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CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

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As far as ST:C goes, the IRS filings that oswriter is talking about indicate that they don't have employees, let alone take salaries, so they're off the hook on point one. Don't know if they sell merchandise; as I said upthread, I know precious little about ST:C or its crew, which I do intend to rectify; color me interested.

STC does not report any merchandise sales in its tax filings. Their Kickstarter "perks" do not include anything like DVDs or the patches that the Axanar campaigns offered. Indeed, STC made it clear in their letter to the IRS they would consider any type of DVD sales a violation of CBS copyright.
 
In case anyone was wondering, yes indeed, people are still contributing to Axanar's indiegogo.

Neil

[Link directly to crowdfunding campaign removed per board rules. GLS]
 
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Just wanted to reprint another paragraph from the Star Trek Continues tax filings because it sheds additional light on how a non-Axanar unlicensed production views the sale of DVDs (TCI refers to the former corporate name of STC):

Only if individuals were charging for the shows – say, selling DVDs of the shows – would TCI take action since that may be seen as violating CBS’ very liberal tolerance policies. TCI and
CBS would probably join forces if there were any dilution of the trademarks or reputation of show. For example, TCI would take immediate action against anyone who “spliced” pornographic material in between the actual scenes produced by TCI.

If I'm the CBS-Paramount lawyers, I can point to this and tell a judge, "See, they understood they could not sell DVDs of their unlicensed film, unlike Axanar, which did so in an underhanded manner by claiming it was a 'donor perk.'"

On another note, I have to ask: Is someone actually taking footage of Star Trek Continues--or any fan film, for that matter--and splicing it into porn? Because that would make me sad.
 
In case anyone was wondering, yes indeed, people are still contributing to Axanar's indiegogo.

Neil

Maybe I should create a Joel Kirk Foundation of Axanar Indiegogo or Kickstarter crowdfunding thingy. I need some cash for....whatever.:shifty: (I mean if people are giving money away all willy nilly).

For $5 you get to be my friend.

For $10...

lol...
 
As has been pointed out on the #IStandWithCBS Facebook group, Alec Peters is back on Reddit.

A few choice comments:
I was paid $ 38,000 in 2014-15 to work full time, which was at least 60 hours a week. So basically I was paid minimum wage. Sorry you think I should work for free, but non-profit does not mean "work for free".

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/startrek/c..._is_settled_is_there_anyone/cymc90z?context=3

As I have stated, I was paid $ 38,000 in 2014-15 to work full time, which was at least 60 hours a week. So basically I was paid minimum wage. So not even close to being overpaid.
But people have no clue that non-profit doesn't mean "volunteer".

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/startrek/c..._is_settled_is_there_anyone/cymcb4q?context=3

Since when did I resign? Your facts seem to be as bad as your opinions.
Tantrums to CBS? Want to provide proof?
And there are plenty of smart people working with me.
Geez.

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/startrek/c..._is_settled_is_there_anyone/cymceof?context=3

And finally with all this talk of 501 (c) filings:

Totally wrong. Axanar is NOT for profit and we are actually in process on applying to be a 501(c)3.
Alec Peters Executive Producer Axanar

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/startrek/c..._is_settled_is_there_anyone/cymc0rl?context=3

EDIT: SFC3 beat me to it by a few minutes. :)
 
One thing I don't get is that everyone in a lot of the articles keep making a big deal about the crowdfunding stuff for Axanar, but Renegades, and I think Continues both used crowdfunding, so obviously that isn't an issue. So is the issue just the fact that they made so much $ or the way the $ was used, or is the crowdfunding itself not actually an issue?

If it's a factor I think it's how the money is spent. Salaries for the producer on money raised based on IP you don't own = no no.

And you know.......the other guys are actually putting out some films.........Axanar has given us one scene for a million bucks.
 
Are they SERIOUSLY trying to file for non-profit status during the lawsuit? I'm no legal expert, but I can't imagine that going so well.
 
Are they SERIOUSLY trying to file for non-profit status during the lawsuit? I'm no legal expert, but I can't imagine that going so well.

Also someone who may be an Axanar Marine —hacksociety — has posted the full Financial Report in two threads in two subreddits:

1. https://www.reddit.com/r/scifi/comments/3zioi9/axanar_annual_finance_filing_submitted_by_alec/

2.
https://www.reddit.com/r/startrek/comments/3zin3h/axanar_annual_finance_filing/

Hacksociety asks that people upvote the second thread: "Upvote for visibility! Good or bad, this should be seen by everyone."

So much for keeping the annual report for donors' eyes only.
 
The people behind Axanar are paying themselves salaries out of donor money that was acquired through marketing that hinged on CBS IP. This, in my opinion, is the big one

I'm kind of amazed that people think it's proof of "pocketing money" for people to get salaries from working on a nonprofit venture. $38K a year is just $15K over the poverty line. It is not an outre salary for someone working on a nonprofit venture or proof that someone is being given money for doing nothing.

[Look, "non-profit" does not mean and has never meant that there is no income and nobody is paid. It makes people sound profoundly ignorant to talk that way and they should stop. Some of the people you're talking to work sixty-hour weeks in the fucking not-for-profit sector, you know? That's not how non-profit works, and indeed it would not be possible for non-profits to exist and function in any form anywhere if that was the standard. Nobody has alleged AFAIK, anyway, that Axanar's claims to be non-profit at present were false, and as has been correctly stated well previously in the thread, their paying people isn't interesting proof of wrongdoing.]

It seems quite clear, at any rate, that the question of profit or lack of it isn't really relevant to copyright infringement. What likely crossed the line for CBS was the sheer scale of the Axanar project and its self-portrayal as being more than a fan-film -- they were after all quite specific about citing that -- and very possibly its having demonstrated the capability (a la Prelude) to deliver a product that would actually be seen that way by some significant proportion of the public. (Some have theorized that the announcement that Ares Studios would be used to procure profit in future ventures, effectively blurring the lines between non-profit and for-profit capital fundraising, but I haven't read the full complaint yet so that's just guessing and at any rate I'm far from sure how major a factor it would really be, given the whole profit vs. non-profit thing being something of a sideshow, legally.)

When I believed CBS wasn't going to bring the hammer down, it was because I thought that Prelude would have been the obvious thing to bring the hammer down on. Which just goes to show that I was totally guessing (unsurprisingly) about how CBS legal thinks. Perhaps they were simply playing out the rope at that point the better to thoroughly make an example of Axanar in the long term, which given their insistence on a jury trial seems more plausible? But who knows. Lesson learned, I'm done guessing.
 
In case anyone was wondering, yes indeed, people are still contributing to Axanar's indiegogo.

Near as I can tell, their Indiegogo page says nothing about the lawsuit. The closest I can find is by following the link to their own web site, where the homepage has a tiny mention down in the blog section at the very bottom of the page, where not everyone will look. Oh, and one comment asking about it, with no replies.

This is amazingly shady. I'm wondering if the folks at Indiegogo are even aware that Axanar is under threat of an injunction with a high probability that said injunction will be granted in the next few weeks...

IMNSHO, the first thing the Axanar crew should have done is posted a warning about it on their Indiegogo page. Continuing to accept donations is one thing; but doing so without warning the donors about the legal issue is quite another. That they did not, suggests to me that they don't really care about the donors as long as they keep sending money.
 
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Near as I can tell, their Indiegogo page says nothing about the lawsuit.

Yeah, that's pretty fucked up. Either Axanar should have suspended it or Indiegogo should have done it for them by now, given this development. Failing to do so can only hurt them.
 
The people behind Axanar are paying themselves salaries out of donor money that was acquired through marketing that hinged on CBS IP. This, in my opinion, is the big one

I'm kind of amazed that people think it's proof of "pocketing money" for people to get salaries from working on a nonprofit venture. $38K a year is just $15K over the poverty line. It is not an outre salary for someone working on a nonprofit venture or proof that someone is being given money for doing nothing.

$38K alone isn't a huge salary. However, When that is what you report on paper, and you control the purse strings of the whole project and you pay for travel and other perks with donations it just leaves me with questions. Did he not think that would raise a few eyebrows? Maybe it is completely innocent, but given his reactions it makes me really glad I did not donate........
 
I'm kind of amazed that people think it's proof of "pocketing money" for people to get salaries from working on a nonprofit venture. $38K a year is just $15K over the poverty line. It is not an outre salary for someone working on a nonprofit venture or proof that someone is being given money for doing nothing.

One Rule, always stood out.... If CBS was clear about anything, was, if, you, the fan, was going to make a "fan film" then you couldn't make money.

I don't care if Peters took $38k, $100k or just $1.00, he drew a salary as producer, he made money...

And the inevitable question to follow, "You do expect him to do this for free do you?" my response, If the guy wants to play with CBS IP and make a fanfilm and not make money
, That's his choice, not mine....
 
The people behind Axanar are paying themselves salaries out of donor money that was acquired through marketing that hinged on CBS IP. This, in my opinion, is the big one

I'm kind of amazed that people think it's proof of "pocketing money" for people to get salaries from working on a nonprofit venture. $38K a year is just $15K over the poverty line. It is not an outre salary for someone working on a nonprofit venture or proof that someone is being given money for doing nothing.

If we were talking about the legal definition of "non-profit", that would be entirely correct, but we aren't. We're talking about the assumed CBS position of "you can't make a profit".

There is a massive difference between the two.

The more correct standard is, "did the guy who decided to make the film, come away from the venture with more money than he started with?"

In Axanar's case, the answer is decidedly "yes".

I actually question the idea of starting any kind of corporation (non-profit or otherwise) to make fan films without written approval from CBS. In my (NOT A LAWYER) opinion, corporations can't be fans, again, non-profit or otherwise.

In the case of ST:C, it appears that they're only doing it to ensure that the rules are followed and good records kept, so it's probably a net positive for them. They seem to have a relationship with CBS, so there's probably already an understanding there. Can't really say, and I would love it if they would chime in on this, but I've no idea if any of their crew even reads here. :)
 
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