Batman...

[Greg Cox]

Although if they are in continuity, that does leave the question of how Harvey Dent turned from a suave African-American into a craggy-faced Caucasian.

"My gosh, that was really powerful acid they threw at his face, wasn't it?"

Complete with a bleaching agent . . . .

 

[Admiral James Kirk]

The tragedy isn't the scars on Harvey Dent's face. The tragedy is that Harvey Dent went from looking like Billy Dee Williams to looking like Tommy Lee Jones. Poor bastard.

 

[Dick Whitman]

Well if you want a somewhat rational explanation Harvey Dent could have been suffering from Vitiligo. As he started to slowly lose his skin pigmentation he covered small light spots with dark makeup to match his natural complexion. But as it progressed the majority of his face was without his natural color so he started to cover the dark spots. So he did not need his whole face covered with makeup. This is how people with the condition sometimes deal with it.

Imagine the added effect of having acid thrown onto half of your face if you already had Vitiligo. He had lost most of his natural complexion and now he had permanent scars too. Talk about the loss of identity and psychological damage!

I know none of this is in the movies, buts its an interesting way of tying two actors playing the same role in the same continuity together.

 

[Silvercrest]

But yeah, I guess I kind of see your point. Certainly between Returns and Forever there must've been one hell of an architecture boom, with an emphasis on gigantic Art Deco statues and neon lighting.

After the theatrics of Batman, the Joker, the Penguin, and Catwoman parading through the city, it inspired the city go arty in a big way. They started by installing neon everywhere.

Although if they are in continuity, that does leave the question of how Harvey Dent turned from a suave African-American into a craggy-faced Caucasian

He didn't. The art lights just make him look that way.

 

[Aragorn]

Although if they are in continuity, that does leave the question of how Harvey Dent turned from a suave African-American into a craggy-faced Caucasian.

Henry Harvey Dent was in Batman.

Harvey Bartholomew Dent was in Batman Forever.

 

[Admiral James Kirk]

 

[DWF]

I just finished rewatching the '89 movie and I think it still holds up. I didn't like it al that much when it first came out, but I've come to think that Tim Burton was trying for a more operatic approach, with the big sets and dystopian setting of Gotham and I think it works better if you think it it in those terms.

 

[Christopher]

At the time, ...Forever was viewed as the third Batman film, the sequel to Batman and Batman Returns. But I think that had it been made today, then it would have been described as a reboot - different actor, different director, different tone, different look for Gotham, different soundtrack, different Batmobile, different costume, etc.

Except it carried forward the same Alfred and Commissioner Gordon. As far as I know, the only series reboot that's brought back an actor from the former incarnation in the same role is the James Bond reboot (with Dame Judi Dench). Unless you believe the security guard Lou Ferrigno played in The Incredible Hulk is the same one he played in Hulk.

 

[Dick Whitman]

Agreed. The Burton and Schumacher films are in the same continuity the same way Dr. No, On Her Majesty's Secret Service, Live and Let Die, The Living Daylights, and Goldeneye are.

 

[Marc]

The tragedy isn't the scars on Harvey Dent's face. The tragedy is that Harvey Dent went from looking like Billy Dee Williams to looking like Tommy Lee Jones. Poor bastard.

Read once that Billy Dee Williams took the roll of Dent in Batman because down the track he'd get to do the transition to Two-Face?

 

[Aragorn]

Read once that Billy Dee Williams took the roll of Dent in Batman because down the track he'd get to do the transition to Two-Face?

Maybe he would've gotten to play Two-Face if Batman Forever had been Burton's movie. Chris O'Donnell said when he joined the movie, Michael Keaton was supposed to play Batman and Robin Williams was supposed to play Riddler. I remember reading somewhere that Rene Russo was going to be the female lead until Val Kilmer took over.

 

[Admiral James Kirk]

I remember Billy Dee doing talk shows in 89 saying: "I took the part because something is going to happen to my character down the line... but I can't talk about it right now." He knew all about Two Face from the start. I knew what he was hinting at because I knew all about Two Face and was excited to see Lando Calrissian in the part.

As for Michael Keaton and Batman Forever... from what I remember Michael Keaton decided not to do Forever pretty late in the game. I think they made Robin Williams an offer to play the Riddler but he turned them down. No idea why.

Personally I thought Kilmer was a cool choice. Just look at his build in that movie. He was friggin' built! He did a lot of the fight scenes himself! There was no close up of Kilmer and then a quick cut away to a long shot so the stunt man could do the fight. Kilmer was kicking, punching, running, jumping in a 300 pound rubber suit!

I don't care if you like BF or not but Kilmer was fucking impressive! Didn't care much for his Bruce Wayne though.

 

[Aragorn]

I remember reading this but have no idea if there's any validity to it, but it said Christopher Walken's role in Batman Returns was originally supposed to be Dent in the story and the electricity thing at the end is what would've turned him into Two-Face.

 

[Admiral James Kirk]

I've never heard that.

 

[Aragorn]

Well I'm pretty sure I didn't read it in a magazine, so it's possible someone just made that up.

 

[Dick Whitman]

I have also read that an early script revealed that Max Shreck was the Penguin's older brother.

 

[the G-man]

The tragedy isn't the scars on Harvey Dent's face. The tragedy is that Harvey Dent went from looking like Billy Dee Williams to looking like Tommy Lee Jones. Poor bastard.

Read once that Billy Dee Williams took the roll of Dent in Batman because down the track he'd get to do the transition to Two-Face?

IIRC, they had to buy Williams' contract out to cast Jones in BF

 

[Admiral James Kirk]

Same thing happened with Marlon Wayans. Wayans was cast as Robin in Batman Returns but his part was cut. He was still contracted for another Batman movie so Warners had to pay him off so they could cast Chris O'Donnell as Robin.

 

[Mr. Adventure]

The 1989 Batman had a very Burton-esque flavour to it, but Batman Returns is not only very theatrical yet also pure umistakably Tim Burton. Everything is exaggerated and over exaggerated. There is no subtlety whatsoever. Watching this is like watching a live-action cartoon, and in this context I don’t mean that in a good way.

My understanding is that after the success of the first film, Burton was given more freedom with the second, which is why it looks even more Burton-esque. I liked it when I first saw it too, but looking back, it's a bit much. I agree on that. And what was with the slush that looked like whipcream?

I had the opposite occur, I didn't think much if the movie but watched it last year as "Tim Burton's Batman" and really enjoyed it. Taken as such it's a really fun confection. It might help that I grew up with Batman since the 70s but didn't really know him from the comics.

You could probably say the same about Schumacher's films being uniquely his as well but it's not a vision I found so compelling.

 

[Aldo]

The tragedy isn't the scars on Harvey Dent's face. The tragedy is that Harvey Dent went from looking like Billy Dee Williams to looking like Tommy Lee Jones. Poor bastard.

Read once that Billy Dee Williams took the roll of Dent in Batman because down the track he'd get to do the transition to Two-Face?

I recall reading he was contracted for sequels. So when they decided to bring in Jones for Two-Face, they had to buy out his contract.