Actors not credited on-screen

[Ensign Seven]

Dear everyone

I did not create this thread in the Voyager sub-forum on purpose, since it is more of a general question and there might be other examples from other series as well.

Is there any explanation or theory why Scott Jaeck – the actor of Cavit – was not credited for his appearance in Caretaker? Neither as guest star, nor as co-star. I think that is highly unusual, considering he had several spoken lines and was as original first officer of Voyager quite “present” on screen.

I thought there was some kind of regulation by the actors’ union, that everyone who makes only “peep” has to be credited on-screen, at least as co-star during the end credits. And that is one of the reasons why, especially in TNG, the background actors were often “speechless” or merely “Aye, Sir.” was inserted in the post production when they were not visible on screen.

 

[Grant]

Actors with speaking roles not being credited goes all the way back to the Original series. I have a long list of actors from the original series who I dug up aand found their names. there are various reasons why they were not credited

 

[Jayson1]

I don't think Frank Langella was credited for the 3 episodes of "DS9" he did. I think I read was this was done because he was doing the role more for kids and having his name in the credits might hurt his career or something like that.

Jason

 

[The Wormhole]

I don't think Frank Langella was credited for the 3 episodes of "DS9" he did. I think I read was this was done because he was doing the role more for kids and having his name in the credits might hurt his career or something like that.

Jason

Not exactly. DS9 couldn't afford to pay Frank Langella's salary, but he really wanted to do the show. Since accepting a lower salary could have potentially have ruined leverage for him in any future negotiations, he went uncredited. Meaning that in a very strict legal sense, he didn't technically do the role, allowing him to do the role he wanted to without losing leverage in future negotiations. The acting profession has weird loopholes.

 

[Greg Cox]

See also Judson Scott in THE WRATH OF KHAN.

 

[Kilana2]

Isis in her human appearance.....

 

[Ensign Seven]

Thanks all for your replies. Unfortunately no specifics about Scott Jaeck. Before Caretaker he had another appearance in Star Trek, as an administrator / politician in TNG: Inner Light. For that appearance he was credited as "Guest star". Maybe he did not want another guest star appearance in his filmography?

When Kes came back for "Fury" she was credited as "Also starring".
Dwight Schulz was in his 6 VOY appearances credited as "Special guest star", Frakes his appearance in "Deathwish" as "Special appearance by", Marina Sirtis in his 3 appearances as "Special guest appearance by".

Obviously the whole topic would be PhD-thesis-worthy

 

[Jayson1]

I have a question. Who was the actor who played the face in the floating ball thingy in the TNG ep "Cost of Living?" The one Worf smacks and destroys it. The guy doesn't have any lines but his facial reactions are kind of important to the role so I would say the guy is giving a performance as a actor. What was his credit listed under?

Jason

 

[Ensign Seven]

I have a question. Who was the actor who played the face in the floating ball thingy in the TNG ep "Cost of Living?" The one Worf smacks and destroys it. The guy doesn't have any lines but his facial reactions are kind of important to the role so I would say the guy is giving a performance as a actor. What was his credit listed under?
Jason

Larry Hankin, not credited. He also played the pool professional in VOY Twisted, Jetrel and The Cloud.

 

[StarMan]

Not exactly. DS9 couldn't afford to pay Frank Langella's salary, but he really wanted to do the show. Since accepting a lower salary could have potentially have ruined leverage for him in any future negotiations, he went uncredited. Meaning that in a very strict legal sense, he didn't technically do the role, allowing him to do the role he wanted to without losing leverage in future negotiations. The acting profession has weird loopholes.

Wow! By the time I started watching DS9 I was in love with Skeletor as a kid. I always thought it was because he didn't want to be associated with the series. My bad.

 

[Therin of Andor]

See also Judson Scott in THE WRATH OF KHAN.

Poor Judson. He had just filmed the pilot of "The Phoenix" and was being promoted by his agent as "the next big thing" in Hollywood. By the time ST II came out, he may have become a hot property. His agent fought for billing in the ST II opening credits, but it was denied, so the agent went with "waived billing", which Judson assumed meant that he was waiving his opening billing and taking an end credit instead. So he agreed. On premiere night he discovered that "waived billing" meant... "no billing at all". Some fans interpreted this as meaning that Judson thought that ST II was beneath him. Far from the fact; he was a head honcho in a regular SF/Fantasy film festival for many years and did two more Trek projects in later years.

With Whoopi Goldberg, she chose to "waive billing" in "Star Trek Generations" because it was her friend Patrick Stewart's first time as a feature film lead actor, but Whoopi's previous Academy Award Winner status would normally mean that she should get billed over him, and she didn't want to overshadow her friend.

Whoopi does get billed in "Nemesis", but it's more of a cameo.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Wow! By the time I started watching DS9 I was in love with Skeletor as a kid. I always thought it was because he didn't want to be associated with the series. My bad.

It's confusing, no doubt. Armin Shimerman had a similar quandary when offered a small part on Boston Legal: his agent insisted it would be a huge mistake to accept such a low billing. However, Shimerman has eager to appear on the series, and doing so got the attention of David E Kelley, who ended up expanding the part into a recurring role.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

What about Gosheven in TNG's "The Ensigns of Command"?

Not only was the actor who played him (IIRC) not credited for doing the show, but all of his lines were overdubbed by someone else. Was there something going on behind the scenes?

 

[Tim Thomason]

What about Gosheven in TNG's "The Ensigns of Command"?

Not only was the actor who played him (IIRC) not credited for doing the show, but all of his lines were overdubbed by someone else. Was there something going on behind the scenes?

They didn't like Grainger Hines' voice so they dubbed over him (with an uncredited ADR actor), and when he found out, he asked to be removed from the credits.

 

[Jayson1]

Larry Hankin, not credited. He also played the pool professional in VOY Twisted, Jetrel and The Cloud.

That's a cool bit of info I didn't know. I think I only know the actor for being in one other thing and that is Adam Sandler's "Billy Madison" He is the nice business guy who likes Billy instead of the asshole one who wants to ruin him.

Jason

 

[Jayson1]

Okay I got one. Did Hitler get a credit in the season 4 opener of "Enterprise?." We see him in stock footage of the altered earth past. Do people who show up in stock footage get credited like a actor and who in blazes do they cut a check to?


Jason

 

[The Wormhole]

When Kes came back for "Fury" she was credited as "Also starring".
Dwight Schulz was in his 6 VOY appearances credited as "Special guest star", Frakes his appearance in "Deathwish" as "Special appearance by", Marina Sirtis in his 3 appearances as "Special guest appearance by".

How an actor gets listed in the credits depends entirely on what kind of strings their agents pull with the producers.

Did Hitler get a credit in the season 4 opener of "Enterprise?."

No

 

[Ensign Seven]

Since accepting a lower salary could have potentially have ruined leverage for him in any future negotiations, he went uncredited.

Armin Shimerman had a similar quandary when offered a small part on Boston Legal: his agent insisted it would be a huge mistake to accept such a low billing.

I don't fully understand this. If I look for the next job, how do the responsible people of that production know how much I got for the previous job? If it still is the same studio, I can understand that they have a record of it. But if not...?

They didn't like Grainger Hines' voice so they dubbed over him (with an uncredited ADR actor), and when he found out, he asked to be removed from the credits.

In Memory Alpha it is described a bit differently: "Gosheven was played by Grainger Hines, though his voice was dubbed by an unknown actor, because Hines was unhappy with his performance. As a result, he received no credit for this role."
Actually your explanation sounds more realistic. I doubt that the studio could just "decide" giving an actor no credit after the fact, i.e. after the assignment is completed.
Mysterious...

How an actor gets listed in the credits depends entirely on what kind of strings their agents pull with the producers.

Is that totally arbitrary, so for example could I demand to be credited as "Special cupcake chicken appearance by" if the studio agrees?
I know the difference between co-star and guest star. Different payment, different privileges, heater in the wardrobe or not, ... But how about these "informal" titles, are there any legal implications or something the actors' union looks at?

I find the whole topic very interesting. In my naivety I did not assume that there are other things to consider beyond the payment for a specific job. Limiting the number of co-star jobs, getting the credit removed due to personal animosities etc.

 

[Greg Cox]

You can also ask for a special credit naming your character, which is seen to have a certain cachet:

"And Bart McClure as Zorgon."

Not exactly why that's considered more prestigious than simply "Guest-starring Bart McClure" but apparently it is.

As for other studios or shows knowing what your standard rate is, I imagine word gets around. Agents compare notes with agents, studio heads compare notes with studio heads, actors compare notes with other actors . . . .

"Hang on? They offered you WHAT for that gig? That's an insult."

"Tell me about it. But Bart McClure took the job when I turned it down, so I guess you can get him cheap these days."

Which can lead to:

"My client demands X amount at least."

"Give me a break. He took half that amount for his last gig, so why should we pay any more than that?"

Plus, consider that lots of shows are produced by the same people. So if you do one show for NBC or Universal . . . .

 

[Christopher]

You can also ask for a special credit naming your character, which is seen to have a certain cachet:

"And Bart McClure as Zorgon."

Not exactly why that's considered more prestigious than simply "Guest-starring Bart McClure" but apparently it is.

Because they stand out from the rest of the list and get more attention. Also, they usually go at the end of the list, and people are most likely to notice the first and last items on a list.

As I understand it, the practice grew out of Jonathan Harris's situation on Lost in Space. He was added to the cast after the pilot, but all the other cast members' credit order was already set by contract, so he had to go last, but it would've been ignominious for an experienced adult actor to be billed after two children. So to compensate, they credited him as "Special Guest Star" for extra attention/prestige.

These days, it's become fairly standardized that an "And Actor as Character" credit at the end is second only to lead billing in prominence/pay. When Michael Shanks left Stargate SG-1 and later came back, they couldn't give him back his original second billing because it would mean demoting the other regulars, so instead they gave him an "And/as" credit at the end, which was pretty much comparable to second billing.