CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[carlosp]

^^^^
You gotta wonder in that is part of the "$150,000 of his own money" claim <--- Where Alec Peters now claims he paid back to Axanar somehow.

I have actually wondered exactly that, @Noname Given. I have heard word that Peters only counts the crowdfunding proceeds from Kickstarter and Indiegogo as "donor money." All other undisclosed income is "his." I'm hoping to get this opinion of his confirmed, as it fits the revisions he's said to have made in the Axanar financials submitted to the court the second time.

 

[ThankYouGeneR]

http://fanfilmfactor.com/2016/11/22...ummary-judgment-in-the-axanar-lawsuit-part-3/

"Ah, greed. But remember that the plaintiffs"

Burrrrn!



A singularly entertaining blog!

"I am thankful for all of you (yes, even the negative nellies and ranting ralphs) because you are taking the time to read what I am taking the time to write. Truly, that means the world to me…so thank you all."

You're welcome, Mr. Lane. My best to you and yours on our national day of giving thanks!

(and to be fair to myself since I don't fit into the 'negative nellies' or 'ranting ralphs' groups ... I'll put me in the 'trying to understand how we got here Henrys' )

 

[oswriter]

Oh and I just read this bit from one of their experts (Oki Declaration, Exhibit 3, Jenkins opinion):

The "expert" is Dr. Henry Jenkins of the University of Southern California. Not to cross fandoms, but here's a particularly telling statement of his from an article on "The Phantom Menace":

Author Henry Jenkins, provost’s professor of communication, journalism and cinematic arts at the University of Southern California, said that particular film stands to this day as a sort of love/hate dividing line and “an open wound” for the original "Star Wars" faithful.

“'The Phantom Menace’ is something the adult 'Star Wars' fans continually reference. It’s something they care about deeply,” he said. “It’s a trauma in the community that they’re finding it very difficult to work around.”

So basically, he's implying fans who dislike a movie are the equivalent of rape victims.

Postscript: I also found this article by Jenkins at Reason--another Axanar enabler--in which he openly celebrates piracy and copyright infringement.

 

[oswriter]

Except that is exactly how copyright law works in America. An IP holder can bring suit against one, any, or all, or none of the parties infringing on the IP. The lawsuits can seem strategic, unfair, stupid, or downright mean. But cherry picking enforcement is absolutely allowed.

Well this is the problem, Madam Justice @jespah, when your "expert" witness isn't a lawyer or an intellectual property expert but rather a "Professor of Communication, Journalism, Cinematic Arts and Education."

 

[ThankYouGeneR]

Alec claimed that's what happens sometimes in business, it cost more than it should have to operate and that was the reason.

Well, for heaven's sake. So he'd practice saying that even before this litigation.

And it cost somewhere around 400K more than expected? Of other people's money again. That's a Whole Lot of unexpected. And the bankruptcy called for the prop company's liquidation. Which didn't cover the 400K. Which is interesting, and I 'think' this is correct, the bankrupted liquidated prop company re-opened within a few weeks after the liquidation with a whole big bunch of new stuff new 'other people' were wanting this bankrupted consignor who had majorly shorted the previous seller 400K... $400,000.... to sell for them? Which I find at the very least is..... intriguing.

And besides, he said, MGM had just gotten done bankrupting something or stiffing some other group, so if they have the right, he does too.

Wait. Somebody waaaayyy upthread posted something about that kind of thing. Let me see if I can find it.

Here it is:
That didn't happen
And if it did it wasn't that bad
And if it was that bad it's not a big deal
And if it was a big deal it's not my fault
And if it was my fault I didn't mean it
And if I did mean it
You deserved it

 

[Steve Roby]

The "expert" is Dr. Henry Jenkins of the University of Southern California.

Postscript: I also found this article by Jenkins at Reason--another Axanar enabler--in which he openly celebrates piracy and copyright infringement.

Well, his classic book on the subject of fanfic was called Textual Poachers. But he started writing about fan activities back when that pretty much meant fanzines. The average Star Trek fan never saw a fanzine. Some, over decades, apparently printed a few thousand copies, but I'd guess that was fairly rare. Bill Hupe, a major fanzine producer/distributor, told me at a con around 1990 that he published from 200 to 500 copies of a fanzine, depending on a few factors. Aside from the fact that you had to hunt down fanzines, there was also the cost. Fanzines weren't cheap. And they didn't look like professionally produced official merchandise. You wouldn't easily confuse the latest Orion or Scotpress title for the latest Pocket Star Trek novel.

The point to that history lesson is that you could celebrate the cool "textual poaching" going on back then because it was an underground thing. I haven't read any recent Jenkins stuff, so I wonder how much thought he's given to just how different something like Prelude to Axanar is from something like Spock Enslaved. Fan videos -- and unlicenced independent professional productions -- appear on Youtube alongside official video material, and when you've got actual original cast members wearing costumes created for the actual series, and CGI that looks really good, it's going to be a lot easier for people to be confused. And no one ever raised a million bucks to produce a fanzine.

 

[ThankYouGeneR]

^^^ Word that

 

[muCephi]

... but the cupcake thing is 100% bullshit.

like I said,

 

[jespah]

Well this is the problem, Madam Justice @jespah, when your "expert" witness isn't a lawyer or an intellectual property expert but rather a "Professor of Communication, Journalism, Cinematic Arts and Education."

I found it amusing (and telling) that his opinion contained what amounted to a legal conclusion. Me, personally, I'm no doctor. If I look at your blood tests and spout on about you having Malcolm Reynolds' Disease (Captainus tightypantsus), well, I shouldn't be taken seriously. Because I don't know jack about that.

PS The equivalence of hating The Phantom Menace to true trauma is exceptionally offensive.

 

[ThankYouGeneR]

I have heard word that Peters only counts the crowdfunding proceeds from Kickstarter and Indiegogo as "donor money." All other undisclosed income is "his." I'm hoping to get this opinion of his confirmed, as it fits the revisions he's said to have made in the Axanar financials submitted to the court the second time.
.........................
Axanar has raised money on top of its crowdfunding proceeds that it has never disclosed. This include such sources as direct donations on their website, "retroactive" donations (actually Blu-ray/DVD sales of Prelude to Axanar) and merchandise sales. Estimates for these undisclosed funds total ~$200,000.

what?! <choking and coughing> Two hundred thousand dollars? Of unreported funds. From using other people's IP?

Okay. Which is now circling my thinking back to the 400K unexpected costs using other people's money in the defendant's previous lawsuit. And, if I've got this correct, the reopening the bankrupted liquidated prop company within a couple of weeks after the finalized bankruptcy with a slew of new people who want him to sell their stuff for them. And paying the 15K rent out of pocket each month. And the running out of money, where's the money thing. And the secret investors thing. And the Lexus. And the legal documents showing tens of thousands of dollars for meals, but it's all a lie. And the salary @38K, no, 45K, no, 60somethingK, no, not a salary. And the studio, no, not a studio, no, a studio. And the fan film, no, independent Star Trek movie, no, fan film. And the 20K into the production from the prop company, no, 30K, no, 45K, no, alll the profits. And the almost 150K personal money into the production, no, over 100K. And what do we do when we're served a lawsuit - we celebrate with sushi, no, no celebrating going on here. And legal documents showing crowdfunding dollars for personal expenses, no, the entire amount is back in the production. And marines hunting down aggressively dissenting donors & ST fans. And banning even donors who aggressively dissent on other-than-production message boards. For doing what ST fans have done for decades to ST everything= aggressively dissent. And deleting threads. And giving refunds only for non-disclosure agreements. And forcing a refund, then taking it back & declaring nobody gets a refund now and it's their fault. And production supporter minions proudly wear production/minion t-shirts though C/P supporters labeled 'minions' indicating mindless automatons. And Elon Musk and the 100M offer. And the unbiased blogger who says he never said he was unbiased. And the production team generating a market plan w a second objective to create and develop new models of sponsorship and funding to help the productions generate profits on low budget productions, no, that is all speculative and so such talk is nonsense, but we have a professional quality movie studio with office spaces in the middle of The 30 Mile Zone in Hollywood & one of the largest green screens in LA. And the meeting with Netflix and Amazon regarding the production and methods to distribute high-quality Star Trek content, without a license. And for years tattling to CBS that other fan film creators were infringing on their IP, the number one ST fan for 50 years And Mr. Takei & Save The Federation. And 5K to rent a movie theater to show a 20 minute film premier w following panel. And why did it go over budget, because we budgeted 20K, crowdfunded 101K, so we spent 125K. And the ruin of the defendant's reputation by repeating what the defendant's legal team put in public domain.

This is crazy making.

 

[oswriter]

I found it amusing (and telling) that his opinion contained what amounted to a legal conclusion. Me, personally, I'm no doctor. If I look at your blood tests and spout on about you having Malcolm Reynolds' Disease (Captainus tightypantsus), well, I shouldn't be taken seriously. Because I don't know jack about that.

This is a good time to point out--for those of you who don't know how this sort of thing works--that either side can move to exclude "expert" opinions offered by the other. In federal civil procedure this is known as a Daubert motion. Here's how a federal judge in Minnesota recently explained this motion:

Before accepting the testimony of an expert witness, the trial court is charged with the "gatekeeper" function of determining whether an opinion is both relevant and reliable. Daubert v. Merrell Dow Pharms., Inc., 509 U.S. 579, 589-90 (1993); Aviva Sports, Inc. v. Fingerhut Direct Mktg., Inc., 829 F. Supp. 2d 802, 820 (D. Minn. 2011). Under Federal Rule of Evidence 702, which governs the admission of expert testimony, an expert may testify if: (1) the expert's scientific, technical, or other specialized knowledge will help the fact-finder to understand the evidence or determine a fact in issue; (2) the testimony is based on sufficient facts or data; (3) the testimony is the product of reliable principles and methods; and (4) the expert has reliably applied those principles and methods to the facts of the case.

I'd say it's a safe bet C/P will file a Daubert motion to exclude Professor Jenkins' opinion.

 

[Red Shirt]

what?! <choking and coughing>

AP's Donor Store has been open for years. Since maybe 2013, 2014? Completely outside of any fundme campaign or third party oversight. Who knows how much cash has been dropped there. Is it any wonder why AP is pushing his propaganda campaign so hard? Donors = cash in his pocket = cupcakes and sushi.

 

[carlosp]

like I said,

#cupgrade

 

[Potemkin_Prod]

PS The equivalence of hating The Phantom Menace to true trauma is exceptionally offensive.

Actually, South Park spoofed this very idea a few years ago with their reaction to Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skulls. Throughout the episode, the kids and adults are experiencing ptsd from the rape of Indiana Jones by the absurd events of that movie.

 

[Potemkin_Prod]

This is crazy making

You got that right.

 

[muCephi]

Okay. Which is now circling my thinking back to the 400K unexpected costs using other people's money in the defendant's previous lawsuit.

If I am following you, it may be important to consider that Propworx had been around a while and doing a variety of auctions before it folded. It might have been having problems for a while and the unpaid bills might have reflected more than one auction.

But honestly, it is hard to imagine how a business with so many margins and so little investment cost could go off the rails. Buyer and seller premiums. Costumes either obtained on consignment or presumably at some discount to the projected sale price. Full price charged for shipping, and generous packing fee income.

You do have to photograph everything, store the items, perhaps show some of it at conventions, maybe some screen used research. market through a website and catalog and COAs. pay for the online auction. Pay yourself.

But a number of firms seem to do it ok.

 

[ThankYouGeneR]

#cupgrade

I just got that

 

[muCephi]

#cupgrade

ISS Cupgrade

no refunds

 

[Kytee]

Thanks, @Kytee !

The trouble with what the legal implications of the money Jonathan Lane might have raised via GoFundMe is that it's far from clear whether he is an actual employee of Axanar Productions. To begin with, according to their own FAQ, Axanar has no employees; all its workers are independent contractors. Lane's self-identification on his declaration to the court that he is a writer for Axanar Productions Inc. by itself doesn't confirm whether he is either an employee or a contractor.

His employment status would likely affect the connection between any money he might have raised via GoFundMe and Axanar itself. I'd be surprised if Jonathan is paid anything for the work he does on Axanar's behalf; I think he would disclose if he were being paid. Just my opinion, however. As with all things Axanar the details remain opaque.

Thank you for replying , I missed that part in the FAQ, I jumped to the conclusion writer meant employee and that's not quite the case.

 

[Mordock]

The point to that history lesson is that you could celebrate the cool "textual poaching" going on back then because it was an underground thing. I haven't read any recent Jenkins stuff, so I wonder how much thought he's given to just how different something like Prelude to Axanar is from something like Spock Enslaved. Fan videos -- and unlicenced independent professional productions -- appear on Youtube alongside official video material, and when you've got actual original cast members wearing costumes created for the actual series, and CGI that looks really good, it's going to be a lot easier for people to be confused. And no one ever raised a million bucks to produce a fanzine.

Jenkins has a very active blog, and has addressed it here and here and here.