Could Anakin's Fall to the Dark Side Have Been Done Better?
- Thread starter VulcanMindBlown
- Start date
Dude. I really, REALLY hope you are trolling us with that reply. Even were Anakin deranged enough to consider such an idea, even for a moment - which he wouldn't have been even after putting on the mask - he would have saved her life only to permanently lose her love. Which would be pretty much the same thing to him as her dying. Obi-Wan's appearance on the ramp was just the spark that ignited the 'If I can't have you, no one will' fuel that she just poured all over him.
The implication of Obi-Wan/Padme sleeping around on Anakin didn't make it past the end of production for precisely the reasons you're outlining. There was no way in the last act of the film to establish that Anakin/Vader knew the affair story was BS and that the child was his.
And if you think for one split-second that Anakin would accept Padme sleeping with anyone but him, for any reason, you didn't understand thing one about him.
Even were Anakin deranged enough to consider such an idea, even for a moment - which he wouldn't have been even after putting on the mask - he would have saved her life only to permanently lose her love. Which would be pretty much the same thing to him as her dying. Obi-Wan's appearance on the ramp was just the spark that ignited the 'If I can't have you, no one will' fuel that she just poured all over him.
The implication of Obi-Wan/Padme sleeping around on Anakin didn't make it past the end of production for precisely the reasons you're outlining. There was no way in the last act of the film to establish that Anakin/Vader knew the affair story was BS and that the child was his.
And if you think for one split-second that Anakin would accept Padme sleeping with anyone but him, for any reason, you didn't understand thing one about him.
Anikan was crazy from too much love in his heart like an idiot teenager who makes stupid decisions because he doesn't understand the pain that will come because of his awful decisions. I was channelling a 19 year old boy who doesn't want to stop knocking boots with his smoking hot 25 year old lover who knows how to push allllllll his buttons.
Did I imagine Anikan accusing Obi-Wan of making time with Padme? It's been ten years, or longer, since I last saw Revenge of the Sith, because it is awful, so god damned awful.
Things that could have happened to Anikan because he got married, if he hadn't pulled the Jedi down rather than being caught beging a naughty boy.
1. Defrocked.
2. Defrocked and force castrated.
3. Defrocked and executed.
4. Defrocked and force castrated, so he can't turn into a force ghost after he's executed.
4. High fives all round, because she is so out of his league, and then they cut his hands off and blind him.
But what about Padme? What are the consequences of a Senator being in love with a Jedi, having sex with a Jedi and making a baby with a Jedi?
Was she going to be kicked out of the Senate, be fined, mindwiped or executed? Her children, as abominations (2nd generation Jedi were too powerful. 3rd or fourth, forgettabout-it. This had to be like the Psi Corps, a regulation put in place by the non force users to make sure that these magic superhumans did not rise up and take over.) were going to be executed, and if not executed, then definitely taken into Jedi training and neither parent would see Luke and Leia again for perhaps decades. Can parents say "no" to jedi training? It feels more like mandatory conscription than a choice, and a parent is going to get broken arms if they try to keep their kid.
Where was I?
Wealthy and powerful Amidalla, as Space Anthony Weiner... Space (Kevin) Spacey (the age difference!) had far more to lose if their relationship came to light than, the monk with a vow of poverty throwing himself into suicidal situations constantly, even if he was going to be executed, and she wasn't, because Padme had space cruisers, castles, pretty dresses and state dinners. Her life is a thousand time better than Anikans' just because of how much better her sheets and pillows are than the staple sack cloth found at the Jedi Temple.
That being said, I will always pick a mother over the unborn baby, if it comes down to a medical choice because you can always make more babies, or find more babies. So I was advocating for an abortion to happen right after his prophecy dream that Padme will not survive childbirth, which was weeks or months before the final due date, rather than leaving the abortion to 5 minutes before a natural birth, where everything went so horribly wrong.
He did understand (eventually) 'it would destroy us,' and he backed down. Had Padme herself not had a change of heart, he would have resigned himself to a celibate life as a Jedi.
Had he been caught, he'd have certainly been expelled from the Order. As for Force-castrated or killed... well, at that point, he was probably too powerful already for all but the entire Jedi Council together to take on, which would certainly have pushed him all the way into darkness and brought about the nightmare scenario they so wanted to avoid if they failed to kill him.
For Padme, it would have been a major galactic scandal and the certain end of her Senate career. Which, at that point, she was probably about ready to walk away from anyway. If she didn't want her children trained, though, the Jedi wouldn't have been able to do much about it; even a disgraced former Queen/Senator would have enough clout to block an outright abduction, which could only end in a PR disaster (and punishment by the Chancellor/Senate) for the Jedi Order.
As for abortion, forget it. In addition to what I already said above, Padme wouldn't have considered it for an instant. She was very family oriented, and had yearned to have kids prior to marrying Anakin. "Ani. I…I know being a father is still so new to you. But if you were in my shoes…if you’d felt this new life inside you, growing inside you…you’d do anything to protect it. Even give up your own life."
Had he been caught, he'd have certainly been expelled from the Order. As for Force-castrated or killed... well, at that point, he was probably too powerful already for all but the entire Jedi Council together to take on, which would certainly have pushed him all the way into darkness and brought about the nightmare scenario they so wanted to avoid if they failed to kill him.
For Padme, it would have been a major galactic scandal and the certain end of her Senate career. Which, at that point, she was probably about ready to walk away from anyway. If she didn't want her children trained, though, the Jedi wouldn't have been able to do much about it; even a disgraced former Queen/Senator would have enough clout to block an outright abduction, which could only end in a PR disaster (and punishment by the Chancellor/Senate) for the Jedi Order.
As for abortion, forget it. In addition to what I already said above, Padme wouldn't have considered it for an instant. She was very family oriented, and had yearned to have kids prior to marrying Anakin. "Ani. I…I know being a father is still so new to you. But if you were in my shoes…if you’d felt this new life inside you, growing inside you…you’d do anything to protect it. Even give up your own life."
Consent?
Anikan can abort foetuses with his mind, leaving no evidence.
Anikan was not a good person.
He had to save her.
No matter what.
If Annie had thought of filicide, I doubt if he would have checked his moral compass to end Luke and Leia, or to kill Luke and Leia without asking Amidalla her opinion, because preserving their love story was more important than (literally) the universe burning down, so if those two tadpoles were going to get between him and the wife, they got what they deserved: Popping air bubbles in their brains, put there by their father's force.
Although, if Anikan had asked Padme, and she said "no, I don't believe in abortion" or some other equally martyring cry, Anikan would have cleaned her memories and asked again, and again, until he realised that she maybe wasn't of a mind to... Why am I assuming that Padme wouldn't abort her kids to save her own life? I mean, any sane person would chose their own life over a child that spends his spare time murdering little desert critters. And if Padme had lived long enough to see Darth Vader... She might have just shot her children dead, because he is the worst.
Look at the numbers.
If Anikan had aborted 2 foetuses with his mind, without mentioning it to his wife, he wouldn't have carved into dozens of 4 year olds with his light sabre littering a Jedi playground with miniature charred corpse segments.
2 foetuses now, or 2 score toddling younglings, begging for their lives, in a few months?
It's a no brainer.
Anikan can abort foetuses with his mind, leaving no evidence.
Anikan was not a good person.
He had to save her.
No matter what.
If Annie had thought of filicide, I doubt if he would have checked his moral compass to end Luke and Leia, or to kill Luke and Leia without asking Amidalla her opinion, because preserving their love story was more important than (literally) the universe burning down, so if those two tadpoles were going to get between him and the wife, they got what they deserved: Popping air bubbles in their brains, put there by their father's force.
Although, if Anikan had asked Padme, and she said "no, I don't believe in abortion" or some other equally martyring cry, Anikan would have cleaned her memories and asked again, and again, until he realised that she maybe wasn't of a mind to... Why am I assuming that Padme wouldn't abort her kids to save her own life? I mean, any sane person would chose their own life over a child that spends his spare time murdering little desert critters. And if Padme had lived long enough to see Darth Vader... She might have just shot her children dead, because he is the worst.
Look at the numbers.
If Anikan had aborted 2 foetuses with his mind, without mentioning it to his wife, he wouldn't have carved into dozens of 4 year olds with his light sabre littering a Jedi playground with miniature charred corpse segments.
2 foetuses now, or 2 score toddling younglings, begging for their lives, in a few months?
It's a no brainer.
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Padme would know. She couldn't be certain, of course. But a convenient miscarriage happening so late in the game*, right after Anakin suggests abortion and she shoots it down... that'd be the beginning of the end of their marriage, right there. And as we saw firsthand, Anakin would rather kill Padme himself than let her walk away from him.
That's assuming something didn't go horribly wrong during the 'abortion' itself, of course. That does happen, y'know.
This is the last I'm saying on this subject, as I sense it drifting into territory that doesn't befit the thread or the forum.
* I know she said Anakin had been gone six months, but c'mon... she's full term or just about. Had to be, for the children to be born without additional preemie care that would have put their respective trips to Alderaan and Tatooine off for months Obi-Wan and Yoda couldn't afford.
That's assuming something didn't go horribly wrong during the 'abortion' itself, of course. That does happen, y'know.
This is the last I'm saying on this subject, as I sense it drifting into territory that doesn't befit the thread or the forum.
* I know she said Anakin had been gone six months, but c'mon... she's full term or just about. Had to be, for the children to be born without additional preemie care that would have put their respective trips to Alderaan and Tatooine off for months Obi-Wan and Yoda couldn't afford.
You are really not understanding how far gone I think Anikan is, by reading the words I am saying.
He does not ask permission.
With his mind, he snaps both babies necks.
Then he Jedi Mind tricks his wife into believing that nothing is suspicious, if necessary, as it is necessary.
Foolproof.
Padme Amidalla Skywalker dies of natural causes in her 80s, a bitter childless prune.
Double kiddycide is a walk in the park compared to becoming Sith, putting an evil Sith into absolute power, enslaving the galaxy and personally executing 10s of thousands of Jedi across the galaxy.
Or...
What about warning his younger self?
Jedi can see the future.
Palpatine was clouding the Future, the Jedi council saw nothing, but surely if you know what you (yourself) look for in the future per say, then you can create a flare, a future so abrasive that it can't help but attract the line of sight from a younger version of yourself, even if you're "photobombing" moments you know that you did look at as a young man... Immediately changing those events you saw, as well as the past when you were looking at a new future, if you can conjugate how dark your timeline is.
But what would Old Anikan say to Young Annie half way through Phantom Menace?
How about "Don't bang the princess!" or "Don't trust the old man!"?
If a first class medical droid got a good look at her babies, or she gave even close to a full history, then they are going to know that the senator has taken a jedi for a lover, so Padme must be punished, the children must be taken to a penal colony, of a distant temple, and the father as soon as he is found will be executed.
The kids may have killed her, because Amidalla had foregone healthcare entirely to keep her secret, which if you think about it, could be considered criminal negligence, and the children should have been seized by the government from such a terrible mother, if she had survived, even if they were not magic prophecy twins with illegal DNA.
He does not ask permission.
With his mind, he snaps both babies necks.
Then he Jedi Mind tricks his wife into believing that nothing is suspicious, if necessary, as it is necessary.
Foolproof.
Padme Amidalla Skywalker dies of natural causes in her 80s, a bitter childless prune.
Double kiddycide is a walk in the park compared to becoming Sith, putting an evil Sith into absolute power, enslaving the galaxy and personally executing 10s of thousands of Jedi across the galaxy.
Or...
What about warning his younger self?
Jedi can see the future.
Palpatine was clouding the Future, the Jedi council saw nothing, but surely if you know what you (yourself) look for in the future per say, then you can create a flare, a future so abrasive that it can't help but attract the line of sight from a younger version of yourself, even if you're "photobombing" moments you know that you did look at as a young man... Immediately changing those events you saw, as well as the past when you were looking at a new future, if you can conjugate how dark your timeline is.
But what would Old Anikan say to Young Annie half way through Phantom Menace?
How about "Don't bang the princess!" or "Don't trust the old man!"?
If a first class medical droid got a good look at her babies, or she gave even close to a full history, then they are going to know that the senator has taken a jedi for a lover, so Padme must be punished, the children must be taken to a penal colony, of a distant temple, and the father as soon as he is found will be executed.
The kids may have killed her, because Amidalla had foregone healthcare entirely to keep her secret, which if you think about it, could be considered criminal negligence, and the children should have been seized by the government from such a terrible mother, if she had survived, even if they were not magic prophecy twins with illegal DNA.
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There are a trio of vids on YouTube about "What if Episode 1/2/3 Had Been Good?" which are only about 15 minutes long for each of them, but tells a far more interesting story with far better character development and a more interesting fall to the Dark Side for Anakin (as well as actually telling a continuing story not filled with the fan service and plot holes of the filmed prequels). After watching them, I now accept them as the actual events for the rise and fall of Anakin Skywalker.
