But wasn't the Enterprise exploring a potential colony world in the epilogue of Losing the Peace?
After the Destiny events, The Typhon Pact and future novels
- Thread starter kaysea
- Start date
but they were called back as they were exploring the world and told their mission had changed.
look le carre' and graham greene are two of my favorite authors.
and at times i like a little political intrigue even in my trek (pale moonlight is one of the my favorite episodes)
but, right now my favorite of the trek novels has been what titan has been delivering.
good ole.. searching out new life and new civilizations with some pretty interesting characters among the crew.
so i was glad when titan got sent back out to explore and not dragged into fixing the mess that the federation is now.
frankly i suspect the only reason the typhon pact hasnt taken on the federation (considering the sorry state it is in) is that are not totally sure what went down between the borg and the federation.
if they were ever to find out the truth that the federation (or certain ships) just acted to bring certain forces together then they just might.
since i am not to thrilled with the typhon pact stuff this might a book i will get later on used rather then getting it right away as i did the last one.
yep that is what i got out of the epilogue.
look le carre' and graham greene are two of my favorite authors.
and at times i like a little political intrigue even in my trek (pale moonlight is one of the my favorite episodes)
but, right now my favorite of the trek novels has been what titan has been delivering.
good ole.. searching out new life and new civilizations with some pretty interesting characters among the crew.
so i was glad when titan got sent back out to explore and not dragged into fixing the mess that the federation is now.
frankly i suspect the only reason the typhon pact hasnt taken on the federation (considering the sorry state it is in) is that are not totally sure what went down between the borg and the federation.
if they were ever to find out the truth that the federation (or certain ships) just acted to bring certain forces together then they just might.
since i am not to thrilled with the typhon pact stuff this might a book i will get later on used rather then getting it right away as i did the last one.
Heck, they know that perfectly well. Many of the member states of the Typhon Pact are states that were pressured by President Bacco to join the alliance against the Borg. And it was that very action that inspired them to form the Pact. Bacco persuaded them that they'd be stronger together than apart, but they wanted to be part of a united front that wasn't dominated by the Federation and its root-beer cultural imperialism.
Don't assume that every rival state is automatically interested in going to war. The Typhon Pact's agenda isn't to invade or conquer the Federation, but to balance it, to offer an alternative power bloc for worlds and interworld states that are wary of the Federation's cultural and astropolitical dominance, or that no longer believe the Federation is strong enough to protect the quadrant.
After all, it's not like the member states of the Pact are in particularly strong positions themselves militarily or economically. The Romulan Star Empire has been crippled by Donatra's secession; the Kinshaya recently lost their homeworld to Klingon invasion; the Gorn are presumably still recovering from the civil war in The Gorn Crisis; the Breen are probably still recovering from Dominion War losses; etc. Heck, that's the whole reason they decided to unite. Their first priority isn't to destroy the Federation, it's to strengthen the security and economies of their own nations. That may put them in competition with the UFP for allies, resources, and leadership in the quadrant, but their goal at this point is consolidation, not conquest.
i know that certain members of the pact were bought in by the federation president to help against the borg.
though didnt the breen decline(cant remember)
but why disclose to someone in the past that had actually managed to attack earth just how little the federation had to with the borg going away.
though didnt the breen decline(cant remember)
but why disclose to someone in the past that had actually managed to attack earth just how little the federation had to with the borg going away.
^I think you've missed the overall point of my post. Whether the Pact members have that information or not is irrelevant, because conquest is not the Pact's reason for existence.
^I wouldn't assume that. The first mention of the Breen was in "Hero Worship," set in 2368. It's now 2381 in the books. Out of that 13-year span, although there were a few references to acts of Breen piracy and raids, the only time the Breen were participants in "major armed conflict" was between "Strange Bedfellows" and "What You Leave Behind," a period that I would reckon as less than two months. That means that of the total length of time we've known about the Breen, they've spent a paltry 1.3 percent of it waging war. And that wasn't a war they instigated; they simply rode on the coattails of the Dominion, hoping to back the winning team.
I was also under the impression that the Enterprise-E, along with other older starships, were going to stay near home to help with the refugee crisis, while newer ships like the Vesta-class and the Luna-class were tasked with reviving Starfleet's core mission of exploration.
I agree with Christopher. One thing that I don't remember happening though, is President Bacco pressuring the Typhon Pact members into joining the alliance. I would say that she told them the pros and cons of not helping with the formation of a defense force to fight the Borg invasion.
Dude, she literally forced their ambassadors to attend a summit in the Roth Dining Room and only allowed the ambassadors of those who committed to the anti-Borg alliance to leave. Then she used every wheel and deal she could to cut the Tholians' legs out from under them for fear that they'd take advantage of the Borg crisis to attack the Federation.
In what possible sense is that not pressuring them into joining the anti-Borg alliance?
She forced all alliance members to go to the meeting in hopes that they would listen to her, but that doesn't mean that the Federation was engaged in acts a petty thug would engage in. Sometimes, even the most peaceful and intelligent beings need to be a little forceful so that those who don't respond well to diplomacy, get the idea. Regarding President's Bacco's unconvential dealing with the Tholian ambassador: she didn't threaten her because the Federation was afraid that the Tholians would attack it, but because the Tholians(like the Klingons and the Tellerites) respond better when they are talked to in a mean manner. Remember, Captain Archer of the NX-01 had to talk tough to the Tellerites on more than one ocassion.
She literally kidnapped every major ambassador on Earth. That's vaguely thuggish, when you get down to it.
And even if it weren't, "pressuring" someone isn't the same thing as "acting like a thug;" you're moving the goalposts.
Sure. I'm not saying it was wrong to pressure them or to kidnap their ambassadors. But let's not paint a dishonestly flattering picture of what she did, either: She pressured every single Typhon Pact member to join her anti-Borg alliance, and in fact pretty much bullied the entire Alpha Quadrant into contributing to the expeditionary force at the Azure Nebula.
That was the right thing to do. But it was also something that they would almost inevitably resent.
You are completely misremembering Destiny Book II. Bacco deliberately cut the Tholians' legs out from under them after they refused to join the anti-Borg alliance by bribing the Ferengi into hiring Breen and Orion mercenaries that the Tholians would have otherwise hired. She did this because she was worried the Tholians would attack the Federation; the Tholians, quite understandably, are angry because it left them with that many fewer ships when the Borg Invasion started.
I wonder if we'll see a reunification of the two Romulan states prior to their obliteration in 2387?
...but I guess that leads back to the endless "should Countdown be part of the novel continuity" thing again.
...but I guess that leads back to the endless "should Countdown be part of the novel continuity" thing again.
One of the things I like about the Pact development is that it complicates the whole reunited-Romulans issue. Donatra pretty much admitted her eventual plan was to wait for everyone to grow sick of Tal'aura and eventually slide back into being one people again (only minus the Tal'aura). If the RSE citizens adapt well to the Pact, however, and those in the IRS committ to the Khitomer Accords, the Romulans might end up truly divided. As of present, it appears the citizens don't really care whose side they ended up on (so A Singular Destiny implied)- it's the nobles and officers having a spat, more or less, not the people being divided in any sense meaningful to them. They'd have no reason not to eventually slide back together once Donatra or Tal'aura succeeded in knocking the other off balance (or until Tal'aura selfdestructs). But if that reunification meant having to choose between Pact, Accords or full neutrality once the people had grown used to their respective alliances...well, it might be difficult to put humpty tr'dumpty back together again. And as unity would pretty much mean betraying an obligation to one of the two power blocs, will everyone else in the galaxy be opposed to reunification because it might lose them a strong ally?
I'm sorry guys, but I don't see the events that took place in the Destiny books as badly as you guys see them. Maybe it's because I read them from a much more diplomatic perspective, than others who have responded to my posts. I say that because it seems to me that everybody else who has responded to my posts on here, seems to be looking at the events that transpired in the Destiny books from a more agressive/militaristic perspective than I am.
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It'll also help to keep in mind that the Azure Nebula Fleet was easily one of the greatest military disasters in galactic history. The fact that all those ships Bacco convinced the soon-to-be Pact Powers to donate were stomped on without even pretending to make a difference doubtless colored their view of what happened. Here this uppity Federation woman had gone and twisted their arm into sending their ships on a pointless suicide mission. Even if Bacco hadn't been so aggressive in negotiating their participation in the Fleet, there's no way anyone who participated would think well of the Federation for asking if they didn't already have a friendly view of them.
No, if anything, you're looking at them from a more Federation-centric, less diplomatic point of view, because a vital part of diplomacy is respecting another culture's sovereignty and independence, rather than, say, using thinly-veiled threats, bully tactics, and acts of kidnapping to force them to join an alliance that you're going to be directly controlling.
In their defence, the Federation had their forces at the Azure Nebula smashed to ribbons too. If somehow the Federation fleet was convieniently delayed and missed the battle things might have appeared much, much worse.
True.
And I should point out that the fact that the Federation used bullying tactics, engaged in kidnapping foreign ambassadors, and generally pressured the other states to join the anti-Borg alliance, is not a bad thing. It was necessary, because the Borg were coming and they were going to destroy everything, and someone had to force the squabbling powers of local space into cooperating for their own safety.
But I also think it's absurd to claim that the Federation wasn't, in essence, all but forcing the other states to join its alliance at gunpoint, and to think that the other states wouldn't greatly resent the Federation for it afterwards -- especially in the wake of their forces being lost at Azure.
