• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Apple's Post-PC World

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Apple builds consumer goods. I work with computers in networks, in several professional environments. Apple has made no inroads into what we do in...well, ever (we do have an iMac in the corner. No one knows where it came from or why; it's not plugged in). Now, arguably Apple's not interested in business machines, and that's fine. Nonetheless, despite the ongoing conviction of Apple enthusiasts for what seems like decades now that most people will abandon other equipment for Apple it hasn't happened and isn't happening. There will simply be lots of other manufacturers moving into whatever consumer market Apple successfully promotes, offering substantially less expensive equivalent stuff that Apple folks will insist is not as good an "experience" but which most consumers will purchase instead.
 
I would say that Apple has made a lot of inroads into professional environments. If you ever watch any sporting event, or any major event which has a lot of press coverage, all of the reporters are using MacBook Pros. You are right though that when it comes to the office environment which has a 1000 mindless drones (of which I am one) sitting in front of computers churning out BS... Apple has made no in-roads there.

Also, so far, price is the one thing that no one has been able to even come close to matching Apple on when it comes to tablets.
 
Also, so far, price is the one thing that no one has been able to even come close to matching Apple on when it comes to tablets.
I'm not sure what you're comparing it to, but the two iPad (Samsung Galaxy, Blackberry Playbook) competitors I'm aware of are about the same price or a little cheaper than the iPad. Granted, I don't pay a lot of attention to that market segment, so maybe I'm missing something. What products did you have in mind when you wrote that?
 
Nonetheless, despite the ongoing conviction of Apple enthusiasts for what seems like decades now that most people will abandon other equipment for Apple it hasn't happened and isn't happening. There will simply be lots of other manufacturers moving into whatever consumer market Apple successfully promotes, offering substantially less expensive equivalent stuff that Apple folks will insist is not as good an "experience" but which most consumers will purchase instead.

In terms of smartphones, RIM is on a decline (which they are desperately trying to save themselves from, hopefully it'll work out) but RIM/Android/iOS all have between 27-29% market share. Windows Phone 7 is trailing at 10%, but gosh darnit MS keeps trying. And remember Android was basically non-existant 1.5 years ago in the US marketplace. Things change fast. Apple was the first to make a tablet targeted at consumers directly (though certainly not the first tablet, Microsoft has been pushing Tablet PCs for years now) and with all the incoming competition launching in the first half of this year we're probably going to see a big shakeup in the tablet space over the next year or so. The portrait of Apple's competitors that was painted during Jobs' presentation was completely disingenuous and we're on the cusp of seeing a lot of differentiation and innovation in the marketplace.

To be really snide... in Apple's "post-PC world" the first thing you do when you buy one of their devices is hook it up to a PC. They have a great marketing message which is one of Apple's big strengths, but a lot of it is just talk.
 
I just started working in an office and have had to re-learn how to use a PC with Windows 7, which I had never used. I haven't used Windows since XP, which I liked, and I have to say that I find Windows 7 significantly more complicated than it needs to be. Apple's Snow Leopard is just a lot more intuitive than Windows software, and I wish I could transfer all of my work stuff onto my MacBook.
 
There may be a segment of the population that will be fine without a real computer, but the PC doesn't get to go away because Apple says so. As others have said, there are a lot of people in the world who use their computers for more than email and the web. Apple's shiny toys don't fit the bill for actual work.
 
Also, so far, price is the one thing that no one has been able to even come close to matching Apple on when it comes to tablets.
I'm not sure what you're comparing it to, but the two iPad (Samsung Galaxy, Blackberry Playbook) competitors I'm aware of are about the same price or a little cheaper than the iPad. Granted, I don't pay a lot of attention to that market segment, so maybe I'm missing something. What products did you have in mind when you wrote that?

The Galaxy Tab is about the same price as a comparable iPad but the Tab has a 7" screen compared to the iPad's 9.7". To put that in ways easy to understand, the Tab screen is half the size of the iPad screen. Samsung is working on a 10" Tab and after the iPad 2 media event a Samsung exec said they will have to re-examine their products and their prices as their price per "feature" point is higher than Apple's.

The prices I have seen for thee Motorola Xoom are significantly more than the iPad. I've seen $800 for the base Xoom, which is $300 more than the intro iPad 2 and double the intro iPad.

The PlayBook should be close to iPad prices, yes, but again, for a 7" screen compared the the 9.7" iPad.
 
The prices I have seen for thee Motorola Xoom are significantly more than the iPad. I've seen $800 for the base Xoom, which is $300 more than the intro iPad 2 and double the intro iPad.

The PlayBook should be close to iPad prices, yes, but again, for a 7" screen compared the the 9.7" iPad.

The Xoom currently comes in Wifi+3G with 32gb of storage. The comparable iPad 2 is $730 so it doesn't cost significantly much more. There will be a wifi only 32gb Xoom in the next few weeks which will probably be priced in the $500-$600 range, competing with the 32gb wifi only iPad 2. Yes, there are cheaper iPad models but from what I've read most people buy the more expensive ones anyway.
 
I am a bit worried about the future of computing. Things are already heading in directions I dislike, and showing no signs of u-turning. Since software and hardware are only compatible +/- ten years, so it may be that in ten years time, the only computers we can buy are ones which I have no desire for. That's not a situation I want to be in.

If you've spent any time with old people you'll know they frequently complain about how the world no longer makes the things they want, and how trashy they feel the alternatives are.

This is true for every generation. Ours is no different. Our time will come. So either:

(i) Be prepared, and stock up on the things you don't want to be without. (applies to technology and anything else).

(ii) Spend the last 20 years of your life grumbling about not having the things you want.

.
 
Last edited:
There may be a segment of the population that will be fine without a real computer, but the PC doesn't get to go away because Apple says so. As others have said, there are a lot of people in the world who use their computers for more than email and the web. Apple's shiny toys don't fit the bill for actual work.

This. Fad toys like the iPad cannot replace a real computer. Just the sheer nature of trying to get anything done on a touch screen makes it cumbersome beyond all but the most simple of tasks.

I am a bit worried about the future of computing. Things are already heading in directions I dislike, and showing no signs of u-turning. Since software and hardware are only compatible +/- ten years, so it may be that in ten years time, the only computers we can buy are ones which I have no desire for. That's not a situation I want to be in.

I have the same worry that it will lead to a greater divide between the average person who only needs a gadget for the bare basics, and the real power user who needs to get work done. I own a Mac (unwillingly, but I need it for what I'm doing), and even as it stands I would dread this ever becoming the future of computing. And if Apple have it their way, it would only be downhill from here.
 
I agree that the new Tegra2 tablets for example will cost an arm and a leg (probably even moreso than the iPad2), but there are numerous other examples of tablets of previous generation that are comparable if not far better than the iPad, yet much cheaper.

But... generally speaking (and moving away from the portable market), the desktop/notebook segment is where Apple is simply NOT cost-effective (and mildly productive at best - depending on what you're doing).

Apple OS for example is not really customizable so you are forced to do things as Apple wants you to do them.
Furthermore, their hardware price-tag is virtually double (if not more) of a PC equivalent (dektop or laptop segment).
Software wise, most programs are written for Windows (as are games).

I simply cannot (and will not) justify Apple's severely inflated prices simply because they try to 'market' their junk in a pretty commercial and whatnot.

People keep saying it's 'simple' to use a Mac. Lol... newsflash: you will need time and patience to learn something new (especially if you are coming at it from a negative point of view).

I hope that numerous people realize that just because something is extremely expensive, doesn't mean it's automatically better.
The inflated prices are usually due to brand and greed of manufacturers.
Nothing more.
When you compare at how much these companies spend at making a hardware (such as a desktop, laptop, tablet, etc...) when compared to how much they profit from SELLING them... it goes something like this in Apple's (and many other big brand names) case:
They will usually sell their items for about 4x the price (if not more) they initially spent on putting them together.

Interestingly so, the new Tegra2 tablets manufacturers are doing exactly this kind of a thing as well, which is nothing more than simple greed.
If a company spends $200 for making a tablet for example, selling it for $1000 is pure and simple robbery and greed.
The actual selling value of this item shouldn't go over $300 (or $350) realistically speaking.
But hey... capitalism is far from 'fair'.
Money is all that counts in corporations eyes, and they are counting on people's stupidity and marketing to dull people into thinking it's 'great'.
:D

I got myself a smartphone for the first time about 3 weeks ago.
The Orange San Francisco.
Costed me £110 in London of course 9on PAYG).
This little thing is very robust, has 3.5" screen, customizable, decent, and cheap (at least when compared to the specs of other smartphones).
Now, why exactly should I pay £400 for the Galaxy S that comes with a stronger cpu and slightly larger screen?

Not everything is down to brand, and while I will agree that quality plays a big part in the products you buy, numerous 'consumer grade products' have a much larger lifespan than what is originally thought (though in some cases, you cannot really exceed it even with delicate care if the manufacturer intentionally makes it flawed so it would end up 'dead' after say 2 years time).
 
I have the same worry that it will lead to a greater divide between the average person who only needs a gadget for the bare basics, and the real power user who needs to get work done. I own a Mac (unwillingly, but I need it for what I'm doing), and even as it stands I would dread this ever becoming the future of computing. And if Apple have it their way, it would only be downhill from here.


When the Chinese take over the world and start producing their own brand of x86 microprocessors, and authoring their own operating systems, I wonder if they will be Apple/OSX clones, IBM/Windows clones, or something completely new?
 
I am a bit worried about the future of computing. Things are already heading in directions I dislike, and showing no signs of u-turning. Since software and hardware are only compatible +/- ten years, so it may be that in ten years time, the only computers we can buy are ones which I have no desire for. That's not a situation I want to be in.

Er, what? I can still run DOS software from the early '80s just fine thanks to DOSBox. There are also emulators for just about every computer system ever built. Those aren't going away. There was a (relatively brief) period where computers were not powerful enough to do any serious emulation and it was difficult or impossible to run old software on a modern system, but we've passed that point. Desktops and laptops are not going away. Desktops will eventually be relegated to the workstation and power user market but laptops will still be prevalent as lots of people still need to do productive work for a living. I'm not worried in the least that the personal computer, as a concept, is going to go away. It's simply too versatile to be easily replaced by a handful of flashy Apple devices.

The software problem isn't that much of a problem unless you're talking about support, but that's just a fact of life in the software world. You want software you can support 10, 20 years after release? I suggest you go with open source. Commercial software lacks any kind of incentive to support a 10+ year old program. At least if you have the source code, you can do it yourself.

All that's really happening is people who don't need the full power of a desktop or laptop computer are turning to smartphones and tablets. If all you do is check email, send messages, and do a bit of browsing, you don't need a bulky laptop or a stationary desktop.

I guess I'm just wondering what you're talking about here. What do you think is going to become of computers in ~20 years that you won't be able to do anything you can do now?
 
Robert Maxwell said:
I guess I'm just wondering what you're talking about here. What do you think is going to become of computers in ~20 years that you won't be able to do anything you can do now?

I can very well understand fears regarding the future of computing and have them myself. Apple's shiny gadgets are one threat if you will, but the idea of China building hard- & software is a whole other one. Imagine that, a chinese-built, apple-OS computer managing data through the cloud. That's going to be great!
 
Robert Maxwell said:
I guess I'm just wondering what you're talking about here. What do you think is going to become of computers in ~20 years that you won't be able to do anything you can do now?

I can very well understand fears regarding the future of computing and have them myself. Apple's shiny gadgets are one threat if you will, but the idea of China building hard- & software is a whole other one. Imagine that, a chinese-built, apple-OS computer managing data through the cloud. That's going to be great!

Oh, I forgot, "the cloud" is the new technological boogeyman. :lol:

Don't want to store your data remotely? Then don't. No one is stopping you from using local storage.
 
Robert Maxwell said:
Oh, I forgot, "the cloud" is the new technological boogeyman. :lol:

Don't want to store your data remotely? Then don't. No one is stopping you from using local storage

That's the thing: Someone has to make disc drives. If we all follow the trend, one day, there could be no HDDs with more than minimal capacity left.
And I don't know about you, but "the cloud" is the next big thing coming to us from greedy software companies. Instead of buying once and having everything at your disposal, you will soon be able to pay for access, space and storing seperately and therefore times 3.
A second party will have control over what you save, who's accessing it and if you can access it at all. It's not like the net connection can break down, god, no ...
 
The thing is memory is so cheap these days that there will invariably be someone willing to sell external hard drives for pocket change. That alone will prevent things like the cloud from ever being a sole source of storage (also, internet coverage is not yet universal).
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top