"As you believe, so shall you do, so shall you do. As you believe, so shall you do, so shall you do..."
CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar
- Thread starter Richard Baker
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"As you believe, so shall you do, so shall you do. As you believe, so shall you do, so shall you do..."
Thanks. I specifically meant CBS go after them for enabling this.
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Amaris
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Apparently, I'm being paid to sow doubt amongst the ranks, if some of their suspicions are to be believed.
Et tu, comrade?
Reply yes, and give a long winded explanation about how communism is great.
A
Amaris
Guest
Same here.
Make sure you tie it into how Trek's future is basically communism as well. That will make him blow a gasket.
Oh sorry. I'm not sure. CBS/Paramount may be looking at Indiegogo and Kickstarter as being kind of second down the line, as it were (like not just the coffee company, but also the carpenters who may have built the sets, etc.). They (Kickstarter and Indiegogo) didn't start this mess, although they did benefit from it.
It's possible CBS/Paramount is looking to force Axanar's hand to implead Kickstarter and Indiegogo, let them take the lead on discovery if it comes to that, etc. This also, like I said, sets up Peters as the bad guy to Indiegogo and Kickstarter, which may also be a part of what CBS/Paramount would like to see happen. It would certainly assure this became a lot less likely to happen again.
Oh, that's RIGHT. I forgot, Kickstarter gets fees for every donation. They profited quite a bit from Star Trek's IP.
There are too many elements for that to work. Im sure if you add up all the fan films its more then Axanar. There is something CBS knows that we do not know.
So I hope over time that we find out more.
I do wonder why CBS/Paramount haven't went after them?
Because they need to do a kickstarter to raise the money to start a suit against kickstarter
I'm not a lawyer, so I'll wait for what jespah says about this, but: it seems to me that Kickstarter, IndieGoGo, etc, may be protected by some of the same regulation that protects banks and credit card companies somehow. Financial institutions have to have some sort of equivalent of the safe harbor laws that apply to search engines (that keep them from legal responsibility for search results) for their fees and for managing transactions or VISA would be on the hook every time someone uses one of their cards to pay for an "escort". 
Maybe CBS/Paramount looked the other way..maybe they have no problem with fan films, unless something is up with one of them.
You have major prop forums and people make money off replica props. Studios tend to look away, because one they are ok with a little money being made.
You would also have to look over the rules with the fund taking site, to see if there is any loopholes...etc
I'm not a lawyer, so I'll wait for what jespah says about this, but: it seems to me that Kickstarter, IndieGoGo, etc, may be protected by some of the same regulation that protects banks and credit card companies somehow. Financial institutions have to have some sort of equivalent of the safe harbor laws that apply to search engines (that keep them from legal responsibility for search results) for their fees and for managing transactions or VISA would be on the hook every time someone uses one of their cards to pay for an "escort".
I really don't know, and I'd rather not speculate.
Both crowdfunding sites mention that the users have to show they aren't infringing on another's IP.
Indiegogo: https://www.indiegogo.com/about/terms "User Content ... Each User represents and warrants that its User Content and our use of such User Content will not infringe any third party's intellectual property rights, proprietary rights, privacy rights, confidentiality, rights of publicity or otherwise violate these Terms or applicable law."
Kickstarter: https://www.kickstarter.com/terms-of-use "11. How We Deal with Copyright Issues ... We reserve the right to delete or disable content alleged to be infringing, and to terminate accounts for repeat infringers."
Plus Kickstarter's Copyright Policy: https://www.kickstarter.com/help/copyright "Kickstarter has adopted a policy of, in appropriate circumstances, terminating user accounts that are repeat infringers of the intellectual property rights of others. Kickstarter also may terminate user accounts based on even a single infringement."
I encourage you to draw your own conclusions - a Terms of Service document is not going to supercede law or legal precedent, but if Kickstarter and Indiegogo are profiting from infringements and not doing anything to stop that, then I'd say they might want to consult with counsel.
I'd e-mail him back with this link:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pG6taS9R1KM
[yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pG6taS9R1KM[/yt]
A
Amaris
Guest
In other words, Alec's actions may be getting a lot of other people in hot water right about now.I'm not a lawyer, so I'll wait for what jespah says about this, but: it seems to me that Kickstarter, IndieGoGo, etc, may be protected by some of the same regulation that protects banks and credit card companies somehow. Financial institutions have to have some sort of equivalent of the safe harbor laws that apply to search engines (that keep them from legal responsibility for search results) for their fees and for managing transactions or VISA would be on the hook every time someone uses one of their cards to pay for an "escort".
I really don't know, and I'd rather not speculate.
Both crowdfunding sites mention that the users have to show they aren't infringing on another's IP.
Indiegogo: https://www.indiegogo.com/about/terms "User Content ... Each User represents and warrants that its User Content and our use of such User Content will not infringe any third party's intellectual property rights, proprietary rights, privacy rights, confidentiality, rights of publicity or otherwise violate these Terms or applicable law."
Kickstarter: https://www.kickstarter.com/terms-of-use "11. How We Deal with Copyright Issues ... We reserve the right to delete or disable content alleged to be infringing, and to terminate accounts for repeat infringers."
Plus Kickstarter's Copyright Policy: https://www.kickstarter.com/help/copyright "Kickstarter has adopted a policy of, in appropriate circumstances, terminating user accounts that are repeat infringers of the intellectual property rights of others. Kickstarter also may terminate user accounts based on even a single infringement."
I encourage you to draw your own conclusions - a Terms of Service document is not going to supercede law or legal precedent, but if Kickstarter and Indiegogo are profiting from infringements and not doing anything to stop that, then I'd say they might want to consult with counsel.
I'm not a lawyer, so I'll wait for what jespah says about this, but: it seems to me that Kickstarter, IndieGoGo, etc, may be protected by some of the same regulation that protects banks and credit card companies somehow. Financial institutions have to have some sort of equivalent of the safe harbor laws that apply to search engines (that keep them from legal responsibility for search results) for their fees and for managing transactions or VISA would be on the hook every time someone uses one of their cards to pay for an "escort".
I really don't know, and I'd rather not speculate.
Both crowdfunding sites mention that the users have to show they aren't infringing on another's IP.
Indiegogo: https://www.indiegogo.com/about/terms "User Content ... Each User represents and warrants that its User Content and our use of such User Content will not infringe any third party's intellectual property rights, proprietary rights, privacy rights, confidentiality, rights of publicity or otherwise violate these Terms or applicable law."
Kickstarter: https://www.kickstarter.com/terms-of-use "11. How We Deal with Copyright Issues ... We reserve the right to delete or disable content alleged to be infringing, and to terminate accounts for repeat infringers."
Plus Kickstarter's Copyright Policy: https://www.kickstarter.com/help/copyright "Kickstarter has adopted a policy of, in appropriate circumstances, terminating user accounts that are repeat infringers of the intellectual property rights of others. Kickstarter also may terminate user accounts based on even a single infringement."
I encourage you to draw your own conclusions - a Terms of Service document is not going to supercede law or legal precedent, but if Kickstarter and Indiegogo are profiting from infringements and not doing anything to stop that, then I'd say they might want to consult with counsel.
I'd point out Peters and Burnett have talked at length about how they were actually persuaded to switch from Kickstarter to Indiegogo. So this wasn't just a case of Indiegogo passively accepting Axanar's business. There were definitely meetings of some type where they had to have explained what they were doing to Indiegogo.
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