Children in Restaurants.

[Miss Chicken]

I didn't use the words 'family friendly' - I said burger joint. I do not know of any establishment that would fit the definition of a burger joint which is

Any establishment, major chain or independent, that primarily serves burgers and fries.

that isn't a fast-food restaurant.

 

[Jan]

Sorry, Miss N Thrope that was a general post, not directed at anything you'd said.

Jan

 

[Miss Chicken]

Sorry, Miss N Thrope that was a general post, not directed at anything you'd said.

Jan

Thanks for clarifying that. I am sorry I misunderstood.

 

[LeahBoBo]

I didn't use the words 'family friendly' - I said burger joint. I do not know of any establishment that would fit the definition of a burger joint which is

Any establishment, major chain or independent, that primarily serves burgers and fries.

that isn't a fast-food restaurant.

You know if I went to Chuck-E-Cheese's or someplace that caters to kids, I'd have no room to bitch and I wouldn't. That said, what difference does it make where I dine or what they serve? A restaurant is a place to sit down, eat, and enjoy the company of your companions. I'm sure that even the "family friendly" establishment doesn't include: annoying the fuck out of everyone around your table in the definition. And if they do, let me know so I NEVER go there.

If some parents can't be bothered to teach their kids boundaries, manners and social skills, then they don't deserve to eat outside of their homes. Ever. Being "curious" and "a kid" doesn't excuse inappropriate behavior in public or, give parents a pass on not taking responsibility for their offspring.

 

[Trekker4747]

You can't determine 'family friendly' from a menu or even a chain affiliation alone. Where I live, pretty much every restaurant is presumed to be family friendly if the price per person is less than around $100 (not including alcohol). That's because I live near Disney World. The same chains in other places would very much not welcome children.

As for kids looking over partitions or through the bars on the backs of chairs, kids are curious. One might almost say that's their job, to become aware of the world around them and learn about it. That's not being rude, it's only natural to them. So as one person mentioned, letting the host/ess know that they'd prefer to not have children near where they're seated is the best idea. Depending on the restaurant, that may mean you'll be seated in the bar but there won't be kids to bother you.

Jan

Or, you know, the parent could tell their moppet to turn around and eat and that what they are doing is rude.

 

[Major Chord]

Generally, the more I (or someone else pays) for my meal, the more behaved I expect the patrons of the restaurant to be. If I'm at McDonalds, and there are kids there, oh well. I sit away from them, that way they're not tempted to bug m. If they do, I'll put up with them for a while, as long as they're well behaved. Nothing wrong with a kid politely coming up to me and starting a conversation. If he comes up to me and starts stealing my food, or something, yeah, I'll get pissed, and either let the parent or manager know. If a kid I don't know has touched my food, I'll probably ask for another meal (don't know where those hands have been...and I'm a germaphobe anyway). That's worst case scenario though. A kid looking at me from across the room doesn't bother me at all.

At a more expensive restaurant, again, same thing. As long as they don't come up to my table and bug me, I could care less. I'd hope that if they're in a "fancier" place like this that they'd stay at their table with their family, and don't cause a whole lot of noise, although at most places like that it's already loud, so the extra noise doesn't really matter. I still prefer to be seated away from younger children, just in case one i decides to act up though. Once the price starts to climb above like, 15-20 bucks a plate, then I want to enjoy the meal with the people I'm with, with no distractions, adult or children, so I'm much less forgiving.

I don't know if it's coming across, but I generally don't mind children, as long as they're well behaved. What's cute on family videos at home in the kitchen isn't necessarily cute nor proper in public places. Since parents will often use cheaper places like McDonalds to teach their children how to act, I have the lowest expectations there.

And if a kid does bother me, I don't get mad at them, it's the parent I look at to discipline their offspring. The kid doesn't know any better.

 

[Amaris]

^ Exactly. Kids will be kids. That's why they're kids (if that makes sense). I'm the same way. I love kids and as long as they're behaved, I'll goof off around them, listen to their jokes and so on. If they're stealing food, throwing things or otherwise incurring my wrath, then I talk to the parents directly. I do not expect children to be present in 100+ dollar per person establishments. That's too much money for a child to knock my food off my plate and run off like a banshee.

J.

 

[Jan]

You can't determine 'family friendly' from a menu or even a chain affiliation alone. Where I live, pretty much every restaurant is presumed to be family friendly if the price per person is less than around $100 (not including alcohol). That's because I live near Disney World. The same chains in other places would very much not welcome children.

As for kids looking over partitions or through the bars on the backs of chairs, kids are curious. One might almost say that's their job, to become aware of the world around them and learn about it. That's not being rude, it's only natural to them. So as one person mentioned, letting the host/ess know that they'd prefer to not have children near where they're seated is the best idea. Depending on the restaurant, that may mean you'll be seated in the bar but there won't be kids to bother you.

Jan

Or, you know, the parent could tell their moppet to turn around and eat and that what they are doing is rude.

If the child insists on talking to you or, as somebody upthread mentioned, saying "Hi" incessantly, yes, that's rude and intrusive. Simply looking and maybe waving as many children do is *not* rude. You may not appreciate it, that's your choice, but it's not rude, it's being open and friendly. Have a book or something to take your attention away.

Jan

 

[Trekker4747]

See? This is the problem. Parents these days don't want to teach their kids manners and boundaries. "Oh he's a kid, he doesn't know any better!" "Oh, he's just being friendly!" "Oh, you just hate kids! He's just being cute!"

No, sorry.

Teach your kid to keep his butt planted on the seat and looking at his family/food, not crawling around looking at strangers trying to have a meal.

 

[Amaris]

Oh, I've seen little kids poke their heads over dividers and it's never bothered me one bit. I remember one time I watched out of the corner of my eye, a little sandy haired girl, probably 3 or 4, poke her head above the divider in the booth next to mine and whispered so quietly I barely heard it, this little "Hello", and I saw her smile this big gap toothed grin and wave just ever so slightly at me. It was adorable. I looked up, smiled and waved back. She ducked below the divider line and I heard a little giggle.

J.

 

[Maestro]

I've been having a little personal nostalgia with my sister today. She posted a picture of her nine-week-old son and I commented on how much he looks like our Grandpa Ken.

When little kids would turn around at church to look around or turn around in their booths in a restaurant, and look at him, Grandpa Ken would smile warmly and then make silly faces back.

My Grandpa Ken was one of the nicest, kind-hearted peopled ever to live. Rather than be a cantankerous old man, and certainly between his decades of military service and his health he might very well have felt compelled to be towards kids, he always had a soft spot in his heart for them.

When he died, my Dad told me that he was going to try to be more like his Dad, especially in how he raised his own kids.

There was a lot of wisdom in that statement. Maybe some of you should try to be more like my Grandpa Ken and smile at a little kid looking out at his world. Maybe you'd be a little less cantankerous yourself.

 

[Ward Fowler]

^ That's a nice story, it really is. I'm sure your grandpa was a great guy. But it's hard for me to smile warmly when some strangers kid is screaming as loud as they can while rolling in the floor in a public place. I had to deal with that just day before yesterday. It's also hard to have soft spot for some strange kid running as fast as he can in the mall who ends running into me from behind and nearly knocking me down, as happened last year. I guess what I'm saying is, it depends on the kid.

 

[Jan]

See? This is the problem. Parents these days don't want to teach their kids manners and boundaries. "Oh he's a kid, he doesn't know any better!" "Oh, he's just being friendly!" "Oh, you just hate kids! He's just being cute!"

No, sorry.

Teach your kid to keep his butt planted on the seat and looking at his family/food, not crawling around looking at strangers trying to have a meal.

*You* be sure not to look over any dividers or look around at any other tables, too, now. After all, it's just plain rude and your parents should have taught you not to look at anything but your plate.

Jan

 

[Miss Chicken]

I didn't use the words 'family friendly' - I said burger joint. I do not know of any establishment that would fit the definition of a burger joint which is

Any establishment, major chain or independent, that primarily serves burgers and fries.

that isn't a fast-food restaurant.

You know if I went to Chuck-E-Cheese's or someplace that caters to kids, I'd have no room to bitch and I wouldn't. That said, what difference does it make where I dine or what they serve? A restaurant is a place to sit down, eat, and enjoy the company of your companions. I'm sure that even the "family friendly" establishment doesn't include: annoying the fuck out of everyone around your table in the definition. And if they do, let me know so I NEVER go there.

If some parents can't be bothered to teach their kids boundaries, manners and social skills, then they don't deserve to eat outside of their homes. Ever. Being "curious" and "a kid" doesn't excuse inappropriate behavior in public or, give parents a pass on not taking responsibility for their offspring.

I do not expect two year olds to have the same manners that one would expect from a 6 year old, or a 10 year old. A two year old is barely more than a baby and it isn't easy to explain manners to them, yet alone expect them to have come anywhere near close to mastering them.

A two year old staring at you should not be an annoyance and I doubt it is to most people.

And I expect to see two year old at 'burger joints' and all though this thread I have stated that I am only talking about burger joints and child-friendly pubs (which I don't think are common in the USA).

 

[Trekker4747]

See? This is the problem. Parents these days don't want to teach their kids manners and boundaries. "Oh he's a kid, he doesn't know any better!" "Oh, he's just being friendly!" "Oh, you just hate kids! He's just being cute!"

No, sorry.

Teach your kid to keep his butt planted on the seat and looking at his family/food, not crawling around looking at strangers trying to have a meal.

*You* be sure not to look over any dividers or look around at any other tables, too, now. After all, it's just plain rude and your parents should have taught you not to look at anything but your plate.

Jan

I don't. At least not an obvious way like turning completely around, sitting on my knees and saying high and waving to the people behind me.

 

[Maestro]

^ That's a nice story, it really is. I'm sure your grandpa was a great guy. But it's hard for me to smile warmly when some strangers kid is screaming as loud as they can while rolling in the floor in a public place. I had to deal with that just day before yesterday. It's also hard to have soft spot for some strange kid running as fast as he can in the mall who ends running into me from behind and nearly knocking me down, as happened last year. I guess what I'm saying is, it depends on the kid.

This is a different situation than the one I spoke about.

 

[sidious618]

I don't. At least not an obvious way like turning completely around, sitting on my knees and saying high and waving to the people behind me.

I do that all the time.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

I think parents need to know their particular children and what they're like.

I have very, very clear memories of when I was little, and I know that my parents were careful of the situations they took me into, when I was little. Fancy restaurants and places where there was a long wait were generally out because I was NOT a patient child. But if the wait got to be too long and I DID get antsy, I remember many times when my dad would carry me outside to give me a change of scene for a bit. Roaming around the restaurant itself was NOT an option, and frankly, did not even pop into my head to do. Outside with Dad was the only alternative.

Now, when I got a little older (say, 4 years old and on), I was very easily entertained by just giving me a paper napkin or placemat, and a pen, and I'd draw. (Or better yet--those restaurants where the WHOLE "tablecloth" is paper. ) And there was even an age range where my parents allowed me to read books in the restaurant, especially if there was going to be a long wait. Of course, once I reached an appropriate age, the expectation was to participate in conversation with the family and be patient no matter what happened. But the whole point of all of that was that I was not allowed to be loud or disruptive or obnoxious to other restaurant patrons--and I'm sure people would rather a little kid be there quietly with her nose in a book than doing all the stuff you guys have mentioned.

Things I was also NOT allowed to do was make a mess or be rude to the wait staff. I remember getting a lot of compliments from waiters and waitresses because I did NOT act up in the restaurant like a lot of other kids my age. I also remember I used to really surprise them because starting at about 3 years old, I would order my own food instead of my parents ordering for me. "Please" and "thank you" were things I learned VERY early. (This was another advantage to learning to read early--I could actually look at the menu and have a part in making a decision even at 3.) And if the food was going to be messy, my parents helped me when I was really little instead of letting me make a mess.

And they told me, too, when I was a baby/toddler, they would PICK UP after the inevitable mess kids that age make when they are too young to know any better, rather than make the wait staff do that. Now THAT is something that pisses me off about children in restaurants--when parents do not clean up the mess their children make, because frankly, a little kid's mess is above and beyond what the wait staff should have to deal with by themselves.

 

[Amaris]

^ As a former busboy for a Frisch's restaurant (the ONLY busboy in the whole restaurant), I wholeheartedly approve this post, particularly the last paragraph!

J.

 

[LeahBoBo]

I didn't use the words 'family friendly' - I said burger joint. I do not know of any establishment that would fit the definition of a burger joint which is

Any establishment, major chain or independent, that primarily serves burgers and fries.

that isn't a fast-food restaurant.

You know if I went to Chuck-E-Cheese's or someplace that caters to kids, I'd have no room to bitch and I wouldn't. That said, what difference does it make where I dine or what they serve? A restaurant is a place to sit down, eat, and enjoy the company of your companions. I'm sure that even the "family friendly" establishment doesn't include: annoying the fuck out of everyone around your table in the definition. And if they do, let me know so I NEVER go there.

If some parents can't be bothered to teach their kids boundaries, manners and social skills, then they don't deserve to eat outside of their homes. Ever. Being "curious" and "a kid" doesn't excuse inappropriate behavior in public or, give parents a pass on not taking responsibility for their offspring.

I do not expect two year olds to have the same manners that one would expect from a 6 year old, or a 10 year old. A two year old is barely more than a baby and it isn't easy to explain manners to them, yet alone expect them to have come anywhere near close to mastering them.

A two year old staring at you should not be an annoyance and I doubt it is to most people.

And I expect to see two year old at 'burger joints' and all though this thread I have stated that I am only talking about burger joints and child-friendly pubs (which I don't think are common in the USA).

WTF? Are you deliberately trying to misunderstand what I'm saying? I'm not talking about a two-year old, who should be seated in a high chair or booster seat anyway, or a kid looking around the restaurant, like any normal person is going to do. I'm talking about a specific set of behaviors that will ruin my dining experience. I know you're not stupid, so stop acting like it. My position on this topic has been made perfectly clear. Accept it or not, but I'm not going to continue to debate this with you.