Anyone else missing LOST?

[Lt. Trull]

that's what happens when you fail to support any of your affirmations.

In order to support affirmations....
Dont you need a good bra or support hose?

 

[C_Miller]

label, I do agree with you to an extent. I was able to use my imagination and I'm sure 99% of the people who watched the show were able to also, but I too would have liked a line or two to definitively say what would have happend if the Island was unplugged at Smokey was able to get off. Even if they went Biblical, which they clearly were alluding to. "I looked and behold a pale horse and his name that sat on him was death. And Hell followed with him." Something like that would have been great. It establishes the stakes and makes it reasonable that people would want to stop him.

 

[theenglish]

I love Lost and I'll always enjoy the countless hours I've spent watching, talking ,reading about it but they really did drop the ball in a few places where we really needed to get a little more information so we could even understand the story within the context it was being told.

Okay, that is a valid opinion. I do think that we were given more than we needed, but I don't think stories need to spell everything out for me.

I am content with the idea that an apocalypse, end of the world, event will happen if the MiB escapes. I am content with the idea that there are some summoning rules (as there are with most demon mythology) for the MiB. Ben lets the water out of his "sink" and the smoke monster appears apparently required to aid him. This is why Locke appears when the smoke monster is called later in the series. Why the monster is subject to these rules we are never told.

But I am content that the viewer is required to draw upon his/her knowledge of standard myths to fill in the blanks to these questions. Demons are summoned, demons can roam the world if the portal to hell is opened, an apocalypse can happen. I have seen this in Buffy, Angel, Supernatural, Millennium, X-Files, and countless horror movies. I don't need the specifics spelled out once again--when I can fill in the details from my imagination.

As mentioned earlier, this is no different from much literary fiction of the last 70 years. A lot of information is not spelled out for the reader as it is expected the reader is knowledgeable enough to fill in these details. What literary fiction gives us is what is thematically needed to understand the story and that's what Lost does.

Lost strives to be literary and post-modern in its story telling and, while it does not entirely succeed, it comes close enough most of the time to be head and shoulders above nearly every other genre program of the past couple of decades.

 

[label]

label, I do agree with you to an extent. I was able to use my imagination and I'm sure 99% of the people who watched the show were able to also, but I too would have liked a line or two to definitively say what would have happend if the Island was unplugged at Smokey was able to get off. Even if they went Biblical, which they clearly were alluding to. "I looked and behold a pale horse and his name that sat on him was death. And Hell followed with him." Something like that would have been great. It establishes the stakes and makes it reasonable that people would want to stop him.

Yeah, that's all's I'm looking for as well. I can make the mental leaps required as well as the next guy and I don't need every detail spelled out or someone to hold my hand. However, when you don't even really know what the stakes are or what motivates the main characters in the narrative or (less importantly) how any of the many disparate elements in the show tie together or provide context to the story, it's a little more difficult to be intellectually satisfied with the story overall.

All that being said, I was able to shift the thinking part of my brain into neutral once I realized they weren't going to even try and make the story make internal sense and just enjoy the struggle the characters went through and how things were resolved for them which is clearly what the writers were intending to focus on in the last season.

 

[C_Miller]

label, I do agree with you to an extent. I was able to use my imagination and I'm sure 99% of the people who watched the show were able to also, but I too would have liked a line or two to definitively say what would have happend if the Island was unplugged at Smokey was able to get off. Even if they went Biblical, which they clearly were alluding to. "I looked and behold a pale horse and his name that sat on him was death. And Hell followed with him." Something like that would have been great. It establishes the stakes and makes it reasonable that people would want to stop him.

Yeah, that's all's I'm looking for as well. I can make the mental leaps required as well as the next guy and I don't need every detail spelled out or someone to hold my hand. However, when you don't even really know what the stakes are or what motivates the main characters in the narrative or (less importantly) how any of the many disparate elements in the show tie together or provide context to the story, it's a little more difficult to be intellectually satisfied with the story overall.

All that being said, I was able to shift the thinking part of my brain into neutral once I realized they weren't going to even try and make the story make internal sense and just enjoy the struggle the characters went through and how things were resolved for them which is clearly what the writers were intending to focus on in the last season.

Yeah, I think I kind of went with the same thought process, just unconsciously. I'm horribly easy to please and so long as I can latch on to something (such as the fantastic character arcs in Lost), I'm more than content. Yeah, the mysteries were cool and I was hoping for a bit more, but we're having a ten page thread that's devolved into a discussion of various theories and mysteries seven months after the show ended and I only expect this to continue for many years to come. That's a success in my eyes.

 

[label]

Yeah, the mysteries were cool and I was hoping for a bit more, but we're having a ten page thread that's devolved into a discussion of various theories and mysteries seven months after the show ended and I only expect this to continue for many years to come. That's a success in my eyes.

An excellent point.

I'm generally very satisfied with Lost and definitely consider it a success as well. I guess the only reason I got involved in the discussions at all were the claims that "all the answers are there" which obviously I disagree with. I just didn't let that get in the way of enjoying the finale when it was said and done unlike others who felt betrayed or ripped off.

 

[darthraidr]

This is bad, lazy writing - that's an objectcive fact. This doesn't change just because you like the ending, Temis the Red-Nosed Vorta.

I am sick and tired of people making statements like this. You are OBJECTIVELY incorrect in your statement.

You can say "i didn't like it" but the series was extremely well-written and very much internally coherent even if you didn't get the technobabble answers you were longing for.

I could go as far to say that people who think the Lost writing was lazy were simply lazy viewers themselves and should probably never read a post-modern literary novel either.

i actually agree with most of what ProtoAvatar has said. i felt the writing was pretty bad. But it was cleverly hidden. The mysteries they kept throwing at the viewer were distractions. The writers ended up wanting the viewers to focus on the mysterious rather than the mundane, the reality of the situation.

and it worked. but in my opinion, the show had such a weak foundation, the characters never fully responded to their base situation (trying to survive on an island) that i couldnt invest in the mystery.

the writers knew that they had written dumb characters, and knew that the audience wasn't thinking about the reality of the situation. Because no one in the group ever walked around the island fully, the writers were able to invent a second island, a submarine dock, a village on the coast, a boat docked on the main island and a lighthouse.

i will give the writers credit for their sleight of hand and their crafting of a story that inspires so many people. but i dont think they had any grand narrative vision.

 

[theenglish]

...they weren't going to even try and make the story make internal sense and just enjoy the struggle the characters went through and how things were resolved for them which is clearly what the writers were intending to focus on in the last season.

This is one point that is just incorrect. Lost is internally consistent. You can't say that the writers say one thing in one season and then contradict themselves in the next, although like every series I am sure there are a number of small continuity errors.

You can say that you would like more explanation for what is presented as answers, which is the crux of the debate. This is different than internal consistency.

 

[C_Miller]

...they weren't going to even try and make the story make internal sense and just enjoy the struggle the characters went through and how things were resolved for them which is clearly what the writers were intending to focus on in the last season.

This is one point that is just incorrect. Lost is internally consistent. You can't say that the writers say one thing in one season and then contradict themselves in the next, although like every series I am sure there are a number of small continuity errors.

You can say that you would like more explanation for what is presented as answers, which is the crux of the debate. This is different than internal consistency.

It's a semantics thing. I understand what he meant. He meant that some aspects of the story didn't always make sense, because at times the writers left it vague on purpose and forgot about certain things. The writers clearly had a rule book and followed them, but they didn't always let us in on them.

But, we all did enjoy the finale, so we have to stick together.

 

[theenglish]

^^^Okay, I will lay off.

I think the biggest fault of the series was the second season. The story just dragged and dragged during those episodes. Many people lost interest. The second and third season of the series could easily have been combined to form a single season. Also, some more answers and history of the island could have been divulged earlier in the series. The timing of the birth of Jacob and MiB episode, for me, was just too too late in the show. (I have a similar issue with all of Voldemort's backstory being reserved for the penultimate chapter of the series.)

Lost also suffered from having to fire nearly every new actor they hired that season, which I am sure threw a wrench in whatever was planned for those characters.

But these are normal and inevitable problems in series dramas.

 

[stj]

As diverting as all the crazy mysteries were, the real mysteries are things like these:

What did Locke have faith in?

In what way was Jack a man of science?

How did Kate find redemption when she never even admitted guilt?

How is it spiritually richer for Jack to die in a plane crash/killing MIB but still necessary to have an imaginary wife and son? (It's really hard to believe the studio doesn't pick the pictures for the credits, so I'm still not sure any of the series "really" happened.)

How can these people be said to have found each other when episode after episode hinged on the fact these people never talk to each other?

Why are they and we supposed to believe dead Christian at the end when he's been the smoke monster before?

Is niceness all it really takes to make Hurley the leader, or is it because he's crazy?

How does Sayid get redemption or even find much of anything? (Certainly not Nadia.)

Are there moral implications to being a Constant like Desmond?

Why does Charlie have to die?

Does Faraday appearing in the imaginary world as a happy pianist somehow constitute some sort of happy ending for the character? If not, how is it part of resolving Jack's daddy issues?

Why do Jack's daddy issues get wrapped up with the salvation of the world?

How could anybody not see that that poetic justice demanded that Kate and Sawyer got stuck with each other, while Jack and Juliet lived sane and decent lives?

Saying Lost was about the characters is the same as saying it was shit. The razzle dazzle of the mysteries were absolutely vital to covering up the childishness of the soap, and propelling sensational developments to state emo scenes in. Then they didn't deliver on the mysteries. We're left with really stupid character arcs.

Bait and switch.

 

[Nardpuncher]

^^^ Another great post that I agree with.

A few months ago we had a Lost finale thread and the number of supportive posts made me think I was weird. Well I am, but not because of Lost's finale.

 

[label]

Why does Charlie have to die?

This is a great question, because it's an example of where the show seems to clearly state one thing and then it never happens and no on screen comment is made. Charlie went to his death because he had the understanding that his sacrifice would allow Claire and the Baby to get on the chopper. Desmond was sure of this fact and Charlie made double sure that his death would result in Claire and Aaron getting on the chopper. That clearly never happened and they never addressed it.

Now granted, the writers might have an answer to why this didn't occur that makes sense, but it appears to be an inconsistency within the context of the show that is never addressed.