Are you apprehensive about the new series?

[Christopher]

I think you and garoo are talking about two different things, Christopher; I'm pretty sure he's just saying that there's no need for a Star Trek "origin story" in a new take because people will already get the basics with or without being fans already.

I'm not sure how that's relevant. According to the report, the series will feature a new crew.

Also, garoo was comparing it to Doctor Who, but the Doctor Who revival is a classic example of one that did not assume the audience was already familiar with the series' tropes. On the contrary, it started over from scratch, beginning from the perspective of a character who knew nothing about the Doctor and having her gradually learn who and what he was, so that the audience would learn along with her. Every time the revival series brought in a concept from the old series, it was introduced to the audience as something new, something they were not expected to understand already -- the TARDIS, the Daleks, Gallifrey, eventually the Cybermen and the Master and the Sontarans and so on. Everything was explained when it was introduced. After all, it had been nearly a generation since the old series had left the air. Most of the primary target audience wouldn't even have been born when it was last on.

 

[Greg Cox]

Ah, that's still cool. Was really hoping it was a "calendar-year 2016"-thing, and that we'd be getting a fourth book squeezed into there somewhere too, though.

Thanks, but I'm actually hard at work on a LIBRARIANS novel at the moment, and just contracted to write a PLANET OF THE APES story as well. Not sure when I could squeeze in a fourth Star Trek as well!

A Librarians novel? Tie-in books for that show should be a fun read and I'm glad they're going forward with novels while the show's still on the air (as opposed to how they handled Leverage). I think your writing style will be a good fit for that world, Greg!

Thanks! I'm having fun writing it so far. And the full title is:

THE LIBRARIANS AND THE LOST LAMP.

(Think Aladdin.)

 

[rahullak]

Not if the "unsold episode ideas that became books" thread is any indication.

Though the way TV pitching sounds, I don't blame them.

Not that I'd turn down another chance to try. The trick is simply not to get your hopes up.

Yeah. Now that I know how I screwed up pitching in the past, maybe I could do better now. And the money in TV is so much better than in print.

Although it's unlikely to happen. For one thing, I'd need to get an agent first, since it's unlikely the new series would revive Michael Piller's open-submissions policy.

Oh you guys are talking about pitching for TV. I actually meant pitching for books that would be tie-ins to the new TV series, once it matures. My guess is that the current crop of authors would be tapped for the new tie-ins as well.

 

[garoo1980]

That's exactly the approach. Doctor Who did the same thing. Clearly it's a continuation, it's the same man with the same TARDIS, but its totally approachable if you're new to it. That's the way to go

Well, no, it's not the same. Doctor Who is treated as a direct continuation of the original series' continuity, albeit without a lot of concern about the exact details. Supergirl is not a continuation of any prior comic or series; it's creating its own new universe that distills elements from prior comics and films, like most reboots and remakes do.

But that only matters from a niggly continuity standpoint. From the standpoint of creativity and marketing and building a new audience, the difference between the two approaches isn't that important.

Star Trek I think is especially ripe for this because everyone's so familiar with it already. You don't need to explain too much, everyone kind of gets the ships, phasers, transporters, etc. Just introduce the characters and go

That's not how it works. Audiences age out. They drift away. They die off. A new series cannot possibly succeed if it only targets those people who were already fans of the old version, because there just won't be enough of them left. The goal always has to be to make a series accessible to new viewers, people who had no prior interest in the franchise or were too young to be aware of it when it was last around. Yes, ideally you want it to be welcoming to the veteran fans as well, but it's the ability of a show to win a new audience that determines whether it can succeed.

Sorry Chris I don't think I explained myself very well. My wife had never seen Star Trek in her life before the 2009 movie, but going into the theatre she knew the Enterprise, Klingons, phases and transporters. It's just in the culture. I read Karen Gillan knew the TARDIS before was in Doctor Who just because everyone in the UK does, even though the show was off during her childhood.

But yes, it should definitely target new viewers even at the expense of old ones. For sure

I'm a good example with Supergirl. I know the Superman story pretty well but I've never read a Supergirl comic in my life. And I watched it and loved it, so did my kids. It was aimed at the family and you don't need to know the other stuff. I'm sure it will come in time. Probably by season 5 you'll need to have seen the previous stuff, but they're starting clean now, as they should.

I would assume that the novels you guys write (which I love) are all aimed directly at the fans. I'm not sure too many guys off the street are going to join Star Trek with Greater Than The Sum, despite it being so awesome. They're probably written for the main ST fans, albeit fans who haven't read every single novel.

 

[Greg Cox]

I'm a good example with Supergirl. I know the Superman story pretty well but I've never read a Supergirl comic in my life. And I watched it and loved it, so did my kids. It was aimed at the family and you don't need to know the other stuff. I'm sure it will come in time. Probably by season 5 you'll need to have seen the previous stuff, but they're starting clean now, as they should.

As I've mentioned before, my oldest niece was a huge SMALLVILLE fan back in the day, even though she didn't know a Bizarro from a Brainiac when the show debuted.

She knew vaguely that it was based on Superman, but that was about it. Didn't stop her from getting hooked on the show.

 

[Christopher]

I would assume that the novels you guys write (which I love) are all aimed directly at the fans. I'm not sure too many guys off the street are going to join Star Trek with Greater Than The Sum, despite it being so awesome. They're probably written for the main ST fans, albeit fans who haven't read every single novel.

I try to make my books at least somewhat accessible to people who aren't already fans, if only because I know some members of my family will read them and won't necessarily be conversant with all the continuity details.

 

[garoo1980]

I'm a good example with Supergirl. I know the Superman story pretty well but I've never read a Supergirl comic in my life. And I watched it and loved it, so did my kids. It was aimed at the family and you don't need to know the other stuff. I'm sure it will come in time. Probably by season 5 you'll need to have seen the previous stuff, but they're starting clean now, as they should.

As I've mentioned before, my oldest niece was a huge SMALLVILLE fan back in the day, even though she didn't know a Bizarro from a Brainiac when the show debuted.

She knew vaguely that it was based on Superman, but that was about it. Didn't stop her from getting hooked on the show.

My kids knew it was to do with Superman, but that was it. My son wasn't too excited (because she's a girl) until she punched that guy so hard he flew a wall. And that got the 4 year old boy's vote for show we should definitely watch again

 

[garoo1980]

I would assume that the novels you guys write (which I love) are all aimed directly at the fans. I'm not sure too many guys off the street are going to join Star Trek with Greater Than The Sum, despite it being so awesome. They're probably written for the main ST fans, albeit fans who haven't read every single novel.

I try to make my books at least somewhat accessible to people who aren't already fans, if only because I know some members of my family will read them and won't necessarily be conversant with all the continuity details.

Interesting. I read a lot of ST books but there are so many it's not really possible to follow them all. For example I took a while and just read the DS9 stuff to catch up. So now that I'm back in the Typhon Pact/The Fall series it involves the other crews again and I'm rusty with that. Christine Vale has been a while for me. But it's definitely accessible for me to pick up again. I'm not sure joe off the street would find it that way, but it's interesting to know what you guys write for

Oh, don't change anything BTW They're awesome

 

[Greg Cox]

I would assume that the novels you guys write (which I love) are all aimed directly at the fans. I'm not sure too many guys off the street are going to join Star Trek with Greater Than The Sum, despite it being so awesome. They're probably written for the main ST fans, albeit fans who haven't read every single novel.

I try to make my books at least somewhat accessible to people who aren't already fans, if only because I know some members of my family will read them and won't necessarily be conversant with all the continuity details.

Similarly, I don't assume that every reader remembers every episode in perfect detail. Sure, I don't bother to explain who Spock is or why he has pointed ears, but if I'm going to bring back some old character like Gary Seven or Lenore Karidian, I'll make an effort to reintroduce them and recap the plot of the relevant episodes rather than just assume that every reader has seen "Conscience of the King" recently.

Granted, it can be a balancing act. Do too much recapping and readers complain that you're wasting time telling them stuff they already know. Do too little recapping and you may lose the casual reader who doesn't know every episode by heart.

 

[Quinton O'Connor]

I try to make my books at least somewhat accessible to people who aren't already fans, if only because I know some members of my family will read them and won't necessarily be conversant with all the continuity details.

I'd say you succeed. Some friends of mine have jumped on at points which were perhaps less than ideal, and they've been fine.

(Ditto to you, too, Greg.)

 

[garoo1980]

I would assume that the novels you guys write (which I love) are all aimed directly at the fans. I'm not sure too many guys off the street are going to join Star Trek with Greater Than The Sum, despite it being so awesome. They're probably written for the main ST fans, albeit fans who haven't read every single novel.

I try to make my books at least somewhat accessible to people who aren't already fans, if only because I know some members of my family will read them and won't necessarily be conversant with all the continuity details.

Similarly, I don't assume that every reader remembers every episode in perfect detail. Sure, I don't bother to explain who Spock is or why he has pointed ears, but if I'm going to bring back some old character like Gary Seven or Lenore Karidian, I'll make an effort to reintroduce them and recap the plot of the relevant episodes rather than just assume that every reader has seen "Conscience of the King" recently.

Granted, it can be a balancing act. Do too much recapping and readers complain that you're wasting time telling them stuff they already know. Do too little recapping and you may lose the casual reader who doesn't know every episode by heart.

Thanks for that. I'm sure I've seen every episode of ST but some have been a long time. That's perfect

 

[vegaslover62]

Don't get me wrong, I've been a Trekker for the last thirty years, just like my father before me, but if I have to pay for a subscription to a streaming service, and this is the only show I'm going to watch on it, then I'm not going to shell out for it. Not even this Trek awesomeness will be good for my bottom line. My budget can't justify it.

 

[Christopher]

Don't get me wrong, I've been a Trekker for the last thirty years, just like my father before me, but if I have to pay for a subscription to a streaming service, and this is the only show I'm going to watch on it, then I'm not going to shell out for it. Not even this Trek awesomeness will be good for my bottom line. My budget can't justify it.

That doesn't mean you'll never get to see it, just that you'll have to wait a little longer. It'll show up later in syndication or Hulu or DVD or something. Case in point: I haven't been able to watch Powers because it's exclusive to the PlayStation network, but I just found out the local library has the DVD season set in stock. So I didn't get to see it when it was brand new, but I'll still get to see it.

 

[garoo1980]

Don't get me wrong, I've been a Trekker for the last thirty years, just like my father before me, but if I have to pay for a subscription to a streaming service, and this is the only show I'm going to watch on it, then I'm not going to shell out for it. Not even this Trek awesomeness will be good for my bottom line. My budget can't justify it.

I'm curious, because to me paying $6 to watch ST is not a big deal. Do you have cable now? Netflix? How much do you spend on tv now, obviously if you don't mind me asking

 

[Tim Walker]

I saw Serenity before I save the Firefly television episodes. I'm glad that Whedon was able to work some background into the beginning of the film.

 

[JD]

Thanks! I'm having fun writing it so far. And the full title is:

THE LIBRARIANS AND THE LOST LAMP.

(Think Aladdin.)

I had no idea they were going to be doing The Librarians novels already. I love the show, so I'll definitely be checking this out.

I'm a good example with Supergirl. I know the Superman story pretty well but I've never read a Supergirl comic in my life. And I watched it and loved it, so did my kids. It was aimed at the family and you don't need to know the other stuff. I'm sure it will come in time. Probably by season 5 you'll need to have seen the previous stuff, but they're starting clean now, as they should.

That doesn't really work, Supergirl is a totally new universe, with nothing before it. It's all that there has been in this universe so far, so there is nothing else to familiarize yourself with. Obviously most of the characters come from the comics, and have been in other adaptations, but none of those were these specific versions of the characters.

 

[Greg Cox]

Thanks! I'm having fun writing it so far. And the full title is:

THE LIBRARIANS AND THE LOST LAMP.

(Think Aladdin.)

I had no idea they were going to be doing The Librarians novels already. I love the show, so I'll definitely be checking this out.

I'm a good example with Supergirl. I know the Superman story pretty well but I've never read a Supergirl comic in my life. And I watched it and loved it, so did my kids. It was aimed at the family and you don't need to know the other stuff. I'm sure it will come in time. Probably by season 5 you'll need to have seen the previous stuff, but they're starting clean now, as they should.

That doesn't really work, Supergirl is a totally new universe, with nothing before it. It's all that there has been in this universe so far, so there is nothing else to familiarize yourself with. Obviously most of the characters come from the comics, and have been in other adaptations, but none of those were these specific versions of the characters.

I don't know. This at least the third live-action version of SUPERGIRL, counting the Helen Slater movie and the SMALLVILLE version of the character. And, of course, we've seen Krypton and the Phantom Zone and Kryptonite and so on in umpteen SUPERMAN movies, TV, series, animated series, etc.

So how would a new STAR TREK series, that still featured Starfleet and Klingons and Vulcans and so on, be any different? Yes, we would seen previous versions before, but not "these specific versions of the characters."

Like SUPERGIRL, it would be "a totally new universe" that was free to draw on decades of mythology from the previous versions of STAR TREK . . ..

 

[JD]

I thought he was saying that as the series goes on they're going to start bringing in exact elements from earlier versions of the Supergirl. Like bringing back Faye Dunaway specifically as the same character from the Supergirl movie, or bringing in the specific version of Darkseid featured in Superman/Batman: Apocalypse.

 

[garoo1980]

I thought he was saying that as the series goes on they're going to start bringing in exact elements from earlier versions of the Supergirl. Like bringing back Faye Dunaway specifically as the same character from the Supergirl movie, or bringing in the specific version of Darkseid featured in Superman/Batman: Apocalypse.

Hadn't heard that. Interesting. I watch The Flash and was impressed with Mark Hamill on there. I thought he did a great job. Only later did I find out he'd played the same character on the 1990 series. That was cool, and the sort of thing a fan would notice but a casual viewer like me missed completely. That's cool

Yeah I meant how Supergirl opened with a series showing Krypton's destruction. I guess it had to, it is the beginning on her journey but I'm sure we've seen that 3 or 4 other times at least. 2 films, a bunch of cartoons, it's old. But for my kids it was news so I guess it's needed.

Hard to get the balance right with a new Star Trek. Someone will be watching their first Trek but guys like me know the words to old episodes.

My point was a bunch of ST stuff is common knowledge now, even to people who've never seen it. I'm not sure you need to explain what a Kingon is, although you should say if they're friend or foe. That's all I meant

 

[Greg Cox]

Thanks! I'm having fun writing it so far. And the full title is:

THE LIBRARIANS AND THE LOST LAMP.

(Think Aladdin.)

I had no idea they were going to be doing The Librarians novels already. I love the show, so I'll definitely be checking this out..

This is the first one. But thanks for your interest!