Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador kit!

[USS Mariner]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Tallguy said:
Mariner, I'll disagree with that, just because TNG is when they finally figured out how to make the Excelsior look alright.

[snark]

Alright being the operative word, like when your friend says he won't have sex with his girlfriend until marriage.

[/snark]

If the 2000 was more like the Ingram, I'd miss it. But it's snot.

 

[USS Mariner]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

The God Thing said:

Mariner Class said:
I'm pretty sure we never would have seen the NX-2000 again, except in a dumpster.

Call me a despicably vindictive SOB, but I would have much preferred something a little more symbolic such as, say, Gene Roddenberry presiding over an Excelsior-burning (using Harve Bennett as the accelerant) religious ceremony in the Paramount carpark one evening after business hours. An autographed photo of the resulting puddle of molten plastic and aluminum could have then been sent to Bill George c/- ILM as a token of The Great Bird's appreciation for services rendered.

TGT

That would grant it "credit undeserved."

 

[Cary L. Brown]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Oh, c'mon guys... the Excelsior was just perfect for what it's story role was intended to be in ST-III. It was an "ubership."

Any of you remember the Azrael-Batman period i the comics? Bruce Wayne was injured so he had a stand-in... who was supposed to continue as though he was Wayne, while Wayne recuperated. But that stand-in eventually became a caricature of who he originally was supposed to be (blades on the fingers, body armor, guns and swords and so forth...

He ended up looking like this:

Well, that's what Excelsior was to Enterprise. A lot more powerful (into the "overkill" category) but none of the style, none of the finesse. That's what the Excelsior was, really..

 

[Unicron]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

I have to admit I always thought the Bat-armor was pretty cool, though of course you're right. He became the epitome of what Bruce Wayne as Batman wasn't.

 

[aridas sofia]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

That's all well and good, Cary. But once its purpose was fulfilled, it should have been retired. To use a polite word.

It violates the finely wrought sense of aesthetics that come down to us from Jefferies to Probert and Taylor. It's part of that seriously bad-headed wrong turn that Trek took at TWOK, and is part and parcel with those Mounty uniforms and fire extinguishers and face-to-face space battles and the sudden disappearance of any sign of Roddenberry's/ Yuricich's San Francisco. And it's sort of weird that it survived the return to artistic sense that came with the first season of TNG.

 

[Griffworks]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

I dunno... I kinda like the Excelsior design....

 

[Tallguy]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Mariner Class said:
Alright being the operative word, like when your friend says he won't have sex with his girlfriend until marriage.

Ahh, see now I would say that was OUTSTANDING. But that's another thread (that I won't be involved in).

Once TNG started and they stopped shooting the Excelsior like the bad guy, I liked her a LOT.

ANYway, now that all the anti-Excelsior crowd have checked in (Hi, aridas!) we can look at the Ambasador and say "Cracking good ship, Andy!"

 

[aridas sofia]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Hiya, Tallguy! You guys know I can't pass up a chance to take a swipe at the Bennett/Meyer/Nimoy triumvirate of artistic doom, now don't you?

But please, don't let me drag us OT...

 

[Capt_Jason]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

I don't particularly care for the post-TMP period myself, but Ive always had a...extra-special place in my heart for Excelsior and Constellation...they are both butt-ugly and can kick yer arse quick and double time, and I love 'em to the bitter end!

 

[Maurice]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Looking at this image again, I think I see one reason someone might not've wanted to use it. From this angle, and the the ship being small in frame, a suspect there's a fair chance that many audience members wouldn't recognize it as being a different design from the hero ship.

 

[Arpy]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

^ That's actually what I was thinking too. Maybe if the nacelles/collectors were different shades of blue/red. I'd still take it over the overabundance of Excelsiors and Mirandas and the E-C in "Yesterday's Enterprise" though.

I'm also curious what the deflector will look like finished. I hope it's different from anything else we've seen so that, like the vertical impulse engines, it too gives this ship it's own look unique identity from anything else in the line. ...I know I said it before, but just look at the Excelsior Class juxtaposed with the E-A, (canon)E-C, and E-D. Even the (IMO, disgusting) E-E went (IMO, shamefully) neckless.

Also, from the canon designs, anyone ever think the lineages could have gone like this...

E E-A E-C E-D
E E-A E-B E-E E-D

...Just being a geek here.

 

[USS Mariner]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

DS9Sega said:

Looking at this image again, I think I see one reason someone might not've wanted to use it. From this angle, and the the ship being small in frame, a suspect there's a fair chance that many audience members wouldn't recognize it as being a different design from the hero ship.

I doubt they would have used that angle, though. Besides, I'm sure Andy could have quickly painted another at an alternate angle if required.

 

[Maurice]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

^^^Well, that's sorta my point. They *didn't* use that angle (the painting).

Although I recall Andy telling me the reasoning he was given for it's non-use was more like "we don't use paintings for ships", but he can correct me if I'm misrememebering.

 

[FalTorPan]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

DS9Sega said:
Looking at this image again, I think I see one reason someone might not've wanted to use it. From this angle, and the the ship being small in frame, a suspect there's a fair chance that many audience members wouldn't recognize it as being a different design from the hero ship.

I don't think this would be a problem. We're looking at a still image. If the Enterprise-D were to be in motion, accompanied by a captain's log entry about the Enterprise arriving at its rendezvous point with the USS Whatever, then this would clear up most ambiguity.

It's also a Star Trek tradition that the "hero ship" usually points toward screen right, as the Enterprise-D is doing in the still image.

 

[Cary L. Brown]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Guys, isn't it apparent (I'd go so far as "obvious") that this is from "Conspiracy" and is Walker Keel's ship?

I remember being tremendously disappointed that they mentioned that Keel's ship, an "Ambassador class" ship, was mentioned, then mentioned as being found as debris, but never seen.

Andrew... yeah or nay?

 

[Timo]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Uh, since that pic's just a custom job by DS9Sega from the last page (and since Picard and Keel were supposed to rendezvous at a hellhole of a planet rather than a nice Class M holiday resort), I'd avoid making that connection at this juncture.

The demonstration is very convincing, though. That could be Keel's ship from the alternate timeline where they rendezvoused over Pacifica.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Cary L. Brown]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Timo said:
Uh, since that pic's just a custom job by DS9Sega from the last page (and since Picard and Keel were supposed to rendezvous at a hellhole of a planet rather than a nice Class M holiday resort), I'd avoid making that connection at this juncture.

The demonstration is very convincing, though. That could be Keel's ship from the alternate timeline where they rendezvoused over Pacifica.

Timo Saloniemi

Timo, you're reading something into my post which wasn't there.

I know full-well that this is a mock-up image using Andrew's painting as the basis.

MY point was that the painting was, according to Andrew, done for a Season 1 episode, but it wasn't used in the actual episode.

There was, as far as I can recall, only one reference to an Ambassador-class starship in Season 1. That was in "Conspiracy."

So my point (which I THOUGHT was quite clear) was that Andrew must have done the painting to be used in "Conspiracy." But that it ended up not being used (very likely for the very reason people have pointed out, above... that from the angle shown, it's almost TOO similar to the 1701-D).

 

[Probert]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Cary L. Brown said:
Guys, isn't it apparent (I'd go so far as "obvious") that this is from "Conspiracy" and is Walker Keel's ship?

I remember being tremendously disappointed that they mentioned that Keel's ship, an "Ambassador class" ship, was mentioned, then mentioned as being found as debris, but never seen.

Andrew... yeah or nay?

Nay. It was from 'Naked Now'.

While DS9Sega's composition is surprisingly correct, as to the one I'd proposed, this is what they ended up with: Final version

Also, an Ambassador class ship wasn't specified. I wanted to drop in there in an attempt to update the look of 'other' SF ships early on, knowing they'd resort to using 90-year-old ships.

Andrew-

 

[Captain Robert April]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Gotta love all this speculation flying around about what the painting was meant for, and nobody thought to just ask Andrew for the specifics.

I think we've spent too many years in the wilderness.

 

[Maurice]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Probert said:

Cary L. Brown said:
Guys, isn't it apparent (I'd go so far as "obvious") that this is from "Conspiracy" and is Walker Keel's ship?

I remember being tremendously disappointed that they mentioned that Keel's ship, an "Ambassador class" ship, was mentioned, then mentioned as being found as debris, but never seen.

Andrew... yeah or nay?

Nay. It was from 'Naked Now'.

While DS9Sega's composition is surprisingly correct, as to the one I'd proposed, this is what they ended up with: Final version

Also, an Ambassador class ship wasn't specified. I wanted to drop in there in an attempt to update the look of 'other' SF ships early on, knowing they'd resort to using 90-year-old ships.

Andrew-

Hey pal,

Quick question... the ship in "The Naked Now" you mention was seen in numerous shots throughout the episode, and even blown up at the end, so I'm having a tough time imagining how a matte painting could have served in this capacity.

Or am I just hopelessly confused?

Maurice