Bread and Circuses episode

[Nebusj]

I mean they could have had Gill introduce an authoritarian system to civilize the Ekotions without having him stupid enough to use exact Nazi slogans & uniforms. Then simply say, "He has attempted to bring order to this society by advancing a draconian police state"
That's way better than, this week, Nazis in space!

So that we get the shocking visual image of seeing that this planet we never heard of before has streets draped in ... DUN Dun dun ... green-blue-and-orange tricolors with tilted-diamond icons over them. And everyone in the audience turns to whoever they're watching with and asks why the music just did its tension hook there.

If they had more screen time maybe they could establish a unique set of symbols, methodology, techniques and such and then also establish how this was different from whatever the Ekosians had before Gill's interference. But a swastika on the alien planet establishes the same thing in about as long as it takes the eye to register the image. So, you'd need some compelling character or plot reason for Gill to whip up his original scheme.

Perhaps they could have done some synthesis of images of the various great totalitarian regimes of Earth history, although, would Space-Nazi-Communist-Fascist-Persian-Spartans be any more coherent?

 

[guardian]

^^What??

Some folks hate the paralell Earth thing entirely
Some folks hate that they use exact Earth tie-ins right down to every detail.

You sound like you like these papralell stories. Great!

But for folks in those first two catagories they might have preferred to have it toned down.
In 'Private little...." & "Friday's...." they showed humanoids with pre 20th centure tech. and told decent stories.

I never liked the gangster era, roman era, nazi era stories.
They struck me as what they were--cost-savers.

In the two episodes i just mentioned they had to solve particular problems related to the planets they were on.

in the'nazi' episode it was simply, oh boy, we've got to end evil society
in the 'gangster' episode, oy boy we've got to solve this mess we made

They were simply gimmicks--I for one don't like them.
Although almost all the TOS episodes had some redeeming points.

 

[siskokid888]

I always felt that the ep was ment to be a satire on current culture and especially TV culture. The silly religeous stuff was seemingly thrown in as an afterthought. It does contain the pentultimate Spock/McCoy scene, which is almost out of place in the middle of this episode.

 

[Bak_and_Blue]

^^ good call. It was a comment on TV, IMO.

 

[guardian]

Oh it was a satire on the state of TV in the 60s???

I had never heard that.

 

[Mallory]

That was sure my take on it when I watched it for the first time.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Mine too. When that one line about "You bring this network's ratings down...and we'll do a SPECIAL on you!" came on, I just started laughing.

 

[Sector 7]

IMHO, like all TOS episodes, this one (and those like it) are best understood when taken in context of the 1960's. Star Trek was GR's vehicle for morality plays depicting the current human condition. He got away with it because it was "science fiction".
GR could comment on Nazism on TV and get it past the censors.
GR could comment on the Vietnam war and get it past the censors.
Slavery, racism, he addressed many moral issues and got away with it BECAUSE it was science fiction.
I love TOS, but taken in proper context, it is easier to understand why GR and company did what they did.
Being a Christian I liked the tie-in to my own faith being shown on national television. It was a different time back then, I didn't have to be ashamed to be proud of my faith and neither did GR.
I also loved the interaction between Spock and McCoy. It's one of the better scenes in TOS.

 

[guardian]

"Comment on Nazism and get it past the censors...." ??????????

You mean the network wouldn't have wanted a negative portrayal of Nazism except in a sci-fi context????

The Nazis were being bashed on almost every drama series in the 1960s. Mission Impossible did a dozen shows on Nazism in a contemporary setting.

By the way, by the late 1960s, GR had long since abandoned christianity and he wasn't promoting his beliefs---he was pandering to the majority of the 1960s audience.

 

[idreamedmusic]

By the way, by the late 1960s, GR had long since abandoned christianity and he wasn't promoting his beliefs---he was pandering to the majority of the 1960s audience.

That blatant plug for Christianity at the end is the only thing I don't like about the ep, really. Well, and some of the stupidity of first blatantly outlining the Prime Directive for the audience and then going in with phasers and tricorder clearly visible, etc.

But I do like the satirical aspect when it comes to contemporary tv, as well as the character moments throughout.

One thing that always made me wonder though was Shatner breaking the fourth wall a couple of times where he looks directly at the camera. Wonder how that came about.

 

[Maurice]

My problem with these kids of episodes was that they were never clever enough in their re-use of costumes and props. Sure, DO Nazis in space, but use OTHER stock costumes and slap swastika armbands on them. A Sir Francis Drake doublet with an SS insignia is shocking AND feels more alien than aliens in perfect copies of Nazi uniforms...and it doesn't cost more.

 

[siskokid888]

Oh it was a satire on the state of TV in the 60s???

I had never heard that.

Not just the 60's, but a rather forward looking take on where TV was headed - gladitorial games and executions on live TV - we are not far from that now. And the title - Bread and Circuses - from the Roman adage that give the masses plenty of food and entertainment - "bread and circuses" - and they will ignore the real problems engulfing them. A very accurate assessment of the state of American culture today.

 

[RookieBatman]

Being a Christian I liked the tie-in to my own faith being shown on national television. It was a different time back then, I didn't have to be ashamed to be proud of my faith and neither did GR.

I agree completely, especially from the standpoint of today being much more atheistic/agnostic, it's nice that Christianity gets one little shout-out in TOS. But as the other poster said, that wasn't based on Roddenberry's personal beliefs. It was probably someone like Gene Coon.

 

[dougkeenan]

Kirk is lethal with both sword and machine gun. "This is not an academy training test."

 

[Nebusj]

Not just the 60's, but a rather forward looking take on where TV was headed - gladitorial games and executions on live TV - we are not far from that now. And the title - Bread and Circuses - from the Roman adage that give the masses plenty of food and entertainment - "bread and circuses" - and they will ignore the real problems engulfing them. A very accurate assessment of the state of American culture today.

And that's certainly noteworthy satire because no previous generation had ever been accused of being so absorbed with hedonistic pleasure and self-satisfaction that it is ignoring the very real problems which face it and thus setting civilization up for imminent doom.

 

[Ward Fowler]

In the cell, I always imagine Spock getting frustrated with McCoy, bashing his head in with a meal tray, making McCoy his bitch, and selling McCoy to the other prisoners for smokes.

Joe, watches too much "Oz"

I think that actually happened in the remastered version.

 

[siskokid888]

Not just the 60's, but a rather forward looking take on where TV was headed - gladitorial games and executions on live TV - we are not far from that now. And the title - Bread and Circuses - from the Roman adage that give the masses plenty of food and entertainment - "bread and circuses" - and they will ignore the real problems engulfing them. A very accurate assessment of the state of American culture today.

And that's certainly noteworthy satire because no previous generation had ever been accused of being so absorbed with hedonistic pleasure and self-satisfaction that it is ignoring the very real problems which face it and thus setting civilization up for imminent doom.

"Noteworthy" not in originality, but in the fact that a 60s TV show (on a TV populated by "Bewitched" and "My Mother the Car") actually addressed the issue. Didn't mean to upset you by pointing out the obvious

 

[Brannigan]

I watched this episode last night because of the talk of it, and its not a bad episode. I think its better than alot of the other Earth/Alien Parallels of the second season (Omega Glory, Patterns of Force). I like alot of the subtitle humor, as many have suggested about TV at the time and also some of the double entedre humor: "They threw me a few curves", Kirk about Drusilla, or "The thoughts of one man to another could not possibly interest you" by claudius to Merik and Merik's odd glance back at him (possible undertones?).
It was Kirks line about Drusilla that got me thinking: we often wonder about Kirk's seducing and such, but did he have relations with Drusilla? It seems that he might have going by the scenes and dialogue. They kiss at the dinner table and the scene fades away. The next scene Kirk appears to have been sleeping, and Claudius says to him: "So far on this planet we've kept you rather busy. I don't wonder you slept through the afternoon." Further claudius says: "Because you are a man, I gave you some last hours as a man" and Kirk responds that he appreciates that gesture.
So I guess the question is, do we chalk this up as a win for Kirk (sorry to be so crude).

 

[DevilintheDark]

Ofcourse Kirk banged her.The christiany is the only part that really bothered me too, it was alomst as bad as the cheesey references in the omega glory..almost.Arent/wasnt GR, Shatner and Nimoy jews?If so its obviously not the influence of the shows creator and two of the three main stars.

 

[idreamedmusic]

So I guess the question is, do we chalk this up as a win for Kirk (sorry to be so crude).

No, I think you are totally right, just going by your quotes from the ep.
I think the fade-away is the most telling in that regard, though. You have to keep in mind the strict censorship rules and using a fade to black like that was a really common way of showing passage of time as well as implying that "something" happened. Just off the top of my head, a similar instance occurred in "The Maltese Falcon" where we go from Sam Spade flirting heavily with a bookstore clerk, her undoing her hair and voila - fade to black - return to "some time later". The connotations are pretty obvious there and I guess "Bread and Circuses" was even less subtle.

As for Merik, Memory Alpha quotes the same sentence as you and draws these conclusions:

Claudius' dismissive line to Merik ("The thoughts of one man to another could not possibly interest you!") is fraught with multiple meanings. It apparently conveys Claudius' disgust for the former SS Beagle captain, who sold out his crew and allowed them to die in the arena. It could also signal Claudius' hidden esteem for Kirk, who, unlike Merik, is willing to die for his beliefs. It might also signal Claudius' contempt for Merik's possible homosexuality – a common predilection of Earth's noble Romans.

Before reading that, the possible connotations re homosexuality never crossed my mind and I was under the impressions that the Romans were anything but damning about that. Not quite to the extent of the Greek ideal of true love, but still.

Ofcourse Kirk banged her.The christiany is the only part that really bothered me too, it was alomst as bad as the cheesey references in the omega glory..almost.Arent/wasnt GR, Shatner and Nimoy jews?If so its obviously not the influence of the shows creator and two of the three main stars.

Good point. That actually adds a whole new level of irony to that particular episode if it was indeed something they had to add because it was the only form of religion that could be portrayed in a positive light on tv.
And yes, Shatner, Nimoy and Koenig are indeed Jewish.