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CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

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Okay, so today the trailer for Horizons and the crowdfunding video for Pacific 201 were brought to my attention.

Each, in its own way, is more impressive work than anything in the so-called "Vulcan Scene" from Axanar - and that includes the acting. These people did these things for a lot less money and with fewer resources than Axanar.
 
It's almost like he doesn't have competent counsel. Does he even talk to his attorneys?

He has very competent counsel, reading about them. They can only advise him. He is a grown up--well, the law sees him as such. He is free to make his own decisions. For better or worse.
 
My point exactly: why does he keep harping on this? It's not going to help him. In fact, by saying that the high quality is why they've taken him down, he's acknowledging that he's NOT just like all the others-- something he and his side would need to argue to have a chance at a waiver defense.

I think they have one argument for the fans, and another they plan to use for court. Or they are simply trying different ones on for size.
 
I think it's interesting that he keeps harping on the fact that CBS and Paramount are shutting him down because Axanar is too good/too professional/too high quality.

Benefit of the doubt let's say that's true. Seriously, let's just play devil's advocate and give in to that statement: let's assume that CBS and Paramount truly just don't like that Axanar is so good and of professional quality.

First, that's a perfectly valid and understandable reason to want to shut someone down. He even admits, and is correct when he says that, other fan productions would never be confused for the real thing-- implying that his would.

Right there, acknowledgement of "brand confusion" would support the plaintiff's argument and (I'd think) sway a judge to not only rule in CBS' favor, but come down hard on Axanar: because these acknowledgements suggest this wasn't an honest mistake, but premeditated. They prove he knew what he was doing, and indicate pretty strongly that he'd know they might object.

Because the one of the primary purposes of copyright law is to protect brand confusion and dilution.

Why does he think that will help him in court? Does he really think the judge is going to turn to him and say "well, you're right, and you know what, CBS? That's not fair. Screw established rule of law, i'm going to let this man make his movie because it's going to be awesome!"
He has a problem. He needs the fans on his side to try and do a deal with the studio if he is going to stand a chance of getting it made (he doesn't in my view, but anyway), and he also needs to keep them sweet during this whole affair so that he doesn't have hundreds of fans going after him for refunds at the same time he's facing the litigation. If he just goes to ground and makes the fans and doners feel abandoned then there's a much greater chance of that happening. He's also someone who clearly has a huge ego and is into self promotion - so I suspect that also comes into play.

Frankly, the fact that he is talking about a settlement with the studio speaks volumes about the advice that he has been given by his lawyers. As a litigator myself, I suspect he will have been advised that there may be a defence, but it is not a strong one and there isn't likely to be a high chance of success - therefore this is primarily about damage limitation. Avoiding full litigation, while at the same time trying to achieve some form liciencing or parameter set tolerance with CBS/Paramount.

The studio holds most of, if not all, the cards and really there is no incentive to do a deal, save for keeping some fans happy. So I wouldn't mind betting that if a deal is done, most,, if not all the IP will be stripped out of the project. But this would then create a scenario where Peters is unable to deliver on his crowdfund promise of Star Trek, which in turn will likely see him again facing complaints from donors (and thus another reason to keep as many on side as possible).

I think what Peters isn't being honest with the doners about is that his lawyers would almost certainly have advised him that even settling on the basis that he just shuts down the project and walks away would be more favourable then defending the action and then going on to lose. If they can say to CBS "we'll walk away if you claim no damages or costs". That's much better than being faced with damages, costs and then having to face disgruntled doners. I hope he has not received such advice and is nonetheless stringing people on, but at the same time I hope that he has gotten such advice as if the litigation looks flimsy then such advice would be in his best interest.

I said right from the off that the litigation would cause him to halt production as soon as he took independent legal advice. It's what any sensible lawyer would advise. Sure enough that's what has now happen. Well, my next prediction is that he has already been advised that the chances of being successful aren't good and that he is already now in full blown firefighting mode, and trying to mitigate the fallout when it comes. Suffice it to say that if we are sitting here a year from now and there's still a Star Trek project called Axanar then the next time I am in court I will strip naked and slap my todger on the judge's bench.
 
But for how much longer? It's been said repeatedly, but how much more of this mouthing off to fans and press will they tolerate?
They'll tolerate it until it gets to the stage that his actions are directly going against his best interests, contrary to their advice, to such an extent that they do not feel able to act in his best interests.

Although probably undesirable, this interview is unlikely to give rise to such a scenario as pretty much everything he said in it he's said before, and they took him on as a client notwithstanding.

I think that as long as they advise him of the risks, and he chooses to give interviews with that knowledge, then they'll be fine with it. The time to step out is when you know that your relationship with your client has broken down to the extent that your client is intent on following a course of action that would lead to significant harm and he is hellbent on pursuing such a course despite it being doomed to fail - that or your client's demands risk placing you in an unethical position. They certainly wouldn't have reached that stage yet because, like I say, he's not really saying anything new.
 
That assumes you know what is being discussed between them. How do we know his lawyers are annoyed or frustrated?

We don't. But most attorney's recommend a course of "no comment" during active litigation. It's fair, I think, to at least question how much of his public comments are against their counsel.
 
They'll tolerate it until it gets to the stage that his actions are directly going against his best interests, contrary to their advice, to such an extent that they do not feel able to act in his best interests.

Although probably undesirable, this interview is unlikely to give rise to such a scenario as pretty much everything he said in it he's said before, and they took him on as a client notwithstanding.

I think that as long as they advise him of the risks, and he chooses to give interviews with that knowledge, then they'll be fine with it. The time to step out is when you know that your relationship with your client has broken down to the extent that your client is intent on following a course of action that would lead to significant harm and he is hellbent on pursuing such a course despite it being doomed to fail - that or your client's demands risk placing you in an unethical position. They certainly wouldn't have reached that stage yet because, like I say, he's not really saying anything new.

He may not have said anything legally damaging yet, but if I were his legal team-- given how much he and others on the Axanar side are publicly discussing and arguing their POV-- I'd have to wonder how much longer before he says something that is.
 
I think another reason he has to keep touting Axanar as a professional film instead of a fan film is because a fan film wouldn't need more buckets of money. Got to keep those Retroactive Donor Packages flying out the door! If it's just an amateurish fan film, more people would question why it hasn't been made yet.
If it's a professional production, he can bring investors in and show them around the studio to make an investment pitch. He's already thrown around talk of investors and VC money. He's looking for that "billionaire guy" (his words) to come in and make his business dreams of Ares Studio, Ares Digital, and his streaming SciFi channel a reality. Of course all the profits would go to him. He wouldn't want potential investors to think he is some fly by night amateur fan not worth a big investment.
 
I think another reason he has to keep touting Axanar as a professional film instead of a fan film is because a fan film wouldn't need more buckets of money. Got to keep those Retroactive Donor Packages flying out the door! If it's just an amateurish fan film, more people would question why it hasn't been made yet.
If it's a professional production, he can bring investors in and show them around the studio to make an investment pitch. He's already thrown around talk of investors and VC money. He's looking for that "billionaire guy" (his words) to come in and make his business dreams of Ares Studio, Ares Digital, and his streaming SciFi channel a reality. Of course all the profits would go to him. He wouldn't want potential investors to think he is some fly by night amateur fan not worth a big investment.
Even though that's all he really is.
 
Frankly, the fact that he is talking about a settlement with the studio speaks volumes about the advice that he has been given by his lawyers. As a litigator myself, I suspect he will have been advised that there may be a defence, but it is not a strong one and there isn't likely to be a high chance of success - therefore this is primarily about damage limitation. Avoiding full litigation, while at the same time trying to achieve some form liciencing or parameter set tolerance with CBS/Paramount.

I agree wholeheartedly. I can't imagine even his lawyers would want to put the time needed into a judge/jury trial given they're taking it pro bono. I mean, there are things they can do here to enhance their reputations, but if this strings out for a while and goes to trial, they are losing a ton of billable hours in exchange for a problematic outcome. The only way I see they can really influence anything in any way that is beneficial to them is to have Peters walk out with a settlement that does give him something in return for what he gives up. If it goes before a judge or jury, I'd think they essentially lose along with Peters.

Suffice it to say that if we are sitting here a year from now and there's still a Star Trek project called Axanar then the next time I am in court I will strip naked and slap my todger on the judge's bench.

But you will leave the wig on, right? :p
 
Interesting to me that so many people think this can realistically end with some kind of settlement in which CBS grants some kind of license that allows Axanar to be made. I don't see any business case whatsoever that would compel a movie studio to do so.

CBS doesn't just give out licenses; companies pay (big) for them. And film production is its core business. A movie studio doesn't sell licenses for activity in its core business, it does it for ancillary products (e.g., books, games, calendars, other merchandise).
 
I'm not a lawyer, so I think it can realistically end in a settlement that doesn't bankrupt Peters. That may be what they're shooting for.

So, someone who is a lawyer - how do the parties approach settlements? I mean, if Peters's lawyers want to pursue that, do they have to wait until after they've filed a response? Can the parties be reaching out to each other right now? What's the procedure and timeline?
 
Did "Horizons" cost $1.1 million? I bet not. And I actually sat through the whole trailer. I thought the bridge scenes were a little glowy (probably to cover up the green screen effect), but it seemed like a halfway interesting story as presented.

IMHO, it's an FX demo reel masquerading as a story.
 
I'm not a lawyer, so I think it can realistically end in a settlement that doesn't bankrupt Peters. That may be what they're shooting for.

So, someone who is a lawyer - how do the parties approach settlements? I mean, if Peters's lawyers want to pursue that, do they have to wait until after they've filed a response? Can the parties be reaching out to each other right now? What's the procedure and timeline?

I think there would be an issue with allowing Axanar to keep really any of the money that they raised on the back of Star Trek. Why? Because if they are allowed to keep it, they can continue to use it for their for-profit venture, Ares Studios, and whatever else they are funding. That was money that was collected because of a practice CBS and Paramount has deemed to be unlawful.

It would be like doing a cocaine bust, taking away the cocaine, but letting me keep the money I made off the cocaine.
 
IMHO, it's an FX demo reel masquerading as a story.
To be honest that sounds MORE like what "Prelude to Axanar" was as compared to what I've seen of "Horizons" to date. But you'll be able to see for yourself as I believe the person(s) behind "Horizons" set a YouTube release date of 2/28/16. Looks likr the "Horizons" production crew has been WORKING (and it's taken 3 years from what I've read) instead of parading around various Conventions and Film Festivals and just talking about their production. YMMV.
 
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