True, I forgot that. The Federation dictated the terms of Odo's return to the great link.
Chakotay facing jail time?
- Thread starter Abi Smith
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True, I forgot that. The Federation dictated the terms of Odo's return to the great link.
In any event, since "A Message in the Bottle" in s4, it has not been once made a reference to an eventual pardon to ex-Maquis rebels and I don't doubt that Janeway still had to ask/request again and again during the 3 years following, a general pardon for her friends to admirals with whom she was in contact, justifying of course of their active collaboration/help aboard Voyager. Worst, in S5 during a contact with Starfleet HQ, she seemed frustrated and even annoyed to hear an admiral (Hayes?) still refering to Chakotay and Cie as "Maquis", what can easily suggest that Admirals didn't forget & had surely no intention to do anything in the direction of any amnisitie or any other gesture going in this way. Plus, can 7 years of collaboration* aboard Voyager make forget terrorist and criminal acts committed before boarding (we know that violent actions were led and Starfleet officers and other people were collateral victims because they were sadly on their way)? I don't think so and this especially as *Chakotay & his former crew had no choice but to comply to their new fate if they wanted to survive to DQ and its dangers. In short, they had as much interest as Janeway - if not more - to accept the deal and make it work. And let's be honest, they were far from suffering their new situation: they were free of movement, they were well treated by Janeway and her crew! -> I doubt that with someone like Benjamin Sisko, they would have gotten the same treatment!) <grin>
And let's not forget Suder's mortal attack on an Starfleet officer during one of his crisis, while Voyager wasn't in a red alert situation?! That Janeway has let this incident go by does not mean that Starfleet will do the same and Chakotay, as the Maquis leader, could be officially blamed for failing to report the dangerous nature of some of his crew to Captain Janeway & her Chief of Security, Tuvok!
(A contrario, Starfleet could pardon the Equinox crew for their actions, estimating 1) they just did following orders of Capt Ransom and that they could not be held responsible for the violent nature of his decisions. 2) they had already their sentences).
As for an eventual court marital trial for Janeway, let me say that, whether you like it or not, she is a hero for her crew, for Starfleet (and consequently for the Federation) and for families. Of course, some of her decisions were questionable but circonstances were special and even exceptional so I guess that everyone, from Starfleet to population, will be very understanding.
However, it is evident that she won't escape to a commission of inquiry led by Starfleet because well, this is a normal procedure. Commission of inquiry after which she will be offered a promotion of Vice-Admiral that she will end to accept because I guess that after 7 years in the DQ, she will have the feeling of having made the rounds of the matter about her Captain position and instead seeks the "warrior's rest"! ;-)
And let's not forget Suder's mortal attack on an Starfleet officer during one of his crisis, while Voyager wasn't in a red alert situation?! That Janeway has let this incident go by does not mean that Starfleet will do the same and Chakotay, as the Maquis leader, could be officially blamed for failing to report the dangerous nature of some of his crew to Captain Janeway & her Chief of Security, Tuvok!
(A contrario, Starfleet could pardon the Equinox crew for their actions, estimating 1) they just did following orders of Capt Ransom and that they could not be held responsible for the violent nature of his decisions. 2) they had already their sentences).
As for an eventual court marital trial for Janeway, let me say that, whether you like it or not, she is a hero for her crew, for Starfleet (and consequently for the Federation) and for families. Of course, some of her decisions were questionable but circonstances were special and even exceptional so I guess that everyone, from Starfleet to population, will be very understanding.
However, it is evident that she won't escape to a commission of inquiry led by Starfleet because well, this is a normal procedure. Commission of inquiry after which she will be offered a promotion of Vice-Admiral that she will end to accept because I guess that after 7 years in the DQ, she will have the feeling of having made the rounds of the matter about her Captain position and instead seeks the "warrior's rest"! ;-)
Oh and for those who could wonder why I don't stop associate Chakotay to Starfleet despite his resignation to join the Maquis, I'd answer in saying that when we look at his career, we see that Chakotay spent more time in Starfleet organization than as a civilian. Indeed, he has joined Starfleet Academy as a teenager and once graduated, he has gone through the ranks until being Lt Com. Then, he resigned to join the Maquis before crossing Starfleet Capt Janeway's road, who temporary re-installed him in his rank and asked him to take the position of XO he has already held in the past so, Starfleet could rightly estimate that it is up to them to charge him for his actions in the Maquis (time during which Chakotay used as well the teaching he has got at the academy as the experience acquired afterwards)
And you can be sure that the Federation will be too happy to refile "the hot potato" to Starfleet because the responsibility of the President of the Federation as well his administration will not be questioned by a segment of the population who could support Chakotay and would be opposed to any eventual sanction.
Hey, reality or fiction, as people as public/private organisations always do the same wayThe strings are known in advance!
NB : even if some Starfleet officers like Riker supported the arguments of the Maquis to fight the Cardassians, the hierarchy tended to see officers who join the Maquis as traitors so when they caught, I guess they had to take the maximum. In the Chakotay's case, his sentence could be reduced* thanks to Janeway's support but not extinguished.
* not necessarely imprisoned in federal prison but simply being forced to live and work under close supervision for Starfleet or another organization depending of the Federation; what for someone like Chakotay, who is a free spirit individual, could be an ordeal.
I would be curious to know if Janeway shared the same point of view than the Maquis about their will to release populations from Cardassians (if I remember Mosaic, it was said that she was captured, with Capt Owen Paris, by Cardassians and was tortured in their jails, for a short period), what could maybe explain why she was so inclined to befriend with him...
And you can be sure that the Federation will be too happy to refile "the hot potato" to Starfleet because the responsibility of the President of the Federation as well his administration will not be questioned by a segment of the population who could support Chakotay and would be opposed to any eventual sanction.
Hey, reality or fiction, as people as public/private organisations always do the same wayThe strings are known in advance!
NB : even if some Starfleet officers like Riker supported the arguments of the Maquis to fight the Cardassians, the hierarchy tended to see officers who join the Maquis as traitors so when they caught, I guess they had to take the maximum. In the Chakotay's case, his sentence could be reduced* thanks to Janeway's support but not extinguished.
* not necessarely imprisoned in federal prison but simply being forced to live and work under close supervision for Starfleet or another organization depending of the Federation; what for someone like Chakotay, who is a free spirit individual, could be an ordeal.
I would be curious to know if Janeway shared the same point of view than the Maquis about their will to release populations from Cardassians (if I remember Mosaic, it was said that she was captured, with Capt Owen Paris, by Cardassians and was tortured in their jails, for a short period), what could maybe explain why she was so inclined to befriend with him...
I think with the maquis itself nearly exterminated by the dominion, alongside the massive celebrations and joy with voyager's triumphant return it would not have been a good political or PR move by Starfleet to have the maquis crew arrested.
Legally they could simply declare their service aboard voyager accounted for time served and the issue resolved.
Legally they could simply declare their service aboard voyager accounted for time served and the issue resolved.
I think that makes sense for the majority of them. Certain individuals (like Suder) would obviously be exceptions.
End of season 6, (Lifeline), an admiral on Earth, asks Janeway if there has been trouble with the Marquis..
Earth had no idea that the Marquis on Voyager were not still total scumbags, almost an entire year after DS9 had concluded.
Earth had no idea that the Marquis on Voyager were not still total scumbags, almost an entire year after DS9 had concluded.
Am I the only one who thought the actor might have been arrested for something after seeing the headline?
Glad that wasn't the case. I think the Maquis might could get off with time served. But am I the only one who thinks it's unlikely they would be allowed to stay in Starfleet. In fact I am sure they would have other conditions placed on them like the future version of ankle braclets and maybe restrictions on space travel. If your Starfleet you got to worry about them wanting to go get revenge on the Carddisians or them trying to rebuild the colonies which I wonder what happened to those planets once the Dominion basically layed waste to the homeworld.
Jason
Glad that wasn't the case. I think the Maquis might could get off with time served. But am I the only one who thinks it's unlikely they would be allowed to stay in Starfleet. In fact I am sure they would have other conditions placed on them like the future version of ankle braclets and maybe restrictions on space travel. If your Starfleet you got to worry about them wanting to go get revenge on the Carddisians or them trying to rebuild the colonies which I wonder what happened to those planets once the Dominion basically layed waste to the homeworld. Jason
If Starfleet is asking that six years into Voyager's journey, does that mean they paid no attention to what the Dr. told them about the Maquis when he was transmitted to the AQ in Message in a Bottle?
The Doctor communicated verbally instead of digitally.
And why trust a hologram?
They can be manipulated by any one with command codes, to say anything that is untrue, with complete sincerity.
And why trust a hologram?
They can be manipulated by any one with command codes, to say anything that is untrue, with complete sincerity.
I believe "The Courtmartial of Captain Katheryn Janeway" that OP is referring to was some blog; a mock trial of Janeway that gained notoriety a number of years ago. I've heard of it numerous times, but have never been able to find it.
lol. That's exactly what I thought.Am I the only one who thought the actor might have been arrested for something after seeing the headline?
It seemed very likely that the Dominion crew were pardoned after they came back. Especially considering they were pretty much the only survivors of the Maquis. Plus various alternate futures show that.
It's extremely unlikely that the Cardassians or the Dominion held onto any conquered AQ territory. They're lucky if they even got to keep territory they had before the war, or any single output outside their own homeworld.
Of course Janeway was court martialed, she was sent back in time and ended up in a Litchfield minumum security prison.
It's extremely unlikely that the Cardassians or the Dominion held onto any conquered AQ territory. They're lucky if they even got to keep territory they had before the war, or any single output outside their own homeworld.
Of course Janeway was court martialed, she was sent back in time and ended up in a Litchfield minumum security prison.
Imagine of they found a new high level Nazi, who is possibly the last Nazi to be a living findable Nazi.
Is this person going to be charged for the realistic crimes they may have been responsible for, or is the court going to go hog wild, because this is it.
The last dodo egg omelette.
Is this person going to be charged for the realistic crimes they may have been responsible for, or is the court going to go hog wild, because this is it.
The last dodo egg omelette.
That's an absurd comparison, comparing the Maquis to Nazis.
They took land, waved a flag, and tried to commit at least two genocides.
DS9 For the Uniform and Dreadnought.
DS9 For the Uniform and Dreadnought.
For The Uniform is absurd to describe as a genocide, they pumped a slow poison into an atmosphere and forced them to evacuate. Dreadnought was designed to destroy a military target, not an entire race. Your argument is again completely absurd.
Maquis are more comparable to an Ireland situation, or Algeria's rebellion against France. Yes, people died, and some were civilians. But no, the goal was never to exterminate the Cardassians, just to drive them from their land.
Have you ever READ a history book?!
The Maquis were wiped out and Voyager got home, and given what the Cardassians sympathy with their cause was at an all time high.
Maquis are more comparable to an Ireland situation, or Algeria's rebellion against France. Yes, people died, and some were civilians. But no, the goal was never to exterminate the Cardassians, just to drive them from their land.
Have you ever READ a history book?!
The Maquis were wiped out and Voyager got home, and given what the Cardassians sympathy with their cause was at an all time high.
I know I'm stretching facts like taffy.
The Federation may not see the maquis as all that bad... But the Cardassians who got the lionshare of the thumping from the Marquis wouldn't see the Marquis as a rag tag bunch of plucky freedom fighters.
They are the boogyman.
The Federation may not see the maquis as all that bad... But the Cardassians who got the lionshare of the thumping from the Marquis wouldn't see the Marquis as a rag tag bunch of plucky freedom fighters.
They are the boogyman.
Yes, especially since the original Maquis from the 20th century was a French resistance movement fighting the Nazis.
Interesting.
Of course the ultimate conclusion is that Janeway gets made Admiral. I have Endgame and Nemesis to prove it.
Regarding the maquis being allowed to stay in Starfleet-in the novels I believe this is the case, and given a lot of maquis were ex Starfleet personnel it wouldn't have been too hard to fill out all the paperwork and legal minutiae to allow them to keep their positions in Starfleet.
For those that weren't ex Starfleet when they joined the maquis-their service aboard voyager could be taken into account regarding whether or not they would be allowed to remain in the service.
For those that weren't ex Starfleet when they joined the maquis-their service aboard voyager could be taken into account regarding whether or not they would be allowed to remain in the service.
