Can JJ Abrams learn anything from Russell T Davies?

[Kelso]

^ Now, that would be a dream come true.

To quote myself...

Well, I'd like for Trek to get a producer who genuinely loves and respects the history of the franchise... but is a savvy enough producer to completely ignore it and make something better.

So, yes.

 

[bentbastard]

Holytomato said:


Translation: "Oh, my god!!!! Now there are f&gs in Doctor Who!!!!"

Actually we are everywhere ... be afraid very afraid ...

 

[zenophite]

Holytomato said:
"I used to consider myself a massive Dr Who fan before 2005. Much of the New Series, I can't bear to watch again such is my unhappiness with Russell T. Davies' style of writing..."

Translation: "Oh, my god!!!! Now there are f&gs in Doctor Who!!!!"

Maybe it just means that people don't think Russell Davies take on the Doctor is all that great.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

zenophite said:
Maybe it just means that people don't think Russell Davies take on the Doctor is all that great.

Well, it is a very popular series, but of course you can't please everyone.

 

[seigezunt]

well, I guess I should have expected some of the RTD hate. But that said, the new series is a huge hit, so JJ, who no doubt will also be as hated if the new Trek is as successful, might stand to learn something.

 

[zenophite]

seigezunt said:
well, I guess I should have expected some of the RTD hate. But that said, the new series is a huge hit, so JJ, who no doubt will also be as hated if the new Trek is as successful, might stand to learn something.

I fail to see how one makes the leap from disliking his work to hate.

 

[seigezunt]

well, calling his work "pap" ain't heavy on the lovin'

 

[zenophite]

seigezunt said:
well, calling his work "pap" ain't heavy on the lovin'

that's true, but the comment is about his work after all

 

[evilalienbraga]

Hopefully, nowt. Santa Claus robots? Pig faced and cat faced men? No thanks. 'Who' is daft. Minor tragedy as a Brit, to now see Who in the ascendence while Trek languishes in the toilet. It was so different just a few years ago! If you think there may be a lack of interest in Trek at the moment in the USA, it's ten times worse in the UK.
"A segment of fandom that seems to hate the idea of the show becoming commercial again, or ever."
-I do worry about this statement because, while I have no problem with Trek being commercial, I hope that making Trek popular doesn't mean a jettison of its ideals - make Trek too gritty (which is what 'commercial' often means) and I genuinely believe it won't really be Trek anymore. DS9 walked this line but managed to just about stay on the right side of Roddenberry's ideal (being set on a non-Federation station helped).

 

[evilalienbraga]

Skye said:
Same goes for Star Trek TOS, it's a family show that with later incarnations became more for the sci-fi geeks.

I would suggest the opposite *if* you're referring to TNG being the 'later incarnation'. TNG was much more of a soap opera or costume drama, (and much more popular than TOS) TOS had more hard SF concepts in it (and TNG often gets criticised for this very fact - it just can't win!). My dad (big soap watcher) went through a period of watching TNG, he wouldn't touch TOS.

 

[GoofCustom]

Trek has had pig faced and cat-faced aliens plenty of times, I believe.


It could be said that the problem with recent Trek is very similar to that of WHO in the mid-to-late 80s: It stopped being about entertainment, and started trying to cater to being a fan/sci-fi only show with wacked-out hard sci-fi concepts such as telebiogenesis and block transfer computation. I believe Lalla Ward, one of the companion actresses, said it best when confronting one of the show's script editors in a recent commentary: "You took all the fun out of it, and you made it for sci-fi nerds".

 

[Holytomato]

[/QUOTE]
"If you chase a cult you just become a smaller cult. If a cult fan hates this series it means they will only watch it 20 times instead of 30 times."
-Russell T Davies, 2005

[/QUOTE]

Exactly.

Campy means, "It takes itself too seriously. Make it crappy."

Oh, look, its another "Star Trek XI sucks because :insert what you hate here:" thread.

Yes, please sick the mods on me.

 

[Akiraprise]

^ What do you mean? I don't understand.

 

[GoofCustom]

I think he's saying the new Doctor Who is too campy.


But seriously, the show has always been campy, but like the old show there are serious episodes (Dalek, Blink etc.) mixed in with the camp (Pretty much most of RTD's written episodes).

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

RTD and Trek...well that would certainly give a boost to the K/S thing.

 

[seigezunt]

Holytomato said:
Oh, look, its another "Star Trek XI sucks because :insert what you hate here:" thread.

Certainly wasn't my intention when I started it. I like both Classic and NuWho, and I think RTD has quite an affection for the classic show, which he brought back to turn into a huge hit, whatever the so-called purists have to say.

I am imagining that if ST is revived with a similar nod but not slavery to the old show, it might be just as enjoyable, and piss off just as many people, while still entertaining millions.

I expect I will enjoy ST XI when it comes out. I'm a TOS fan since 1970-ish, and I'm assuming JJ is going to have to play with it a bit.

I just thought the Dr. Who comparison was appropriate, as both shows have a relationship with the fans, where fans are both feircely loyal, and slavishness to them has hurt the franchise in the past.

 

[Holytomato]

"I just thought the Dr. Who comparison was appropriate, as both shows have a relationship with the fans, where fans are both feircely loyal, and slavishness to them has hurt the franchise in the past."

and I agree. :thumbsup:

Anytime, anyone mentions liking something that came after Star Trek TOS, it turns into,

"Star Trek XI sucks because :insert what you hate here:" thread.

 

[Tomalak]

Barbados Slim said:
Also, Davies is innovative in casting. Rose's boyfriend, Catherine Tate's groom and Sally Sparrow's cop-crush were played by black men without it being relevent to the story.

Casting a black guy in a non-stereotypical role is "innovative"?

 

[Tomalak]

ChristopherPike said:
Not very subtle, stereotypical references to gay character types such as loving Musical Theatre and other camp portrayals which are best left to Are You Being Being Served or Little Britain. Strange from the writer who pioneered a realistic view of the topic in the '90s.

I don't agree. Consider how shocking Queer as Folk was at the time, and look at Captain Jack today - a mainstream gay or bisexual character in a family programme, to which there has been little resistance. Even the Dail Mail has been fairly quiet. We've come a long way in the last decade.



I think the new Doctor Who is a good template - it's got a back to basics approach, with a very contemporary feel, yet acknowledging the past. As far as I can tell, that's exactly the direction this new Star Trek film is going.

 

[PKTrekGirl]

Tomalak said:

Barbados Slim said:
Also, Davies is innovative in casting. Rose's boyfriend, Catherine Tate's groom and Sally Sparrow's cop-crush were played by black men without it being relevent to the story.

Casting a black guy in a non-stereotypical role is "innovative"?

Well, I certainly wouldn't call it 'innovative'...but put it this way: inter-racial romance, especially if it is not one of the issues actually meant to be addressed in the show, is not something that Americans see on TV every day.

Maybe this poster is mistaking what is fairly normal on British TV for what is not nearly as much so in American TV.