Cosmos - With Neil deGrasse Tyson

[JarodRussell]

The music is part Trek, part Contact (the movie based on Carl Sagan's novel). There are entire musical passages lifted intact from that movie (yes, I've seen it that many times that I can recognize the music).

A GREAT sci-fi movie... I hadn't seen it till about a year ago (if you can believe it). Love everything about that movie.

Have you read the book? There are some rather interesting changes in some of the characterizations and the plot.

The infinite scope of the universe and the vast depth of time really make all our problems on Earth look absurd.

I love our Sun.

I'm curious as to what our world will be like one billion years from now, when the Sun gains 10% more luminosity. I figure "hot" will be an understatement.

I read a book a few years ago about Earth's fate as the sun expands. At that point IIRC the Earth is a dead planet, life is long gone and the oceans have evaporated. I think the book said that Earth only has around 400 million years left before the sun becomes too hot for life. Although by that time Mars will have warmed up and we could live there for a while.

We should figure out a way to terraform it, then - at least enough for an atmosphere and ozone layer.

Am I the only one who thinks that 400 MILLION years is a long time ahead? Dinosaurs went extinct 65 million years ago. Homos have been barely here for 1-2 million years.

Oh, and no modern civilization has lasted longer than 1000 years on average.

 

[Amaris]

That was a great episode. Our Sun is a good egg, I don't think we're grateful enough.

Agreed. And considering that some day we're all going to end up together in the same cloud of interstellar dust, it makes a lot of current stuff going on around the world seem awfully petty.

The infinite scope of the universe and the vast depth of time really make all our problems on Earth look absurd.

I love our Sun.

I'm curious as to what our world will be like one billion years from now, when the Sun gains 10% more luminosity. I figure "hot" will be an understatement.

I read a book a few years ago about Earth's fate as the sun expands. At that point IIRC the Earth is a dead planet, life is long gone and the oceans have evaporated. I think the book said that Earth only has around 400 million years left before the sun becomes too hot for life. Although by that time Mars will have warmed up and we could live there for a while.

Ooh, I wasn't even thinking about Mars. You wouldn't happen to remember the name of that book, would you?

 

[Christopher]

Mike Rowe? Hell, no! I like Mike Rowe, but narrating this? No. Neil does a fantastic job, and is a worthy successor to Sagan. Mike's a good guy, but Neil actually understands the physics underneath his narration, just as Carl did. No, no, Neil does just fine.

More to the point, Tyson is a) an actual astrophysicist, and thus works in the same field as Sagan, and b) was a protege of Sagan's. And of course he's one of the co-developers of this series. He's not just someone they hired to read the words.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Tyson ... was a protege of Sagan's.

I've seen you say this before, Christopher, but I'm not sure that "protege" is the right word to describe their relationship. Tyson didn't study with Sagan, and I'm not clear that they ever even worked together. I can sort of see how you're getting "protege" from their relationship -- Sagan clearly had an interest in the young Tyson, and Tyson met him as a teen when he was still sorting out his direction in life -- yet I think the word connotes a much closer relationship than that.

 

[Forbin]

My takeaway from tonight's show is that I can actually name a shuttlecraft "Payne" and tell people it's named after a notable scientist and not myself.

But seriously folks, I absolutely loved this ep. Stellar science presented as poetry. Just beautiful. And I loved the moment Tyson seemed to realize he'd better sit down before the hypernova went off.

Oh, and, all those myths explaining the Pleiades seemed just as plausible to me as your basic Judeo-Christian creation myths. Also, appropos of absolutely nothing, I have a picture of the Pleiades on my car. It's a Subaru.

 

[Timewalker]

Years ago, in one of his science essays, Isaac Asimov mentioned a mnemonic device to remember the order of the stellar categories:

"Oh, Be A Fine Girl/Guy, Kiss Me!"

 

[Christopher]

Tyson ... was a protege of Sagan's.

I've seen you say this before, Christopher, but I'm not sure that "protege" is the right word to describe their relationship. Tyson didn't study with Sagan, and I'm not clear that they ever even worked together. I can sort of see how you're getting "protege" from their relationship -- Sagan clearly had an interest in the young Tyson, and Tyson met him as a teen when he was still sorting out his direction in life -- yet I think the word connotes a much closer relationship than that.

Yeah, I hesitated to use that word for just that reason. But Wikipedia quotes Tyson as calling Sagan a mentor, and the counterpart of that is a protege, so I went with it.

Also, appropos of absolutely nothing, I have a picture of the Pleiades on my car. It's a Subaru.

Yup. Subaru is the Japanese name for the Pleiades. The company is called that because it was the merger of seven smaller companies (seven "stars").

Years ago, in one of his science essays, Isaac Asimov mentioned a mnemonic device to remember the order of the stellar categories:

"Oh, Be A Fine Girl/Guy, Kiss Me!"

And Annie Jump Cannon was the one who invented that mnemonic! (Although it was just "Girl" at the time.)

 

[Awesome Possum]

Agreed. And considering that some day we're all going to end up together in the same cloud of interstellar dust, it makes a lot of current stuff going on around the world seem awfully petty.

The infinite scope of the universe and the vast depth of time really make all our problems on Earth look absurd.

I love our Sun.

I'm curious as to what our world will be like one billion years from now, when the Sun gains 10% more luminosity. I figure "hot" will be an understatement.

I read a book a few years ago about Earth's fate as the sun expands. At that point IIRC the Earth is a dead planet, life is long gone and the oceans have evaporated. I think the book said that Earth only has around 400 million years left before the sun becomes too hot for life. Although by that time Mars will have warmed up and we could live there for a while.

Ooh, I wasn't even thinking about Mars. You wouldn't happen to remember the name of that book, would you?

The Life and Death of Planet Earth

 

[Amaris]

Thank you, sir.

 

[Forbin]

Also, appropos of absolutely nothing, I have a picture of the Pleiades on my car. It's a Subaru.

Yup. Subaru is the Japanese name for the Pleiades. The company is called that because it was the merger of seven smaller companies (seven "stars").

Ah! I knew the first half of that, but not the last. Interesting.

 

[Yanks]

This show, while I'm enjoying it and will not miss an episode, pales in comparison to Carl Sagan's show.

It's not the content or the visuals, it's the narration.

Carl's narration was what made the show...

They would have done much better not choosing Tyson.

The "Dirty jobs" guy would have been much much better.

Neil is so hard to listen too...

The music is very well done. I hear some "trek" in there...

Mike Rowe? Hell, no! I like Mike Rowe, but narrating this? No. Neil does a fantastic job, and is a worthy successor to Sagan. Mike's a good guy, but Neil actually understands the physics underneath his narration, just as Carl did. No, no, Neil does just fine.

I have nothing against Mike. (almost typed Mike Tyson )

Being a worthy successor should have NOTHING to do with being picked to narrate.

Mike Rowe or Morgan Freeman would have been far superior choices.

Carl Sagan was great not because he understood everything, but because he was great to listen to.

 

[Mudd]

Obviously it should have been Morgan Freeman.

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2BzLf2jwIM[/yt]

 

[Timewalker]

I'd prefer that a real astronomer host astronomy shows.

 

[Amaris]

I have nothing against Mike. (almost typed Mike Tyson )

Being a worthy successor should have NOTHING to do with being picked to narrate.

Mike Rowe or Morgan Freeman would have been far superior choices.

Carl Sagan was great not because he understood everything, but because he was great to listen to.

I feel that Neil is an excellent storyteller. He's not Sagan, but then only Sagan could be Sagan. They are two completely different men, but even so, Neil's passion is just as strong as Carl's, he just expresses it a bit differently. Being a worthy successor has everything to do with who does the narration, unless you're fine with Snookie narrating Cosmos.

Obviously it should have been Morgan Freeman.

Well, yeah, but Morgan Freeman could narrate the phone book, and the show would have ten million viewers its first night.

I'd prefer that a real astronomer host astronomy shows.

I feel the same way. Someone who understands the subject matter should narrate the story. I want to know that the guy who is telling me about the wonders of the universe has the same appreciation for that universe, and isn't just in it for the paycheck.

 

[auntiehill]

^ I completely agree. I really enjoy Cosmos, and a lot of that is down to the narrator. I think he does a wonderful job presenting the material; he not only knows what he's talking about but he cares about it, passionately, and that's really refreshing to see.

 

[Christopher]

Being a worthy successor should have NOTHING to do with being picked to narrate.

See, that's the flaw in your assumptions right there. He wasn't "picked to narrate." He's one of the co-creators of the show, one of the people responsible for its content and ideas. He's an actual scientist and educator who's qualified to speak about these subjects. He's not just some pretty face they hired to recite a script.

The original Cosmos was subtitled A Personal Journey. Sagan wasn't just the host or the narrator, he was a scientist sharing his own experience with science, what it meant to him, what it made him feel and inspired him to wonder about, how it informed his hopes and fears for the future. It was an expression of his philosophy and his humanity, and that was its true power. If they'd made a sequel that just hired some actor to recite words written by someone else, it wouldn't have been anything like the same sort of show. It wouldn't have been Cosmos, it would've been Through the Wormhole or Scientific American Frontiers or whatever.

In order for this to be Cosmos rather than Generic Science Show, it has to be an actual astrophysicist and educator speaking to us from his own experiences and knowledge, expressing what science means to him -- making it personal, and thereby showing us how the study of the cosmos is relevant to us as individuals. And that's what we're getting. Tyson is a well-known science popularizer and advocate, probably the most famous and successful scientist/popularizer in the US since Sagan himself, and the ideas he talks about on the show, while including a lot that comes from Sagan through Druyan and Soter, are extensions of the kind of public lecturing and science advocacy he's been involved in for many years.

 

[Yanks]

I feel that Neil is an excellent storyteller. He's not Sagan, but then only Sagan could be Sagan. They are two completely different men, but even so, Neil's passion is just as strong as Carl's, he just expresses it a bit differently. Being a worthy successor has everything to do with who does the narration, unless you're fine with Snookie narrating Cosmos.

I list Morgan Freeman and Mike Rowe and you list Snookie?

Obviously it should have been Morgan Freeman.

Well, yeah, but Morgan Freeman could narrate the phone book, and the show would have ten million viewers its first night.

All the more reason to hire him or another expert in that field. I'm sure he doesn't understand Astro-physics anymore than you or I and we all can agree he would do a much better job.

I'd prefer that a real astronomer host astronomy shows.

^ I completely agree. I really enjoy Cosmos, and a lot of that is down to the narrator. I think he does a wonderful job presenting the material; he not only knows what he's talking about but he cares about it, passionately, and that's really refreshing to see.

Not disputing his passion, and of course not his expertise and I'm enjoying the show as well, but his skills as a narrator are lacking.

Being a worthy successor should have NOTHING to do with being picked to narrate.

See, that's the flaw in your assumptions right there. He wasn't "picked to narrate." He's one of the co-creators of the show, one of the people responsible for its content and ideas. He's an actual scientist and educator who's qualified to speak about these subjects. He's not just some pretty face they hired to recite a script.

The original Cosmos was subtitled A Personal Journey. Sagan wasn't just the host or the narrator, he was a scientist sharing his own experience with science, what it meant to him, what it made him feel and inspired him to wonder about, how it informed his hopes and fears for the future. It was an expression of his philosophy and his humanity, and that was its true power. If they'd made a sequel that just hired some actor to recite words written by someone else, it wouldn't have been anything like the same sort of show. It wouldn't have been Cosmos, it would've been Through the Wormhole or Scientific American Frontiers or whatever.

In order for this to be Cosmos rather than Generic Science Show, it has to be an actual astrophysicist and educator speaking to us from his own experiences and knowledge, expressing what science means to him -- making it personal, and thereby showing us how the study of the cosmos is relevant to us as individuals. And that's what we're getting. Tyson is a well-known science popularizer and advocate, probably the most famous and successful scientist/popularizer in the US since Sagan himself, and the ideas he talks about on the show, while including a lot that comes from Sagan through Druyan and Soter, are extensions of the kind of public lecturing and science advocacy he's been involved in for many years.

I see your opinion as a flaw and the reason this show isn't watched by a gazillion folks each week. .... and the reason that it won't be treasured like Carl's was.

I can appreciate all his input, and still understand that he doesn't need to tell the story for it to be true. 9and all of it isn't true)

Are you all saying that Shatner understood all the science behind TOS?

Are you saying that Morgan Freeman undertands everything he narrates in "Through the Wormhole"?

This could have been bigger and better.

But maybe the content is holding it back. The first episode contained falsehoods about Bruno. There is a "evolution v creationism" feel to it that dumbs it down.

Carl Sagan (and Tyson for that matter) deserves better. I Loved his shows as a kid. He did not talk down to you but had a certain poetic way about him that spoke to you. He did not pit one group against another, he gave us science with a passion and let the facts do the talking. I've watched all the episodes of MF-TTWH and they covered everything under the sun, from God to the big bang and never got the feeling that I was being force fed propganda.

Once I see this, I'll never want to see it again. Can't say that about Carl's or many others. I still enjoy watching those shows. You don't need modern CGI etc. to sell science. Which is what this show should be doing.

It's probably a Brandon Braga thing...

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I would probably still be watching the show if Morgan Freeman was the narrator.

 

[tomalak301]

I think I might be done with the show. I'm finding myself bored with it, even though I enjoyed the first 4 episodes, especially the one talking about Blackholes. Still, every episode now I find myself wandering and I don't know if it's Tyson or just the subject matter, but it's gotten boring now.

 

[AgentCoop]

I think he's a great actor, but if I hear one more person say that Morgan Freeman should narrate virtually EVERYTHING under the sun I may shoot myself. Enough already.

If Sagan's series didn't seem as politicized as the new one, perhaps it's because it was the product of an earlier time. If Sagan were alive today, maybe he'd be a bit less tactful out of sheer necessity.

As far as accusations of "propaganda" are concerned? Bring on the "propaganda". I applaud Tyson, Braga, Druyan, MacFarlane and everyone else involved for not backing down in fear of "offending" certain people.