Spoilers Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice - Grading & Discussion

[Commander Richard]

Nothing motivates me here, nothing makes me feel like I've finally seen Superman on the big-screen like I want to see him and, really, nothing really makes me look forward to further entries into the DC-CU or a JLA movie.

Justice League Part I will have a lighter tone.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

A few questions to those who may have answers...

Since when does Clark ever refer to his mother as Martha anyway? Especially to a someone who has never heard of her before?

Perhaps Supes was keeping in character by not referring to Martha as his mother. The same way he calls Lois, "Ms. Lane", even though they're intimate with eachother. Supes did come to Batman saying he needed help to save someone, but then Batman started attacking him. Maybe by saying the name, it would get Batman's attention that someone actually was in danger.

Unless I'm forgetting it, why does the Kryptonian ship now have fingerprint recognition when it didn't before? How come it tried to kill Clark and Lois but invited Lex to be it's new boss?

ummmm... 34% damage and the ship not being picky? Haha idk.

Why did Lex need to add his blood to the Doomsday mix? Wouldn't being part human make him weaker than Superman? How did Lex plan to control Doomsday? His plan is to kill Superman with a being that is much more dangerous and out of control?

The blood addition could've been a homage to the times Luthor has created clones of Superman (mostly Bizarros and Superboy), using his own DNA as a bonding agent.

Perhaps the fresh blood helped rejuvenate Zod's body for the restoration/mutation process. Since Zod had been dead for some 18 months after MOS.

Luthor never has any plans to control his genetic mutants and Bizarro's. He's a mad, mad scientist like that. Haha.


No real answers, just my speculations.

 

[JD]

I was thinking back over the movie the other day, and I realized something. Up until the big fight, Superman doesn't really do anything. His storyline is pretty much just people reacting to him, and him reacting to them reacting to him, but he doesn't really do anything. Most of the big story beats come from Bruce/Batman.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

I was thinking back over the movie the other day, and I realized something. Up until the big fight, Superman doesn't really do anything. His storyline is pretty much just people reacting to him, and him reacting to them reacting to him, but he doesn't really do anything. Most of the big story beats come from Bruce/Batman.

Yeah, BvS was definitely a Batman movie.

 

[Commander Richard]

Ben Affleck even got top billing.

 

[Aldo]

I was thinking back over the movie the other day, and I realized something. Up until the big fight, Superman doesn't really do anything. His storyline is pretty much just people reacting to him, and him reacting to them reacting to him, but he doesn't really do anything. Most of the big story beats come from Bruce/Batman.

Yeah, one of my issues with the movie is that for the majority of it, Superman is just a plot device.

I heard that Zack revealed that all the Batman stuff survived the editing room, so I'm thinking we'll get more Superman stuff in the Ultimate cut.

 

[Mr Light]

I took Lex adding his blood to Doomsday just as his hubris.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

So I just checked RT and BvS is down to 28%. Going forward, what do you think WB should do?

Should they tailor make their films to not offend critics (most of whom I assume are internet journalist or bloggers nowadays) or should they continue making films for audiences (who mostly have responded positively to MOS and BVS) but tighten up some of the weak spots of their films?

Tricky situation to be sure.

 

[Commander Richard]

There's time to tweak things a bit and it looks like that's already happening with the next movie.

 

[Skywalker]

They could try the Marvel way and make movies that are both critical darlings and money-making crowd-pleasers.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

They could try the Marvel way and make movies that are both critical darlings and money-making crowd-pleasers.

That's the thing though. DC movies are crowd pleasers, but the biggest stickler with critics isn't that they aren't funny (I say funny but really humor is a subjective concept), and is too much a of drama. It's like critics don't want there to be variety among the superhero films. Everything has to be action comedies, like the Marvel movies.

Also there is the 'thing' of Marvel ostensibly making the same movie, over and over again.

 

[Skywalker]

That's the thing though. DC movies are crowd pleasers, but the biggest stickler with critics isn't that they aren't funny (I say funny but really humor is a subjective concept), and is too much a of drama. It's like critics don't want there to be variety among the superhero films. Everything has to be action comedies, like the Marvel movies.

Also there is the 'thing' of Marvel ostensibly making the same movie, over and over again.

Which is completely incorrect.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

Which is completely incorrect.

To an extent, yes. The outliers being the two Captain America movies, Thor 1 and The Incredible Hulk. Of those 4 (out 12 movies) no one would argue that Thor 1, Captain America TFA and The Incredible Hulk are top of the totem pole comic book movies. The Winter Soldier is Marvel's best so far for a reason.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

That's the thing though. DC movies are crowd pleasers...

DC movies are divisive and split the audiences harshly and extremely down the middle. I wouldn't necessarily call them crowd pleasers, though surely, many people in the crowd are pleased.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

DC movies are divisive and split the audiences harshly and extremely down the middle. I wouldn't necessarily call them crowd pleasers, though surely, many people in the crowd are pleased.

Look at how much money MOS raked in at the BO and on home video. I would say the crowd was pleased and went back for second and possibly thirds.

http://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Man-of-Steel#tab=summary

 

[Aldo]

They could try the Marvel way and make movies that are both critical darlings and money-making crowd-pleasers.

Why? I mean I'm a huge Marvel fan, I've admitted this many times in the past.

But I think the best thing for DC to do, is there own thing. While I wasn't a huge fan of MoS, I really like BvS and love how this universe is in stark contrast to the one presented in the MCU. In fact with this movie I'm super pumped for Justice League and anything else DC/WB puts out.

 

[Skywalker]

Why? I mean I'm a huge Marvel fan, I've admitted this many times in the past.

You mean why should they try to make movies that are both critically well received and universally popular with audiences, instead of what they've managed lately with movies that are either one or the other or mixed at best? I think it's fairly obvious.

 

[Aldo]

It's not fairly obvious. The second you try to please everybody you end up pleasing nobody.

 

[Skywalker]

It's not fairly obvious. The second you try to please everybody you end up pleasing nobody.

My point is they should try to make better movies.

I feel weird talking as if I'm trashing BvS because I actually liked it and gave it a positive review earlier in this thread. I guess I just feel like it didn't quite live up to its potential.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

You mean why should they try to make movies that are both critically well received and universally popular with audiences, instead of what they've managed lately with movies that are either one or the other or mixed at best? I think it's fairly obvious.

It's not fairly obvious. The second you try to please everybody you end up pleasing nobody.

See, that's the thing that motivated me to pose this question. BvS has seemingly been raked across the coals by critics for not meeting their skewed expectations. Should WB now tailor make their films to avoid such a thrashing? Which would be ceding control to a section of the audience and giving them what they think they want. Artistic freedom and creative liberty be damned.

Like I said, a tricky situation.