An updated Star Trek fiction timeline

[Centaur2000]

I really do like the timeline presented in Voyages of Imagination. Unfortunately it hadn't received an update in a very long time. The timeline at Memory Beta seems to be quite up-to-date but lacks the details given in Voyages of Imagination. And as far as I know there is no online resource providing both, a detailed and up-to-date timeline.

That's why I programmed a small prototype to generate a timeline and based on data in CSV files. My goal is to make managing all the data easy and to automate the timeline creation as much as possible.

You can watch the first result here. The underlying test data can be found here.

My prototype is just about making the logic work. A nice design will follow later. Additionally, not every attribute is displayed (e.g. footnotes, proper acronyms for each series).

I'm planning to build a dymamic website based on that prototype. When finished the timeline will contain all episodes, movies, novels etc.and offers different criteria to filter the timeline. For example it should be possible to just display certain years or series.

What do you think? Constructive feedback is very welcome.

 

[ryan123450]

I also lamented the fact that an updated Pocket Books Timeline hadn't been published in years. But I knew that a complete update and then continuing to keep the project up to date was beyond my own time commitment/ability. So when I published by website years ago, it included this page (https://startreklitverse.yolasite.com/post-nemesis-month-by-month.php) which is a somewhat simplified version, which also only tackles the post-Nemesis years. Sadly I've let it fall into disrepair and is very inaccurate in portions.

Also if you didn't know, the original group of Timeliners (which I am now a part of as well) who wrote the Pocket Books Timeline and donated it to Pocket for publication in Voyages of the Imagination regrouped about two years ago. We have been slowly but surely updating the document. Hopefully Pocket or someone will be interested in publishing it again (I have the idea in the back of my head that maybe it could just be published as part of startrek.com so we could keep it constantly updated.)

It's great to hear (as I often do) that the hunger for that update is out there. I'm hoping the day will come when it's published again.

As far as your progress goes, it's cool to see someone else with an interest in this sort of thing. I can see that you have the most coding ability of any chronology enthusiast I've interacted with. Are you also interested in figuring out the data, or just organizing it? By that I mean does it interest you to read an old novel and look for clues as to exactly when it takes place (ranks, reference to other episodes, stardates, etc.) or is your main interest in organizing this data once it is already laid out (say by the Memory Beta timeline or exact historian's notes in new novels)?

I look forward to seeing what you come up with, though it is somewhat disheartening to think that if you succeed, the update so many people are longing for will be readily available online. I planned to delete my meager attempt at some point, to create even more of a need for an updated print version to be republished.

 

[JD]

Honestly, rather than a print update I'd rather see it as a regular thing on either StarTrek.com or Simon and Schuster's Star Trek books page. That way it can be updated regularly, and if they really wanted to go all in they could even make it interactive.

 

[Centaur2000]

Thanks for your reply.

I also lamented the fact that an updated Pocket Books Timeline hadn't been published in years. But I knew that a complete update and then continuing to keep the project up to date was beyond my own time commitment/ability. So when I published by website years ago, it included this page (https://startreklitverse.yolasite.com/post-nemesis-month-by-month.php) which is a somewhat simplified version, which also only tackles the post-Nemesis years. Sadly I've let it fall into disrepair and is very inaccurate in portions.

I really love your post-Nemesis timeline. It's really impressive! I imagine it must've been quite some work.

As far as your progress goes, it's cool to see someone else with an interest in this sort of thing. I can see that you have the most coding ability of any chronology enthusiast I've interacted with.

Thank you!

Are you also interested in figuring out the data, or just organizing it? By that I mean does it interest you to read an old novel and look for clues as to exactly when it takes place (ranks, reference to other episodes, stardates, etc.) or is your main interest in organizing this data once it is already laid out (say by the Memory Beta timeline or exact historian's notes in new novels)?

For quite some time now I'm re-reading all of my novels and watching the episodes and movies in parallel, chronologically of couse. The timeline in Voyages of Imagination is a regular companion in that endeavour. That's the reason why I started with this project. I need an updated version. So at the moment I'm more into building the application to organize and display the data. I think I would add data when I'm progressing in my reading past the point where the timeline ends. At this point I don't know how deep I would dig to find said clues and details.

I look forward to seeing what you come up with, though it is somewhat disheartening to think that if you succeed, the update so many people are longing for will be readily available online.

In my opinion there is no competition between an online version and a printed one. Even while I build this online version I would love to have an updated printed timeline on my bookshelf. I image there are a lot of people who think likewise.

So what's next? I'll finish the prototype (handling of TOS stardates, support of multiple stories within a single book and some other details). After that I would like to add real and complete data to compare the results with the existing timeline.

Is your timeline and the underlying data open-source? What do you think about contributing to each other's efforts?

 

[Centaur2000]

I've got an update: Anthologies are supported now as well as different dates for each chapter/section. To demonstrate this I selected "An Easy Fast" from the Captain's Table anthology.
You can take a look at the generated output: https://github.com/etienneq/star-trek-timeline/blob/master/timeline_example.md

Next I will update the text format to conform to the timeline in Voyages of Imagination. I think that way it's easier to compare both and to detect possible bugs in the logic that generates the timeline from raw data.
Plus I will write some documentation about the raw data format and how one can add data.

 

[ryan123450]

Sorry for the late reply. Been a busy week. Anything you find on my site is free for whoever to use as they please. I see your reasoning behind matching your formatting to the VoI one, for easy comparison, but in the end I always thought the exact formatting of the VoI Timeline was kinda wonky.

I doubt I have much to add to your project, mostly because of time commitments. I already have way less time than I'd prefer to devote to my website and the Timeliners group. And I'm not particularly interested in making the Post-Nemesis page on my site better/more updated, since like I said, I plan on taking it down before too long anyway.

I am excited to see that another project you appear to be working on is a stardate calculator. If you are able to accomplish that and are looking for a similar project, I'd still love to find someone who can build a Klingon calendar calculator for my site. Here's the math involved (https://startreklitverse.yolasite.com/klingon-calendar-conversions.php) but I'm clueless about the coding. I'm dreaming of something like this (http://www.hillschmidt.de/gbr/sternenzeit.htm) that can go back and forth between the two systems. Let me know if that's something you'd be interested in.

 

[JD]

Are you still going to continue to update the simple post Nemesis and the series timelines?

 

[ryan123450]

Absolutely!

 

[Centaur2000]

Sorry for the late reply. Been a busy week. Anything you find on my site is free for whoever to use as they please.

Regarding data and open-source I did not refer to your post-nemesis timeline but to the Timeliners timeline data. My timeline generator is not for such detailed timelines as your post-nemesis one but for the kind in VoI. It would be quite cool if you could share your data. I think it wouldn't make much sense if I had to rebuild that data from scratch for an online version of the fiction timeline. What do you and your fellow Timeliners think about it?

I see your reasoning behind matching your formatting to the VoI one, for easy comparison, but in the end I always thought the exact formatting of the VoI Timeline was kinda wonky.

I totally agree. It would be just for an easy initial comparison. For the finished product I hopefully come up with something more appealing to the online community.

I doubt I have much to add to your project, mostly because of time commitments. I already have way less time than I'd prefer to devote to my website and the Timeliners group. And I'm not particularly interested in making the Post-Nemesis page on my site better/more updated, since like I said, I plan on taking it down before too long anyway.

As stated above I suppose I didn't make myself clear in my former post. I'm with you - all money's on the "real" fiction timeline.

I am excited to see that another project you appear to be working on is a stardate calculator. If you are able to accomplish that and are looking for a similar project, I'd still love to find someone who can build a Klingon calendar calculator for my site. Here's the math involved (https://startreklitverse.yolasite.com/klingon-calendar-conversions.php) but I'm clueless about the coding. I'm dreaming of something like this (http://www.hillschmidt.de/gbr/sternenzeit.htm) that can go back and forth between the two systems. Let me know if that's something you'd be interested in.

Hey, that's cool. I skimmed your pages about Klingon calendar a while back and found it intriguing. After finishing the timeline thing and time permitting, I surely will look into it!

 

[ryan123450]

Regarding data and open-source I did not refer to your post-nemesis timeline but to the Timeliners timeline data. My timeline generator is not for such detailed timelines as your post-nemesis one but for the kind in VoI. It would be quite cool if you could share your data. I think it wouldn't make much sense if I had to rebuild that data from scratch for an online version of the fiction timeline. What do you and your fellow Timeliners think about it?

For what it’s worth, my post-Nemesis page is less detailed than the VoI one if anything. I didn’t break things up any more specifically than chapters, while the Pocket Books Timeline goes down to the level of subsections of chapters where appropriate.

As far as sharing the working copy of the Timeliners updated document, that would be a definite no unfortunately. That is only for our group, and hopefully for whoever we eventually pass it on to for publication. Sorry to disappoint.

Hey, that's cool. I skimmed your pages about Klingon calendar a while back and found it intriguing. After finishing the timeline thing and time permitting, I surely will look into it!

I am excited about the prospect! I look forward to the opportunity!

 

[Centaur2000]

As far as sharing the working copy of the Timeliners updated document, that would be a definite no unfortunately. That is only for our group, and hopefully for whoever we eventually pass it on to for publication. Sorry to disappoint.

Somehow I feared you would say so. But of course I can understand your decision. In any case I will continue with my project to build an online timeline application with filters etc. I just have to add data from scratch. Hopefully I can showcase the advantages of an online version to change your mind some day.

 

[ryan123450]

Really not up to me anyway, as it’s a group project. @Jbarney is our fearless leader.

I doubt you’d have trouble getting opinions about specific stories if you brought them up in the Books and Comics Timelin-ing thread though.

 

[StefanM]

I also lamented the fact that an updated Pocket Books Timeline hadn't been published in years. But I knew that a complete update and then continuing to keep the project up to date was beyond my own time commitment/ability. So when I published by website years ago, it included this page (https://startreklitverse.yolasite.com/post-nemesis-month-by-month.php) which is a somewhat simplified version, which also only tackles the post-Nemesis years. Sadly I've let it fall into disrepair and is very inaccurate in portions.

Thanks to your whole team for this great site.
The month-by-month-list is a little bit to much for me, I don't need it THIS precise, bis this list: https://startreklitverse.yolasite.com/simple-post-nemesis-reading-list.php is absolutely perfect for the right reading order.
(The list just told me, I have to read a lot of Voyager for the next months, before I can start Cold Equations [I've already finished Typhon Pact; obviously to early...])

 

[ryan123450]

Thanks! Just me behind the site, though with the help of many others by conversation and info swapping. And yes, I always hear that my most popular page is the Simple Post Nemesis Reading List. That is show in each month’s traffic report as well. Glad it’s useful to you!

 

[JD]

Your site is pretty much my main source for figuring out what order to read the books in.

 

[jimcat]

Hello @Centaur2000 ,
I wanted to add my own words of encouragement for your project (and not just in another thread). The data is presented really clearly (as I said in @ryan123450 ’s thread on time-lining earlier). I’m only sorry I can’t be any help in deciding what order everything should go, but I’ll be really interested to see how your ideas develop.

I was struck by the comments about the Voyages of Imagination timeline. I’ve started re-reading the novels myself, and I compiled an index to the timeline because I got fed up riffling through the pages trying to find things. If it’s any use to anyone else, I’ve put a copy up at this link:
http://atavachron.wikidot.com/calendars:clbcalendar

Best wishes,
Timon

 

[ryan123450]

Wow @jimcat! As always everything you’ve got there is top notch. Glad that you’re making use of my Klingon system. I’m still planning on putting a link to your date conversion spreadsheet on my Klingon conversion page. That and a ton of other little improvements have been on my to-do list for months. I’ll definitely be getting to it though.

 

[Centaur2000]

Thanks @jimcat, for your kind words and your website. It makes me even more interested in calendars, Klingon and otherwise.

As for the timeline, I started building a reactive web app with https://vuejs.org/. As soon as there is something to touch and see I will share it here.

 

[Oz Trekkie]

Good to see people keen on keeping the timeline up to date. I have my own list I keep up to date and would love to have the time to get my own website up and running. I have a plan just not the time at the moment.

 

[Jbarney]

Whoa.....haven't been around for a couple of weeks and didn't notice this thread. So I will read through all of these comments and try to respond accordingly.

As for the status of the project....it is alive and well and pretty much updated, although things have been a little slower over the last couple of months because many of the active members have life commitments, etc. All of the folks working on the project love the work, and it is a nice little playground for all of us enjoy.

To give a little bit of history about the group....All of the original Timeliners, the guys who had their names published with the project when it was published two decades ago....they are back on board with the project and supportive. They help out when they can and deserve all of the credit in the world for continuing what Mike Okuda gave us with the Star Trek Chronologies.

Getting the document updated and publishable for Voyages of Imagination was a huge task, and with the down turn in Trek during the last recession, the group took a bit of a break. With no Trek on television, well, life took over, and while Pocket continued to publish....the project didn't receive much attention.

That changed about 3 years ago. I remember the feeling I had when I emailed the original group of folks before the 2nd version of the timeline was published in the final pages of the last Gateways hardcover. I had asked to help out before that. It wasn't an immediate "yes" back then, as I needed to probe what the group was working on and sorta prove that I was committed, willing to sometime research things, willing to stay involved. That work progressed into the Voyages of Imagination Timeline....and after a couple of years, I just felt badly that we were falling behind. Got the old group together and then decided to pay attention to Chronology related discussions here, very interested in Timeline threads, etc. After measuring/reading/following certain people here who had the same "Chronology Disease" that the original group had....invites when out.

I don't want to get anyone's hope up on a number of fronts, but comments on a couple of things.... As far as new members, I guess it would sorta be like making a pitch to an editor. Don't mean that to sound exclusive, controlling, or limiting, but the group deserves to have members who are willing to do a lot of research, take a lot of notes, not share the material with others, etc. New members are invited, in part, based on there communications here. We try to take notice of people who have the same disease as us.

This is not an announcement really, but I can also say that "the powers that be" are aware that the timeline has been updated by the group. Some writers have helped out with placement of their novels. Other writers have been nice enough to come on board. Understand that the timeline being published again really depends on Pocket/CBS and that the publishing world has changed a lot since VOI. The timeline continues to be updated and many of us do this because we have faith that there will be interest in it again.

Glad to read that people still reference Voyages of Imagination.

Hope this helps,
Jason