A tie up bewteen Star Trek & Battlestar Galactica

[Temis the Vorta]

The original Battlestar Galactica and the reimagined BSG were quite different in tone. The later series was far more darker than the earlier series. I am sure Star Trek can get the same treatment.

It can, but it shouldn't. The original BSG didn't have much worth reviving, so Ron Moore just changed it entirely and did what he felt like doing.

Star Trek is not in that situation. Its core identity is still perfectly usable, even as TV tastes trend towards the darker and grittier. To throw it all out would be ridiculous; you might as well just invent a new name for the show because it won't be Star Trek.

You're overestimating the popularity and ratings draw of the dark & gritty approach. If you look at genre shows today, it's a mixed bag. Some dark shows do well, some lighter ones do well, too.

nuBSG was only moderately successful in the ratings and SyFy has now abandoned the franchise in favor of much lighter fare inspired by the cute & quirky USA approach, but with sf/f themes. Those shows are doing great in the ratings for them. The only space-aliens show left on TV is Falling Skies on TNT. The tone is similar to DS9 in how bleak and gritty it is (people die, but everyone stays optimistic), and it's getting great ratings.

 

[EmoBorg]

Naturally, I totally disagree with this as well.

I am sorry. i took you for a person with some taste. i guess i was wrong. I will leave you to your two and a half men then

I can't help that your idea stinks (to put it as kindly as I can). I just really don't like it at all and I believe it is the worst and unimaginative thing Trek can do. Sorry.

Well to each it'own. If some folks don't see that tv has changed, too bad for them. At least my ideas could produce some gritty drama. Your idea of star trek seems to be some type of dramedy.

 

[C.E. Evans]

I am sorry. i took you for a person with some taste. i guess i was wrong. I will leave you to your two and a half men then

I can't help that your idea stinks (to put it as kindly as I can). I just really don't like it at all and I believe it is the worst and unimaginative thing Trek can do. Sorry.

Well to each it'own. If some folks don't see that tv has changed, too bad for them. At least my ideas could produce some gritty drama. Your idea of star trek seems to be some type of dramedy.

Wrong on so many levels.

 

[EmoBorg]

I can't help that your idea stinks (to put it as kindly as I can). I just really don't like it at all and I believe it is the worst and unimaginative thing Trek can do. Sorry.

Well to each it'own. If some folks don't see that tv has changed, too bad for them. At least my ideas could produce some gritty drama. Your idea of star trek seems to be some type of dramedy.

Wrong on so many levels.

So how would you want the next trek series to be like then ?

 

[C.E. Evans]

Well to each it'own. If some folks don't see that tv has changed, too bad for them. At least my ideas could produce some gritty drama. Your idea of star trek seems to be some type of dramedy.

Wrong on so many levels.

So how would you want the next trek series to be like then ?

I've actually told you more than once. A series that can explore multiple themes--including dark ones--without it being such a depressing and bleak series overall. It doesn't have to light all the time, but it definitely shouldn't be dark all the time either. There should be drama, high action, adventure, intrigue, tragedy, and humor in the mix of things (not necessarily all of the above in every episode, but the series should be well-balanced throughout its run). It should be a world we'd want to be in, rather than one we'd want to avoid.

 

[EmoBorg]

Wrong on so many levels.

So how would you want the next trek series to be like then ?

I've actually told you more than once. A series that can explore multiple themes--including dark ones--without it being such a depressing and bleak series overall. It doesn't have to light all the time, but it definitely shouldn't be dark all the time either. There should be drama, high action, adventure, intrigue, tragedy, and humor in the mix of things (not necessarily all of the above in every episode, but the series should be well-balanced throughout its run). It should be a world we'd want to be in, rather than one we'd want to avoid.

i am sorry but that type of sci fi show may not sell nowdays. Broadcast TV is a good home for such a show but it is unlkely they would be interested in another sci fi show. Cable Channels like syfy and TNT might pick it up but then again they don't seem to be interested in space based sci fi shows. Go luck on promoting your traditional sci fi show. i will stick to my proposal for a darker themed star trek show.

 

[C.E. Evans]

So how would you want the next trek series to be like then ?

I've actually told you more than once. A series that can explore multiple themes--including dark ones--without it being such a depressing and bleak series overall. It doesn't have to light all the time, but it definitely shouldn't be dark all the time either. There should be drama, high action, adventure, intrigue, tragedy, and humor in the mix of things (not necessarily all of the above in every episode, but the series should be well-balanced throughout its run). It should be a world we'd want to be in, rather than one we'd want to avoid.

i am sorry but that type of sci fi show may not sell nowdays. Broadcast TV is a good home for such a show but it is unlkely they would be interested in another sci fi show. Cable Channels like syfy and TNT might pick it up but then again they don't seem to be interested in space based sci fi shows. Go luck on promoting your traditional sci fi show. i will stick to my proposal for a darker themed star trek show.

You're not being remotely realistic at this point. And the only "proposal" you've got is for your own fanfic that with 100% certainty I wouldn't want to read.

 

[EmoBorg]

I've actually told you more than once. A series that can explore multiple themes--including dark ones--without it being such a depressing and bleak series overall. It doesn't have to light all the time, but it definitely shouldn't be dark all the time either. There should be drama, high action, adventure, intrigue, tragedy, and humor in the mix of things (not necessarily all of the above in every episode, but the series should be well-balanced throughout its run). It should be a world we'd want to be in, rather than one we'd want to avoid.

i am sorry but that type of sci fi show may not sell nowdays. Broadcast TV is a good home for such a show but it is unlkely they would be interested in another sci fi show. Cable Channels like syfy and TNT might pick it up but then again they don't seem to be interested in space based sci fi shows. Go luck on promoting your traditional sci fi show. i will stick to my proposal for a darker themed star trek show.

You're not being remotely realistic at this point. And the only "proposal" you've got is for your own fanfic that with 100% certainty I wouldn't want to read.

i do believe most TV viewers will have a better sense and better taste than you.

 

[C.E. Evans]

i am sorry but that type of sci fi show may not sell nowdays. Broadcast TV is a good home for such a show but it is unlkely they would be interested in another sci fi show. Cable Channels like syfy and TNT might pick it up but then again they don't seem to be interested in space based sci fi shows. Go luck on promoting your traditional sci fi show. i will stick to my proposal for a darker themed star trek show.

You're not being remotely realistic at this point. And the only "proposal" you've got is for your own fanfic that with 100% certainty I wouldn't want to read.

i do believe most TV viewers will have a better sense and better taste than you.

Sorry, but no. I can't take anything you say seriously.

 

[Admiral2]

Who's to say the Force doesn't exist in Star Trek, too, only nobody's figured out how to harness it? And the Federation could teach the Republic a few lessons in how to create a working, viable political system that isn't fatally dependent on an inherently undemocratic cadre of warrior monks.

If the Federation starts giving the Republic lessons on how to govern I'm joining the Empire.

I like the version of the original Battlestar: Galactica where the Galactica reaches Earth in the 19th century, they defeat the Cylons once and for all, Commander Adama settles down in Nevada and begins building a new empire......

We've got a right to pick a little fight!
GALAC-TICA!
We've got a right to pick a little fight!
Cylons wait and see!

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Cable Channels like syfy and TNT might pick it up but then again they don't seem to be interested in space based sci fi shows.

Unless you're talking about The Clone Wars on Cartoon Network, TNT and SyFy are our only hope, Obi-Wan Kenobi.

TNT has Falling Skies which is Earth based but has spaceships and real alien-looking aliens. And that leaves open the possibility that some of the story could one day take place in space. And it's a solid ratings hit, which is the most important thing of all.

SyFy at least took a look at Blood & Chrome before passing on it, and it has a pilot in the works called Defiance which like Falling Skies, is Earth based (in the future) but has alien characters.

There are plenty of sci fi pilots in the works for broadcast and cable, but what I've described is the closest to being actual space opera of anything I've yet heard about, that has a realistic chance of ever getting made (lots of pie-in-the-sky rumors get bounced around about Seth McFarlane doing a new Star Trek series or whatever - no point chasing every story like that.)

If the Federation starts giving the Republic lessons on how to govern I'm joining the Empire.

The Federation governs best because we have no canonical idea how they govern at all. Star Trek isn't about the Federation; it's about everything that happens on the frontiers of the Federation and beyond. Very clever of them to leave the Federation as a black box of utopian ideals like that, as opposed to the Republic, which is sausage-making at its nastiest.

 

[Admiral2]

If the Federation starts giving the Republic lessons on how to govern I'm joining the Empire.

The Federation governs best because we have no canonical idea how they govern at all. Star Trek isn't about the Federation; it's about everything that happens on the frontiers of the Federation and beyond. Very clever of them to leave the Federation as a black box of utopian ideals like that, as opposed to the Republic, which is sausage-making at its nastiest.

Are you high? There's plenty of canonical evidence of how the Federation works, and all of it points to it grunting out some of the same sausage that the Republic does. Both have an Executive (President, Chancellor). Both have a legislature (Council, Senate). Both have a peacekeeping force (Starfleet, Jedi Order). Both are weak central authorities keeping order among contentious member worlds. (The Prime Directive keeps Federation worlds strong, while the weakness of the Republic is evidenced by the fact that worlds can go to war with each other without so much as a by-your-leave.) the most significant difference between the two is that the Republic wasn't stupid enough to outlaw money, requiring it to become a Nanny state. (Scoff all you want, but that's the only way the Federation could feed all its citizens in a multiplanetary union that doesn't have a market econonmy.)

 

[LtChange]

Cable Channels like syfy and TNT might pick it up but then again they don't seem to be interested in space based sci fi shows.

Unless you're talking about The Clone Wars on Cartoon Network, TNT and SyFy are our only hope, Obi-Wan Kenobi.

TNT has Falling Skies which is Earth based but has spaceships and real alien-looking aliens. And that leaves open the possibility that some of the story could one day take place in space. And it's a solid ratings hit, which is the most important thing of all.

SyFy at least took a look at Blood & Chrome before passing on it, and it has a pilot in the works called Defiance which like Falling Skies, is Earth based (in the future) but has alien characters.

There are plenty of sci fi pilots in the works for broadcast and cable, but what I've described is the closest to being actual space opera of anything I've yet heard about, that has a realistic chance of ever getting made (lots of pie-in-the-sky rumors get bounced around about Seth McFarlane doing a new Star Trek series or whatever - no point chasing every story like that.)

If the Federation starts giving the Republic lessons on how to govern I'm joining the Empire.

The Federation governs best because we have no canonical idea how they govern at all. Star Trek isn't about the Federation; it's about everything that happens on the frontiers of the Federation and beyond. Very clever of them to leave the Federation as a black box of utopian ideals like that, as opposed to the Republic, which is sausage-making at its nastiest.

My hope for space opera on tv is this news from last november:

Syfy has made a lot of project announcements over the years, and most of them never make it to the screen. But there is some hope that the latest untitled project from writer and producer Robert Hewitt Wolfe will take Syfy right back to space.

Universal Cable Productions said it's working with Wolfe on a show set in a postwar era on the Starship Defender looking for lost worlds requiring law and order. The ship is helmed by humans and trans-humans, who don't get along very well, as part of the newly formed Unity Democracy.

Even though no news has ever come about this since than, it's still better than bad news...

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Are you high?

Sadly, not at the moment.

The inner workings of the Federation have been sketched out but they've never spent much time giving us any in-depth look at how well or badly the system functions. For instance, to what extent is corruption a problem? How about civil rights - to what extent is what we saw in DS9's Homefront/Paradise Lost indicative of larger problems? The jury is way out on both issues.

Since the Federation seems to have no huge problems the way the Republic does (civil war and degenerating into empire and whatnot), from the outside it looks like the Federation is a functioning system and the Republic is a disaster area. This may be unfair to the Republic because I'm watching The Clone Wars which provides a far greater in-depth look into the political system, aka sausage making at its finest, than Star Trek has ever bothered with.

the most significant difference between the two is that the Republic wasn't stupid enough to outlaw money, requiring it to become a Nanny state.

That's far from being the only significant difference, and presumably it only happened as of the 24th C, after the invention of the replicator, which changed the economy utterly. Money wasn't "outlawed," it just became irrelevant when everyone can get anything they want from a magic box.

Here's a far more relevant difference: the prequel movies and especially The Clone Wars depicts the Republic as a squabbling, barely-hanging-together association of planets, maneuvering and trying to stab each other in the back, while the Federation has never been depicted as having internal disputes bad enough to fracture it entirely.

From the prequels, I got the impression that the Republic might just be the largely innocent victim of a machiavellian Sith conspiracy. The Clone Wars provides much more damning detail, for instance, that the Separatists actually have some legitimate grievances with the Republic and aren't all just greedy capitalists and Sith dupes.

Also, the Republic countenances slavery (Clone troopers) which the Federation has never done. Imagine if the Federation decided that the Dominion was onto something, and they should start manufacturing their own Jem'hadar slave army. Then the Federation would be as bad as the Republic.

The Federation also relies for its defense on a meritocratic quasi-military organization, namely Starfleet, which anyone can join as long as they have sufficient motivation and drive. The Republic depends (stupidly) on a cabal of warrior monks who draw their membership from a creepy master race theory based on midichlorians. Furthermore, these warrior monks don't seem to be very good at their job, since they are incapable of seeing the huge threat in their midst. The Republic would be far better off if all Force-sensitive beings keeled over dead one day.

(Remember, I'm not talking about books - only TV and movies - in both cases. I don't have time to peruse every frakking Star Wars and Star Trek book in existence.)

 

[Temis the Vorta]

My hope for space opera on tv is this news from last november:

Syfy has made a lot of project announcements over the years, and most of them never make it to the screen. But there is some hope that the latest untitled project from writer and producer Robert Hewitt Wolfe will take Syfy right back to space.

Universal Cable Productions said it's working with Wolfe on a show set in a postwar era on the Starship Defender looking for lost worlds requiring law and order. The ship is helmed by humans and trans-humans, who don't get along very well, as part of the newly formed Unity Democracy.

Even though no news has ever come about this since than, it's still better than bad news...

Well, yeah, I'd like to see it too, but in this case I think no news is bad news.