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Batman: The Brave and the Bold is returning -- in a Scooby-Doo movie!

Christopher

Christopher

Writer
Admiral
IGN just released a trailer for WB Animation's next Scooby-Doo movie, which -- amazingly -- is Scooby-Doo and Batman: The Brave and the Bold!

http://www.ign.com/articles/2017/10...-and-the-bold-trailer-debut-and-movie-details

That's right, it's a revival of the zany 2008 take on Batman and the DC Universe starring Diedrich Bader as Batman, teaming up with Mystery Incorporated for the second time, or arguably the first. There was a Scooby-Doo segment in "Bat-Mite Presents: Batman's Strangest Cases!", although it was a recreation of the '70s Hanna-Barbera Batman from The New Scooby-Doo Movies rather than the Bader Batman. But this one incorporates the Scooby gang into the full BB&B universe, with numerous returning characters and actors from the show.

Per IGN:
The main voice cast includes Diedrich Bader as Batman, Frank Welker as Scooby-Doo and Fred, Grey Griffin as Daphne and Black Canary, Matthew Lillard as Shaggy, and Kate Micucci as Velma. The guest cast is comprised of Jeff Bennett as Joker, Jeffrey Combs as The Question, John DiMaggio as Aquaman, Nika Futterman as Catwoman, Nicholas Guest as Martian Manhunter, John Michael Higgins as The Riddler, Tom Kenny as Penguin and Plastic Man, Kevin Michael Richardson as Detective Chimp, Tara Strong as Harley Quinn and Poison Ivy, and Fred Tatasciore as Harvey Bullock.
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I was surprised to see Kate Micucci (the DuckTales revival's Webby) as Velma, but apparently she replaced Mindy Cohn in the role two years ago. There are also several non-BB&B actors taking over roles they played in other Batman incarnations -- Jeffrey Combs (the Question in Justice League Unlimited) replacing Nicholas Guest, Tom Kenny (Penguin in The Batman) replacing Stephen Root, Tara Strong (Harley and Ivy in DC Super Hero Girls) replacing Meghan Strange as Harley and Jennifer Hale/Vanessa Marshall as Ivy. Harvey Bullock is new to the BB&B universe.

But many of the best BB&B heroes and villains are returning, and that's a thrill, even if it had to be in the context of a Scooby-Doo movie. Really, a team-up with Mystery Inc. is very much in the spirit of BB&B, even if the character design styles clash a bit.
 
I’ve been reading Scooby-Doo Team-Up digital comics with my son for a few years now and almost all of them involve DC heroes (the rest are fellow cartoon characters).
 
Markonian said:
Does Scooby-Do generally take place in the DC multiverse?
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Not really, but there were a couple of Batman appearances on The New Scooby-Doo Movies back in the '70s, when Hanna-Barbera had the license to the DC characters for Super Friends. And these days, it's the other way around -- Time Warner owns the former Hanna-Barbera characters, so their videos are now made by Warner Bros. Animation and their comics are published by DC, so there have been some crossovers. There's a DC Scooby-Doo Team-Up comic that teams the Scooby Gang with various DC superheroes/villains and other H-B characters like Space Ghost and Jonny Quest. They're obviously not in continuity with the DC Universe proper; they're just using its characters for stories that exist in their own continuity. Maybe there's some handwave somewhere about the comics and animated series happening in various parallel Earths, but really, they're just stories.

Anyway, it's really a matter of corporate synergy -- the same company owns all these characters, and people like to see different sets of characters cross over. Batman: The Brave and the Bold was a show that tended toward comedy and nostalgia, and the whole premise of the show was about teaming Batman up with other heroes, so if any version of Batman was compatible with Scooby-Doo, it'd be that one.

Indeed, this isn't the only Scooby-Doo crossover we'll be getting in 2018. Supernatural is doing an animated episode in March that teams the Winchesters up with Scooby-Doo. Yes, really.
 
I am so excited about this!

Christopher said:
Not really, but there were a couple of Batman appearances on The New Scooby-Doo Movies back in the '70s, when Hanna-Barbera had the license to the DC characters for Super Friends. And these days, it's the other way around -- Time Warner owns the former Hanna-Barbera characters, so their videos are now made by Warner Bros. Animation and their comics are published by DC, so there have been some crossovers. There's a DC Scooby-Doo Team-Up comic that teams the Scooby Gang with various DC superheroes/villains and other H-B characters like Space Ghost and Jonny Quest. They're obviously not in continuity with the DC Universe proper; they're just using its characters for stories that exist in their own continuity. Maybe there's some handwave somewhere about the comics and animated series happening in various parallel Earths, but really, they're just stories.

Anyway, it's really a matter of corporate synergy -- the same company owns all these characters, and people like to see different sets of characters cross over. Batman: The Brave and the Bold was a show that tended toward comedy and nostalgia, and the whole premise of the show was about teaming Batman up with other heroes, so if any version of Batman was compatible with Scooby-Doo, it'd be that one.

Indeed, this isn't the only Scooby-Doo crossover we'll be getting in 2018. Supernatural is doing an animated episode in March that teams the Winchesters up with Scooby-Doo. Yes, really.
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Considering the recent reimagined versions of Hanna-Barbera characters in DC comic series it isn't at all unlikely that at some point in the future that Scooby Doo and other HB characters will be included in a world or worlds within the DC Multiverse.
 
Ketrick said:
I am so excited about this!



Considering the recent reimagined versions of Hanna-Barbera characters in DC comic series it isn't at all unlikely that at some point in the future that Scooby Doo and other HB characters will be included in a world or worlds within the DC Multiverse.
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I haven't read any of them, so I'm not sure how this was addressed, but they did recently do a whole series of crossovers between H-B properties and DC characters, each one also introduced a new upcoming H-B reboot.

 
Ketrick said:
Considering the recent reimagined versions of Hanna-Barbera characters in DC comic series it isn't at all unlikely that at some point in the future that Scooby Doo and other HB characters will be included in a world or worlds within the DC Multiverse.
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Does it matter? Parallel universes can be a useful story device in some cases, but why can't different fictional concepts just be different fictional concepts?
 
Christopher said:
Does it matter? Parallel universes can be a useful story device in some cases, but why can't different fictional concepts just be different fictional concepts?
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As JD pointed out, there have already been crossovers. Why not just include it in the DC Multiverse? This is just my opinion, but when there's a crossover, that should mean the shows/movies/comics/et cetera should be connected unless it's made explicitly clear that the connections don't count like with the Phineas and Ferb Star Wars special.

Perhaps that's the case with the HB/DC crossover or perhaps not. However, knowing how DC likes to join things to the multiverse and the fact that there have been connections via The New Scooby Doo Movies, the Brave and the Bold episode, and now this dtv, it seems a safe bet it's only a matter of time.
 
Ketrick said:
As JD pointed out, there have already been crossovers. Why not just include it in the DC Multiverse?
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I just don't see why that should be the default position. Stories are just stories. Parallel realities are a concept used within some stories, when it serves a story purpose. If there's a crossover between two different fictional creations, then you pretend, for the duration of the story, that they share a universe or that their universes are somehow "crossing over," but that's just a plot gimmick for the sake of that story. It doesn't have value as an end in itself.

Besides, there are so many different, incompatible versions of both DC and Scooby-Doo already. Are they all in some kind of parallel timelines, both the gritty ones and the silly ones alike? How does that even work? And what story purpose does it serve to pretend that, say, The Dark Knight Returns somehow takes place in a metareality where Scrappy-Doo actually exists somewhere? I don't need to believe there is an actual Scrappy-Doo. It's bad enough there's even a fictional one.

I have no problem with the fictional conceit that Scooby-Doo exists in the Batman: The Brave and the Bold continuity, because it's a comedy version of Batman to begin with and crossovers are part of its spirit. But I have absolutely no need or desire to pretend that the fun, silly stories of BB&B are actually "real" in some parallel timeline to the DC Rebirth universe or the Arrowverse or whatever. It's just an alternate creative approach to an imaginary character.


Perhaps that's the case with the HB/DC crossover or perhaps not. However, knowing how DC likes to join things to the multiverse and the fact that there have been connections via The New Scooby Doo Movies, the Brave and the Bold episode, and now this dtv, it seems a safe bet it's only a matter of time.
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As I've been saying, BB&B is its own separate continuity. It's not part of any other continuity. There are already many separate, incompatible Batman continuities in comics, animation, and live action, as well as many separate Scooby-Doo continuities. This is only a crossover between BB&B and the current Warner Bros. Animation direct-to-video Scooby series. And the fact that they chose to tell a story pretending that those characters share a universe doesn't mean that any other story has to honor that, any more than Star Trek canon has to acknowledge the various comics crossovers with Marvel, DC, Doctor Who, Planet of the Apes, etc. Just because a story exists about a certain set of characters, that doesn't compel every other story about those characters to conform to it, because it's just a story. You only need to pretend it's "real" for the duration of that specific story and any others that directly and intentionally share continuity with it. Continuity is just one tool in the kit. It should be used when it serves a purpose, not forced onto every story whether it needs it or not.
 
Christopher said:
I just don't see why that should be the default position. Stories are just stories. Parallel realities are a concept used within some stories, when it serves a story purpose. If there's a crossover between two different fictional creations, then you pretend, for the duration of the story, that they share a universe or that their universes are somehow "crossing over," but that's just a plot gimmick for the sake of that story. It doesn't have value as an end in itself.

Besides, there are so many different, incompatible versions of both DC and Scooby-Doo already. Are they all in some kind of parallel timelines, both the gritty ones and the silly ones alike? How does that even work? And what story purpose does it serve to pretend that, say, The Dark Knight Returns somehow takes place in a metareality where Scrappy-Doo actually exists somewhere? I don't need to believe there is an actual Scrappy-Doo. It's bad enough there's even a fictional one.

I have no problem with the fictional conceit that Scooby-Doo exists in the Batman: The Brave and the Bold continuity, because it's a comedy version of Batman to begin with and crossovers are part of its spirit. But I have absolutely no need or desire to pretend that the fun, silly stories of BB&B are actually "real" in some parallel timeline to the DC Rebirth universe or the Arrowverse or whatever. It's just an alternate creative approach to an imaginary character.




As I've been saying, BB&B is its own separate continuity. It's not part of any other continuity. There are already many separate, incompatible Batman continuities in comics, animation, and live action, as well as many separate Scooby-Doo continuities. This is only a crossover between BB&B and the current Warner Bros. Animation direct-to-video Scooby series. And the fact that they chose to tell a story pretending that those characters share a universe doesn't mean that any other story has to honor that, any more than Star Trek canon has to acknowledge the various comics crossovers with Marvel, DC, Doctor Who, Planet of the Apes, etc. Just because a story exists about a certain set of characters, that doesn't compel every other story about those characters to conform to it, because it's just a story. You only need to pretend it's "real" for the duration of that specific story and any others that directly and intentionally share continuity with it. Continuity is just one tool in the kit. It should be used when it serves a purpose, not forced onto every story whether it needs it or not.
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I think you're misunderstanding what I'm suggesting which may be my fault for the way I've made my points. To clarify, my main point is that the new Hanna-Barbera comic book continuity is what is likely to be eventually made a part of the larger DC Multiverse. I was only using the new dtv as evidence of a trend of DC/HB crossovers to support my larger first point. Now, personally, I do believe there's evidence supporting the possibility that the DC Multiverse and the HB Multiverse are part of a larger Multiverse, but I'm not arguing that in this thread whereas it would derail it and it's merely a personal opinion that is debatable.
 
Ketrick said:
To clarify, my main point is that the new Hanna-Barbera comic book continuity is what is likely to be eventually made a part of the larger DC Multiverse.
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I don't know about that. For one thing, the different H-B titles don't seem to represent a single continuity or a single creative approach. I mean, the Scooby-Doo comic explains the talking animals as lab experiments, but there's also a Snagglepuss comic where anthropomorphic animals were just part of everyday life in the 1950s. I think they're just making each comic its own thing and aren't overly concerned with continuity between titles.
 
Christopher said:
I don't know about that. For one thing, the different H-B titles don't seem to represent a single continuity or a single creative approach. I mean, the Scooby-Doo comic explains the talking animals as lab experiments, but there's also a Snagglepuss comic where anthropomorphic animals were just part of everyday life in the 1950s. I think they're just making each comic its own thing and aren't overly concerned with continuity between titles.
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Honestly, I haven't had the opportunity to read them yet despite having the desire. I'm basing my opinion on different interviews I've read. If I remember correctly, not all of the titles are meant to be in continuity, but most are or at least there's a desire and plan by Jim Lee for a continuity.
 
I just got this movie from the library today, and it's a lot of fun. Even though the Scooby Gang gets top billing and plenty of screen time, and even though this movie is part of the Scooby-Doo DVD line, it feels like an honest-to-gosh Batman: The Brave and the Bold movie that heavily features the Scooby Gang. I mean, it has all the usual Scooby tropes, but they're within the context of Gotham City and superheroes and the BB&B universe, like the obligatory chase sequence happening in Arkham Asylum, say. It's well-done as a mashup that treats both series with affection -- and even throws in some Batman '66 nods, like a "Holy ___, Batman" joke or two, and a certain prop design from another Batman movie. (And not all the homages are to Batman and Scooby-Doo. The audio ambience in the Batcave is a sound effects loop from the starship Enterprise bridge.) They even play the two series' tropes off against each other, like when a Shaggy/Scooby gluttony montage is done in the style of a BB&B freeze-frame fight montage.

The animation is pretty good, better than the norm for either TV series. The story's pretty good too, with some actual drama for Batman as Mystery Inc. helps him deal with the one unsolved, tragic case from his early days. And the stakes keep escalating more and more as Batman and the Scooby Gang end up on the run from the cops, the superheroes, and the villains all at once. I actually pegged the identity of the "ghost" almost immediately -- a mix of lucky guessing and reasoning -- but there were aspects of the mystery I didn't figure out. It was fun seeing a new addition to the BB&B reality, a "Mystery Analysts of Gotham" club for the detective-themed superheroes; although it was obviously invented as an excuse to get the Scooby Gang invited to team up with Batman and other superheroes, it feels like an organic idea within the BB&B world, where Batman is the nexus of a large, gregarious superhero community defined by frequent team-ups. Meanwhile, the Scooby Gang were pretty much their routine, formulaic selves, but in a well-written and funny way with a lot of lampshade-hanging on their own tropes, and they played off well against the DC characters.

Most of the voice actors were the ones we know from the prior series, so there's not much to say about them -- except that it's fun that Grey (DeLisle) Griffin is a member of both ensembles and did double duty as Daphne Blake and Black Canary. This was my first exposure to Kate Micucci as Velma, but I adjusted pretty quickly; she's maybe a bit too perky-sounding compared to previous Velmas (her delivery isn't much different from her voice for Webby on the new DuckTales), but the timbre of her voice is a good fit. Of the recast BB&B characters that I mentioned in the first post, only the Question was a major player, and Jeffrey Combs pretty much reprised his JLU characterization for the role. Conversely, even though Tom Kenny took over the Penguin, he played it as a fairly good imitation of Stephen Root's Penguin from BB&B, rather than his own Penguin from The Batman. The only other notable new voice is Fred Tatasciore as Harvey Bullock. He was okay, but he's no Robert Costanza.

The oddest thing about the movie is that they changed Catwoman's look for her one scene in the movie. In BB&B, Catwoman's costume was pretty much her classic purple dress from the '40s and '50s, but here, they put her in the hideous costume she wore from 1969-74 in the comics. That seemed inexplicable at first, but it occurred to me that maybe it's a nod to the fact that Scooby-Doo, Where Are You? premiered in 1969 too.

The DVD has the two Batman/Robin episodes of 1972's The New Scooby-Doo Movies as bonus features. I haven't watched those yet, and I'm not entirely sure I want to. They're surely nowhere near as good as Scooby-Doo & Batman: the Brave and the Bold, which is probably my favorite Scooby-Doo story other than Mystery Incorporated. (Although I've never been much of a Scooby fan aside from MI.)
 
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