum Game by David Mack.

 

[DimesDan]

I'm afraid I never saw that early VOY episode...

You really ought to. "Jetrel" is one of the best episodes of the series.

In your opinion yes, in some others, like myself, it may make my top twenty-five episodes of Voyager, I certainly wouldn't say it was in my top ten though.

 

[Infern0]

lol @ portorico

anyway, i think this should be incoreperated into the next voyager book that comes out.

Whoever is writing it can pay me 10% royalties.

thanks.

 

[DimesDan]

lol @ portorico

anyway, i think this should be incoreperated into the next voyager book that comes out.

Whoever is writing it can pay me 10% royalties.

thanks.

Okaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay.

That's kind of taking the piss don't you think.

Yes, 10% of not much is still not much, but the writers come on here because they are fans first and foremost and like to discuss what is going on in Trek Lit.

It's also one of the rules of this section that you don't say story ideas and you seriously don't come up with a dickish post like this.