Chekov in ST V & VI - Vat Vas His Job?
- Thread starter Jose Tyler
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The chain of command only becomes an issue in an unexpected crisis. If the Captain places Chekov in charge, he's in charge. This is how Lt Kirk, freshly graduated, became captain in nuTrek over what must have been dozens of other more experienced officers. There was also at least one instance where Ensign Chkov was left in charge of the bridge rather than calling the next in line to the bridge to take over.
Never thought that much about what Chekov was doing on ENT-A in the last two TOS movies. I just felt he was an original crew member, and after the brief trial in TVH he went wherever Kirk and company went.
But he did have rank and a certain skill set as others have pointed out before me,
which would explain his seeming seniority in V and VI.
But he did have rank and a certain skill set as others have pointed out before me,
which would explain his seeming seniority in V and VI.
Perhaps Chekov was in the command chair in ST V because he was the best choice to try and fake out Sybok? Scotty was next in line for command (and even though Scotty is an engineer by trade, he is still a qualified command officer - he could have had his own ship if he'd wanted), he probably just thought Chekov would be more convincing in the ruse, i.e. try and make Sybok think that Chekov was supposed to be the captain all along.
Meaning: Scotty can BE a captain, but at that point he doesn't LOOK like a captain.
Meaning: Scotty can BE a captain, but at that point he doesn't LOOK like a captain.
OTOH, Chekov would be the first starship captain since "Where No Man Has Gone Before" who wouldn't be wearing the rank insignia of Captain...
If Sybok knew (or believed) that all starship captains are of Captain rank at minimum, then putting Chekov in that chair would directly tip off Sybok to the fact that the real captain was up to something else!
Timo Saloniemi
If Sybok knew (or believed) that all starship captains are of Captain rank at minimum, then putting Chekov in that chair would directly tip off Sybok to the fact that the real captain was up to something else!
Timo Saloniemi
In TMP he was the Security Chief (seeing as how Ilia was now onboard as Navigator).
In TWOK he was the XO of the Reliant (though not sure what other position he held, as he should have been in Command white).
In TSFS he handles Communications.
In TVH he is back at Navigation.
In TFF he is still at Navigation, though does act up as 'Captain' when the landing party are trying to free the hostages.
And lastly in TUC he is once again at Navigation, though he does take a leading role in the search for the traitors onboard (but then again so does Spock, Uhura and Valeris). He is also seen in charge on the Bridge just before the attack on Kronos 1 (even though Uhura is on duty at the same time and she has been in service for longer than him).
I have always pegged him as the Chief Navigation Officer in the later films (though maybe with a bit of involvement in Security, seeing as how they don't have an established Chief). His uniform would also support that, being the grey of the 'sciences' (Communications, Navigation, Science).
In TWOK he was the XO of the Reliant (though not sure what other position he held, as he should have been in Command white).
In TSFS he handles Communications.
In TVH he is back at Navigation.
In TFF he is still at Navigation, though does act up as 'Captain' when the landing party are trying to free the hostages.
And lastly in TUC he is once again at Navigation, though he does take a leading role in the search for the traitors onboard (but then again so does Spock, Uhura and Valeris). He is also seen in charge on the Bridge just before the attack on Kronos 1 (even though Uhura is on duty at the same time and she has been in service for longer than him).
I have always pegged him as the Chief Navigation Officer in the later films (though maybe with a bit of involvement in Security, seeing as how they don't have an established Chief). His uniform would also support that, being the grey of the 'sciences' (Communications, Navigation, Science).
I generally try to avoid Star Trek V, but I always think that Chekov is playing Captain on the bridge because Scotty is still trying to put the ship together--it was a plot element that she ship wasn't ready for launch when they left dry-dock.
If he knew Starfleet's insignia scheme. Sense he seemed to buy Chekov being captain, I'm going to lean in the direction that he isn't that familiar with Starfleet.
...Or then Starfleet does allow people other than full Captains to command starships. But from the viewpoint of playing safe, placing Scotty in the chair would be more believable than placing Chekov there. Plus, if Sybok is convinced Starfleet is sending a big bad ship with an important commander, he's likely to feel more "secure", which is important in hostage situations. With Scotty, he would be more convinced than otherwise that he is up against an invincible foe, and/or more convinced that he is being given the attention he wants...
As matters stand, we never saw an XO who would be "dedicated to command". Not until the return to the simplistic three-color scheme in TNG, at any rate. Only the commanding officers wore pure white. Them, and Scotty on occasion.
Why for example Saavik wore white with a department-colored sash is not completely clear. Bob Fletcher intended for "department heads" to do that, but as far as we can tell, this never really happened, or then none of our heroes were department heads.
Timo Saloniemi
As matters stand, we never saw an XO who would be "dedicated to command". Not until the return to the simplistic three-color scheme in TNG, at any rate. Only the commanding officers wore pure white. Them, and Scotty on occasion.
Why for example Saavik wore white with a department-colored sash is not completely clear. Bob Fletcher intended for "department heads" to do that, but as far as we can tell, this never really happened, or then none of our heroes were department heads.
Timo Saloniemi
As far as Treks V and VI are concerned, Chekov is Navigator.
After the original series I always pegged him as a line/relief officer based at Navigation. I mean spending all that time on the bridge watching Kirk, im sure he learnt how to bluff his way through, maybe trying to think like Kirk would.
That was an unknown Starfleet Enlisted Man or NCO, not a cadet. Starfleet Cadets wore officer jackets with red undershirts. Starfleet Enlisted personnel wore the red one piece jumpsuits.
The video game Starfleet Academy back in the 90's got the uniforms for the cadets wrong. As did Nemesis when they showed a picture of Tom Hardy as Cadet Picard wearing an Enlisted uniform.
An example of Late 23rd to mid 24th Century Uniforms:
Officer
Cadet
Cadet Foster
Enlisted Man
Another Enlisted Man
That is all.
...However, Bob Fletcher's original scheme for the movie insisted that anybody with a red collar was an Academy student of some sort. Cadet with the tunic, enlisted trainee with the jumpsuit. People wearing collars of other colors would be commissioned officers (tunic with departmental collar) or enlisteds (jumpsuit with black collar).
The intended system never really matched what we saw on screen, of course. Saavik and pals appeared not to be Cadets at all, but graduated and commissioned officers who just happened to be at the Academy undergoing some sort of non-mandatory postgraduate training (the sort that McCoy and Spock never attended, apparently, as they didn't do Kobayashi Maru). They have the rank pins to prove it, and nobody addresses them as Cadets on screen (that is, neither Saavik, Foster nor any of the unnamed tunic folks is addressed as Cadet on her or his face, or indirectly established as one). This sort of leaves the red-collared jumpsuit folks as the Cadets; indeed, the trainee Peter Preston (albeit in coveralls) is considered a Midshipman, basically a synonym for Cadet. And Scotty is said to be fostering some Cadets even though we never see a tunic-clad person serving with him.
The deck is further shuffled when a supposed photograph of young Picard shows him wearing the jumpsuit with the black rather than the red collar in ST:NEM. It might be doing a favor to Bob Fletcher here if we completely dumped the idea that the red collar had anything to do with the training (or instructor?) status of personnel; it might have been associated with the redshirt tasks of the previous scheme from TMP as well as the one from TOS instead, after all.
Timo Saloniemi
The intended system never really matched what we saw on screen, of course. Saavik and pals appeared not to be Cadets at all, but graduated and commissioned officers who just happened to be at the Academy undergoing some sort of non-mandatory postgraduate training (the sort that McCoy and Spock never attended, apparently, as they didn't do Kobayashi Maru). They have the rank pins to prove it, and nobody addresses them as Cadets on screen (that is, neither Saavik, Foster nor any of the unnamed tunic folks is addressed as Cadet on her or his face, or indirectly established as one). This sort of leaves the red-collared jumpsuit folks as the Cadets; indeed, the trainee Peter Preston (albeit in coveralls) is considered a Midshipman, basically a synonym for Cadet. And Scotty is said to be fostering some Cadets even though we never see a tunic-clad person serving with him.
The deck is further shuffled when a supposed photograph of young Picard shows him wearing the jumpsuit with the black rather than the red collar in ST:NEM. It might be doing a favor to Bob Fletcher here if we completely dumped the idea that the red collar had anything to do with the training (or instructor?) status of personnel; it might have been associated with the redshirt tasks of the previous scheme from TMP as well as the one from TOS instead, after all.
Timo Saloniemi
doubleohfive
Fleet Admiral
That was an unknown Starfleet Enlisted Man or NCO, not a cadet. Starfleet Cadets wore officer jackets with red undershirts. Starfleet Enlisted personnel wore the red one piece jumpsuits.
The video game Starfleet Academy back in the 90's got the uniforms for the cadets wrong. As did Nemesis when they showed a picture of Tom Hardy as Cadet Picard wearing an Enlisted uniform.
An example of Late 23rd to mid 24th Century Uniforms:
Officer
Cadet
Cadet Foster
Enlisted Man
Another Enlisted Man
That is all.
...Wasn't Saavik a lieutenant in Wrath of Khan?
Saavik was indeed a Lieutenant in Wrath of Khan, I shouldn't have used a picture of her as an example. I did an image search for "Wrath of Khan Starfleet Cadet uniform" and hers was the first picture to come up. Even though she was a commissioned officer she was definitely a student at the Academy, probably doing an advanced leadership course or something (maybe that's why she was wearing a command white shirt in The Search for Spock). It's possible that first year cadets wore red collared Enlisted uniforms before moving to red officer jackets with red shirts, with Cadet rank insignia.
I think Timo is right, officer cadets and commissioned officers taking classes at Starfleet Academy wore Red shirts under their jackets, and their appropriate rank insignia. Enlisted recruits and trainees wore enlisted jumpsuits with red collars. While trained Enlisted men and NCO's wore black collars, which is what the Enterprise Navigator was wearing as the Enterprise was approaching Spacedock in The Search for Spock.
I think Timo is right, officer cadets and commissioned officers taking classes at Starfleet Academy wore Red shirts under their jackets, and their appropriate rank insignia. Enlisted recruits and trainees wore enlisted jumpsuits with red collars. While trained Enlisted men and NCO's wore black collars, which is what the Enterprise Navigator was wearing as the Enterprise was approaching Spacedock in The Search for Spock.
...And we might even throw in Valeris with her red collar but department-color strap, and say that she was
a) a postgrad student specializing in the grey department, whereas Saavik and all others studied in order to become part of the red department (that is, to become Starfleet instructors like Spock)
b) an instructor teaching the grey department
Timo Saloniemi
a) a postgrad student specializing in the grey department, whereas Saavik and all others studied in order to become part of the red department (that is, to become Starfleet instructors like Spock)
b) an instructor teaching the grey department
Timo Saloniemi
And in the TWOK era TWOK uniforms they had the Helmsman have the yellow colour along with Engineering, maybe because they had duties which included fixing the helm and engines too which would be akin to security wearing an operations colour whilst also firing the weapons. But the navigator wore white.
In that same time frame we never seem to see any first officer in command colours as they always seemed to be tied to being a head of one of the departments like the Sciences or Communications, or in Chekov's case Services?
The TNG era TWOK uniforms were simplified to just have white for command and helmsman, yellow for operations, greyish blue for the sciences.
In that same time frame we never seem to see any first officer in command colours as they always seemed to be tied to being a head of one of the departments like the Sciences or Communications, or in Chekov's case Services?
The TNG era TWOK uniforms were simplified to just have white for command and helmsman, yellow for operations, greyish blue for the sciences.
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