Disrupt the "black hole" when it forms and before it has allowed the Narada to (completely) emerge?
Go hijack the Planetkiller weapon and sit waiting for the Narada to show up?
Open an unstable wormhole right in front of the "black hole"?
Go hijack the Planetkiller weapon and sit waiting for the Narada to show up?
Open an unstable wormhole right in front of the "black hole"?
Lol, you make all those sound so EASY.
Spock is a smart guy, but he's not Q. He would probably need an army of people to pull off any one of those things, and their involvement alone would probably send the alternate universe in all kinds of different directions.
And the alternate timeline would continue to exist in any case (even if Nero didn't come through and destroy the Kelvin). So, say, diverting the Planet Killer from it's original path in history could affect the timeline in some other way down the road.
While I concur that theoretically Spock could travel back to before the Narada emerged from the lightning storm and destroy it in order to restore the Prime timeline, we have no way of knowing that would _actually_ occur. For all we know even the report of a 'lightning storm in space' caused ripple effects. And we have no way of knowing what would happen if Spock's ship was detected/scanned/etc.
Even if he could get back to the Prime universe, maybe Spock's happier in the past. In the Prime universe he might have outlived all his friends. Here they are again, young and healthy. And he might feel the task of helping the survivors of Vulcan is a more important and fulfulling challenge than anything that awaits him back "home." Plus he might feel some personal responsibility for the situation they're in, some need to atone.
I just wish it had contained more of the material that was in Countdown... that was all solid backstory stuff, that would have addressed a lot of issues for some fans.
Lol, you make all those sound so EASY.
Spock is a smart guy, but he's not Q. He would probably need an army of people to pull off any one of those things, and their involvement alone would probably send the alternate universe in all kinds of different directions.
And the alternate timeline would continue to exist in any case (even if Nero didn't come through and destroy the Kelvin). So, say, diverting the Planet Killer from it's original path in history could affect the timeline in some other way down the road.
It's not rocket science. Spock either invented, or is very familiar with that Red bomb/weapon/black hole maker, could probably whip up a little something to go back with. No need to go crazy, just make a big bomb or weapon using his knowledge of future tech, and then blow Nero to bits as he's disoriented coming through the hole.
The lightning storm/explosion wouldn't be more than a footnote in the Kelvin's log, unlikely to result in many changes to the Prime timeline.
Certainly fewer changes than killing the crew of the Kelvin (plus whatever else Nero did for 20 years) and blowing up Vulcan....
Spock knows the Vulcans of this time period need him.
Maybe he won't assume that his mission of Romulan/Vulcan unification would be moot, now that Romulus has been destroyed, but still, he's needed *here* more than back in his own universe.
Maybe he won't assume that his mission of Romulan/Vulcan unification would be moot, now that Romulus has been destroyed, but still, he's needed *here* more than back in his own universe.
Why would he want to go back to the 24th century? The planet that has been his home for decades is gone, all his friends and family are dead.
In this timeline, however, there is an opportunity for him to be useful, coupled with a chance to enjoy encounters, however fleeting, with the family he has lost.
In this timeline, however, there is an opportunity for him to be useful, coupled with a chance to enjoy encounters, however fleeting, with the family he has lost.
Spock couldn't return to his home even if he wanted to.
This is not just an alternate timeline. It's an entirely separate universe as well. Spock and Nero reached it via the black hole. Since that black hole no longer exists, there's no way Spock can get home. Ever.
Spock's home universe and timeline - the 'prime' Trek universe we all grew up with - still exists, yet is forever closed to him.
This is not just an alternate timeline. It's an entirely separate universe as well. Spock and Nero reached it via the black hole. Since that black hole no longer exists, there's no way Spock can get home. Ever.
Spock's home universe and timeline - the 'prime' Trek universe we all grew up with - still exists, yet is forever closed to him.
As much as I really like the new movie, I completely agree with this. A complete reboot would have been the best move, particularly in light of the discrepancy of the filmmakers comments that they would not ignore what came before, but the plot of the movie is about ERASING what came before.
I'm not a stickler for canon or anything like that, but the story logic here confuses me. From a writing standpoint, it makes no sense whatsoever.
i think spock might be a little hesitant about that because due to sela he knows just how much things can go wrong if there is a just a little tinkering with the time line.
and the kelvin would have seen both his ship and the narada so the time line could have still been changed.
we might not have gotten the destruction of vulcan but things could have changed in totally different ways.
There's also the fact that in a very real way, Spock has lost two homes in short order. He'd spent the last few decades on Romulus working toward reunification. Surely he had friends, maybe even family there who were lost when the supernova took the planet.
Losing Vulcan is tragic, but it's not like he has a home in the Prime Universe to go back to. Romulus is gone, and who knows if Vulcan of the late 24th Century could still be called his home?
While I would have preferred a straight reboot too, the reality is most fans still would have bitched and moaned about the characters' backstories getting changed, or if certain key events were left out this time around. And they probably would have bitched even LOUDER at Vulcan getting destroyed.
Abrams couldn't have won either way with the fans. At least this way there's SOME kind of a built-in excuse for why things are different.
Plus which, having the Narada emerge from a black hole from the future makes for a much more dramatic opening than we would have gotten in a straight re-telling or rebooting of TOS.
an awful lot to do.
from what i heard at the start of the film kelvin is in communication with someone else.
very possibly a border outpost since they are so near the klingon border.
one thing i have thought of the singularity itself may screw around with normal means of traveling to the past.
you try to go back and just its existance may mess up coming out in that time period.
and while it might not have been intended tng was changed a lot after yesterdays enterprise.
it came across as far more unstable and and dangerous place afterward including that there had been previous battles with the carrdassians that didnt seem to have previously existed.
No, no, no, Vulcan is alive and well in the 24th Century that we know. It is the 24th Century of *this* time-line that we are currently in that it is destroyed. Romulus is the one that got destroyed in the 24th Century that we know and love.
From before the time of TNG's "Unification" until the time of the events related in the Countdown comic and alluded to in the movie, Spock has lived on Romulus, and had by pursuing the goal of Unification become estranged from Vulcan institutions and leadership, probably also outliving many of his contemporaries. As soot correctly said: the planet which had been Spock's home for decades (Romulus) is gone, wiped out by the superdupernova of the Hobus star. Vulcan still exists in the prime timeline, but it is no longer Spock's home -- he has no reason any more for trying to go there, even if a way existed.
Oh ok, you're right, I thought I read Vulcan in there when I replied... I stand corrected.
It's because time travel doesn't actually occur. You don't travel within your own timeline; you can't (because of the grandfather paradox). You can, however, travel to other parallel universes, which will just happen to be at various points in their own histories (not necessarily the exact same time and date as your own reality when you left it).
Because there are an infinite number of parallel realities, you can travel to any point in time in someone's reality, which may seem to resemble that point in time in your own reality. This creates the illusion of time travel that has got everyone fooled.
Nobody in Star Trek ever time travels, not really. They just travel between realities and think they've travelled through time, due to the impossibility of telling the difference between time travel and parallel reality travel, for certain.
If Spock somehow found his way back to his own reality - and how could he ever be totally sure that it was his original reality? - the timeline would be unchanged. He didn't even really change the timeline in the reality he travelled to.
Since there are an infinite number of parallel realities, everything that could possibly happen, does happen in at least one. So there is going to be one and probably a lot more realities where Nero blows up Vulcan. There's no way around it - it has to happen in at least one reality. So even if Spock saves that Vulcan, somewhere else, another Vulcan is being blown up. So why bother saving Vulcan when it just gets blown up anyway?
By doing nothing, Spock was doing the most logical thing.
Who says that some future Star Trek movie or TV series couldn't return to the Prime Universe and just forget everything that JJ made up?
And personally, I tend to like things that are demented, but that's just me.
Because there are an infinite number of parallel realities, you can travel to any point in time in someone's reality, which may seem to resemble that point in time in your own reality. This creates the illusion of time travel that has got everyone fooled.
Nobody in Star Trek ever time travels, not really. They just travel between realities and think they've travelled through time, due to the impossibility of telling the difference between time travel and parallel reality travel, for certain.
If Spock somehow found his way back to his own reality - and how could he ever be totally sure that it was his original reality? - the timeline would be unchanged. He didn't even really change the timeline in the reality he travelled to.
Since there are an infinite number of parallel realities, everything that could possibly happen, does happen in at least one. So there is going to be one and probably a lot more realities where Nero blows up Vulcan. There's no way around it - it has to happen in at least one reality. So even if Spock saves that Vulcan, somewhere else, another Vulcan is being blown up. So why bother saving Vulcan when it just gets blown up anyway?
By doing nothing, Spock was doing the most logical thing.
Who says that some future Star Trek movie or TV series couldn't return to the Prime Universe and just forget everything that JJ made up?
And personally, I tend to like things that are demented, but that's just me.
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