^ - or if she'd used a Constitution class starship. 
"Speed of plot" is exactly right.
"Speed of plot" is exactly right.
70 years to the Alpha Quadrant?
- Thread starter Pawleygirl
- Start date
Hmh? The radio feed (whether live or not, we don't know) was from the Typhon Sector battle, supposedly mere 3½ hours away.
After that, there was a cut in action that may have been two minutes long, or then two weeks. No real way of telling. Only after the cut did Earth get involved.
Timo Saloniemi
One of the more "technical" star trek websites I saw theorized that space was "thicker" in some places than others and as such there were "highways" that allowed faster travel, that didn't exist in the Delta Quadrant.
He uses the Chase as an episode where the Enterprise covered half the quadrant in a space of a few days as justification for that. I dunno.
He uses the Chase as an episode where the Enterprise covered half the quadrant in a space of a few days as justification for that. I dunno.
Yeah, a few dominion ships shooting Voyager to pieces on grounds of a federation ship entering their homeland after war was declared would indeed have cut the journey home short.
While war had not yet officially been declared, there's been several skirmishes between the Dominion and Starfleet (and the Klingons) starting in 2370, over a year before Voyager launched on her fated flight into the Badlands.
Aunt Kathy had the choice between heading for a wormhole of questionable stability (remember, it was the first of its kind that didn't vanish soon after appearing and there was no indication how long it would exist for) in the middle of enemy territory, or go the long way through mostly uncharted space where the chance of meeting friend was as big as the chance of meeting foe.
At conventions, Berman takes his shoe off and repeatedly slams it on the podium like a gavel so that his voice can break through the din of overlapping fangasms... "Equidistant! They're equidistant! EQI-DISTANT!!!"
Besides.
Berman fucked up the map for the first few years, according to a map they showed on screen the alpha and beta quadrants were inverted... IE the Okuda's had a sick day, and the rats did play... This was fixed years later but they had trekked 40 thousand light years before anyone ever even mentioned the border to the Beta Quadrant (Renaissance Man) but gammy Janeway turned up to save the day before any writer could make such headway with the impending nature of if the delta flyer blew up again, they'd have to call it's replacement the Beta Flyer.
Besides.
Berman fucked up the map for the first few years, according to a map they showed on screen the alpha and beta quadrants were inverted... IE the Okuda's had a sick day, and the rats did play... This was fixed years later but they had trekked 40 thousand light years before anyone ever even mentioned the border to the Beta Quadrant (Renaissance Man) but gammy Janeway turned up to save the day before any writer could make such headway with the impending nature of if the delta flyer blew up again, they'd have to call it's replacement the Beta Flyer.
The map I've seen, shows a Direct path from The Caretaker to the Gamma Quadrant entrance of the Wormhole, may be a tiny bit shorter, maybe a couple years. However, that would entail crossing the spiral arms, through areas sparsely populated with Stars, which would mean fewer opportunities for resupply, etc. Plus, who knows what may happen to that wormhole in the 68 years it took to get there (if you were indeed able to save 2 years). If the wormhole wasn't available when they got there, they'd be twice as far away from home as when they started.Actually, it is said that the Enterprise was 7000 ly from where it was previously, not the edge of Fed space. The edge of Fed space could be closer than the original position.In Q Who it was stated the Enterprise had been sent 7,000 light years away from the edge of Federation Space. They also said it would take them two years and seven months to get back.
So... Voyager was much slower than the old Enterprise? It should have only taken 30 years.
As for Janeway, she would have had a much shorter trip if she'd headed for the Bojaran wormhole.
Not twice as far away, merely the same distance they started with - but they would have doubled the length of their overall trip. No point in doing that.
A map with inverted Alpha and Beta Quadrants? Where? Intriguing...
Apparently they never did reach the border of Beta; the onscreen maps and the distance references nicely allow for that.
Timo Saloniemi
A map with inverted Alpha and Beta Quadrants? Where? Intriguing...
Apparently they never did reach the border of Beta; the onscreen maps and the distance references nicely allow for that.
Timo Saloniemi
Nah, they'd be almost twice as far away as when they started. The Gamma Quadrant Wormhole entrance is near the top of the Gamma Quadrant, so they'd have to traverse almost 100% of Gamma, and then almost all of Alpha to get to Federation Space (Or going the other way, they'd have to go through all of Delta and most of Beta, plus backtrack the trip through Gamma).
How would the back corner of Gamma be any farther away from home than the back corner of Delta? The distance from both locations to Earth is identical; sailing for the Gamma end of the wormhole would not take our heroes farther away from home, even though it would be wasted sailing. It would just take them to the same distance they started from, after which it would be their choice whether to sail directly for home, or first sail back to Delta to avoid encounters with the Jem'Hadar.
Timo Saloniemi
Timo Saloniemi
Because a straight shot from the Gamma side of the Wormhole, would take you through Galactic center, so, you have the extra distance going around Galactic Center, you don't have that issue with Kazon Territory, because you're already on the outer edge
How big is the Great Barrier around the galactic core?
You don't have to imagine a 10 thousand light years out from the centre of the universe impenetrable fence, that everyone has to go the long way around, because it's there.
You don't have to imagine a 10 thousand light years out from the centre of the universe impenetrable fence, that everyone has to go the long way around, because it's there.
Doesn't work that way. Earth sits basically on the border between Alpha and Beta (Trek fact) halfway between core and rim (real word fact) so a clear line of sight past the core would mean going about 20 degrees off the axis connecting Earth to the Core. Or, in other words, 20 degrees off the galaxy-dividing line that is the Alpha/Beta border as well as the Delta/Gamma border.
Both the starting point next to the Ocampa planet and the far end of the Gamma wormhole meet the specs. At least according to the onscreen map. Indeed, the Gamma wormhole end meets the specs better!
Or then there's this teensy weensy energy cloud fairly close to Earth, right between the human homeworld and the galactic core, and no one has bothered to take the long route around it before the late 2280s. After that date, of course, everybody starts taking the scenic shortcut right through the color show, as they learn there's nothing impenetrable about the Barrier after all.
Timo Saloniemi
We already now that VOY despite being more advanced than the Ent-D is in fact slower, after all in "Where No One Has Gone Before" it'll take the Enterprise over 300 hundred years to traverse the 2.7 million ly. So the maximum number of years would be 399 otherwise it would be over 400 years.
But then again it's always plot speed.
They picked the figure 70 year figure for a number of reasons
1.>To make the journey sound long impling that they wouldn't expect to see home in their lifetime.
2.>To make it easy for the audiance to follow, because obvioulsy the audiance could follow the fact that one season might span a few years.
But then again it's always plot speed.
They picked the figure 70 year figure for a number of reasons
1.>To make the journey sound long impling that they wouldn't expect to see home in their lifetime.
2.>To make it easy for the audiance to follow, because obvioulsy the audiance could follow the fact that one season might span a few years.
Also, 1,000 ly per year is a nice round figure that works just fine for most purposes.
And it's the same thing as 300 ly per month, or 100 ly per week, or 50 ly per day, or 20 ly per hour. One just needs more pit stops and cooldown periods during longer runs...
Timo Saloniemi
And it's the same thing as 300 ly per month, or 100 ly per week, or 50 ly per day, or 20 ly per hour. One just needs more pit stops and cooldown periods during longer runs...
Timo Saloniemi
^What didn't help VOY was having a line about "Sustainable crusie velocity of Warp 9.975" in the pilot.
Sustainable tends to mean or can mean that it can be maintained for long periods without causing damage. If they had simple not included the word sustainable it would still have worked at saying it's a fast ship
Sustainable tends to mean or can mean that it can be maintained for long periods without causing damage. If they had simple not included the word sustainable it would still have worked at saying it's a fast ship
But they don't say how long it can sustain those speeds for, even if we are to assume that it's some factory specification standard. Given that time we saw Picards enterprise racing those Romulans, I doubt it could be longer than 10 hours.
You go any longer than 10 hours at warp 9.975 and the Federation would be a dim memory in the rear view mirror.
You go any longer than 10 hours at warp 9.975 and the Federation would be a dim memory in the rear view mirror.
Yes but in TNG when the Enterprise was doing those high warp speeds, ot was made clear that they could only do it for short duratins.
As you say they don't say how long they could sustain those speeds, but by using the word sustainable it would tend to indicate long periods of time.
As I said they could have removed the word sustainable without having a dentremental effect on the overall context.
As you say they don't say how long they could sustain those speeds, but by using the word sustainable it would tend to indicate long periods of time.
As I said they could have removed the word sustainable without having a dentremental effect on the overall context.
I always looked at Warp 9.975 as being the top speed the Voyager could hold the longest. The ship probably could go even faster--maybe even to Warp 9.99--but at extreme risk, IMO.
That's what I said.
Does long mean hours or months.
I'm thinking of Tin Man were a Romulan ship blows up because they push their engines past specification trying to beat Enterprise to their prize... Although the script doesn't completely connect with my memories. I may be splicing it with the one where Kirk keeps going faster no matter how much Scottie kept saying "Gid lahrd MIn! ye guhnna Kull Is Arrrl!"
The funny thing is, while the speed of warp 9.975 is referred to as a cruising speed of some sort thrice in the show, the word "sustainable" is only used once, by Stadi in "Caretaker" - and Alicia Coppola fumbles the delivery, actually stuttering "S-stable cruise velocity".
So there's nothing canonically sustainable about warp 9.975...
Timo Saloniemi
So there's nothing canonically sustainable about warp 9.975...
Timo Saloniemi
