2014 MLB Season: How Many Pitchers Will Die For Our Sins?

[Scout101]

Care to back that up with anything? EVERYTHING I've seen said exactly what I wrote, splitter = bad for elbow.

For example (ESPN Insider article, but here's the start/important part):

http://insider.espn.go.com/blog/bus...yanks-searching-for-replacements?refresh=true

Somebody wearing a uniform undoubtedly uttered the words "I told you so" on Wednesday night after news of Tanaka's elbow issue spread across the majors, and it's very possible that this was a four-word refrain in a lot of clubhouses. That four-word refrain would only be repeated on Thursday night when the league learned that Tanaka had a partial UCL tear in his elbow, an injury that often leads to Tommy John surgery. That's because over the first two months of this season, even as Tanaka dominated hitters and earned the respect of opponents, there was a feeling among many players on other teams that it was only a matter of time before he broke down.

That opinion was not based on his daunting accumulation of pitches in Japan, where he threw 160 pitches in a start last fall before pitching in relief the next day. Rather, opposing hitters and pitchers and coaches and managers watched him throw splitter after splitter after splitter at high velocity, and they reached the conclusion that he was destined for surgery.

For now, the Yankees are saying that Tanaka has a chance to rehab the injury. But if surgery is needed, there will be a lot of nods around the game, because the perception of the splitter is that it's an elbow-killer, and Tanaka relied so heavily on the pitch in his first days in the big leagues. In fact, according to Fangraphs, 25 percent of the pitches thrown by Tanaka this season have been splitters, easily the highest in the majors.

Percentage of splitters thrown

1. Tanaka 25.0 percent
2. Hiroki Kuroda 22.9
3. Dan Haren 16.0
4. Tim Hudson 14.2
5. Ubaldo Jimenez 13.7

Among the pitchers who employ the splitter as a major weapon, Tanaka also has thrown it at the highest velocity, 86 mph.

The day after Tanaka beat the Red Sox on April 22, David Ortiz mentioned around the batting cage that he had never seen a pitcher throw that many splitters; Jonny Gomes, standing nearby, nodded. And every time teams saw Tanaka, this became part of what they took away. He's incredibly talented, many opponents would say privately, and competitive, and has a great feel for the baseball. And wow, he throws a lot of splitters.

 

[Tom Hendricks]

I have two sons, who I hope really get into baseball. I also hope that maybe they would be pitchers. I would not allow my sons to thrown anything other then Fastballs and Change ups their entire little league career. The only off speed pitch I would allow them to throw would be a curve ball when they enter high school and that would be a circle curve. I think kids need to throw more but nothing off speed. However the lure of an easy out or embarrassing the hitter with an off speed or splitter type pitch is strong.

 

[Yanks]

Care to back that up with anything? EVERYTHING I've seen said exactly what I wrote, splitter = bad for elbow.

Here you go. It's my opinion that a slider is the worst pitch for your arm. I won't teach it to my pitchers.

http://www.onbaseball.com/pitching/the-slider/

Another major issue with throwing too many sliders is the toll it takes on the arm, particularly on the elbow. Ever wonder how it is that these days, so many college and professional pitchers need Tommy John surgery? You would think that with the advances in medicine, training, and overall knowledge of pitching mechanics, that people wouldn’t be hurting their arms. However, it seems that every pitcher above Little League is throwing sliders 30-50% of the time, and this pitch puts a tremendous strain on the tiny, fragile tendons in and around the elbow. Even if you throw the pitch with perfect mechanics, you will probably at least strain the tendons a bit. If you throw the pitch with imperfect form, you’ll put even more of a strain on the tendons and the ligaments, and eventually tear something.

 

[Starbreaker]

Dan Uggla has been suspended for one game and Phil Gosselin is getting his debut today. I'm ready to be rid of this guy.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Jean Segura's infant son has died.

 

[Danny99]

How hard is it for a catcher to learn to catch a knuckle ball? I ask this because I have continually watched Josh Thole be a offensive and defensive liability for this Blue Jays team and he is kept around because he can "catch Dickey's knuckleball."

In this afternoon's game alone, he stuck out swinging at a pitch that was at his nose in his first at bat and in the sixth, his throw to try and catch Yunel Escobar stealing was way off to the shortstop's side, making it impossible for the second baseman to even have a chance at applying the tag.

How difficult would be it for Dioner Navarro or another catcher to learn to catch the knuckler so we can be rid of Thole?

But this is the team that sits Colby Rasmus on the bench for Darin Mastroianni and his anemic hitting.

 

[Yanks]

How hard is it for a catcher to learn to catch a knuckle ball? I ask this because I have continually watched Josh Thole be a offensive and defensive liability for this Blue Jays team and he is kept around because he can "catch Dickey's knuckleball."

In this afternoon's game alone, he stuck out swinging at a pitch that was at his nose in his first at bat and in the sixth, his throw to try and catch Yunel Escobar stealing was way off to the shortstop's side, making it impossible for the second baseman to even have a chance at applying the tag.

How difficult would be it for Dioner Navarro or another catcher to learn to catch the knuckler so we can be rid of Thole?

But this is the team that sits Colby Rasmus on the bench for Darin Mastroianni and his anemic hitting.

There has to be a certain level of difficulty/skill to it. Dickey isn't the first major league knuckler that had his own catcher.

 

[Scout101]

Yeah, it kept Mirabelli employed for a few years. The couple times 'Tek tried to catch Wakefield, it was a disaster to be kind. Anyone could probably learn, it just seems to take some work, and forgetting what you know about regular catching...

Random other news: Soriano released from the Yankees today. Had honestly forgotten he was there, not a good sign. Will see if he gets picked up or calls it a career.

 

[Timby]

Care to back that up with anything? EVERYTHING I've seen said exactly what I wrote, splitter = bad for elbow.

Here you go. It's my opinion that a slider is the worst pitch for your arm. I won't teach it to my pitchers.

http://www.onbaseball.com/pitching/the-slider/

Another major issue with throwing too many sliders is the toll it takes on the arm, particularly on the elbow. Ever wonder how it is that these days, so many college and professional pitchers need Tommy John surgery? You would think that with the advances in medicine, training, and overall knowledge of pitching mechanics, that people wouldn’t be hurting their arms. However, it seems that every pitcher above Little League is throwing sliders 30-50% of the time, and this pitch puts a tremendous strain on the tiny, fragile tendons in and around the elbow. Even if you throw the pitch with perfect mechanics, you will probably at least strain the tendons a bit. If you throw the pitch with imperfect form, you’ll put even more of a strain on the tendons and the ligaments, and eventually tear something.

No one is disputing that the slider is a very rough pitch. Pitching, in and of itself, is a highly unnatural motion, to be fair. But as I said on the previous page, there's a reason the splitter fell out of vogue over the past ten or fifteen years -- it's now believed to be as much of an elbow-killer as a slider or a slurve because the goofy-ass grip winds up having a negative cumulative impact upon arm strength. When it's the primary pitch in a guy's repertoire, as in Tanaka's case, that's easily the first thing to look at as a reason (in addition to his heavy usage by Rakuten).

 

[Scout101]

Guess he had his bases covered; between splitter and slider, it was 50% of his total pitches. Fastball only came in at low 40%, then a smattering of other stuff (couple curves, changeups, etc)

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

I'd always thought the slider was worse for the elbow ligaments because of the unnatural motion, twisting the arm inward.

 

[Use of Time]

I'd always thought the slider was worse for the elbow ligaments because of the unnatural motion, twisting the arm inward.

I will contend that it is but pitchers don't throw it 70 - 80% of the time like they would a fastball. The Splitter is a high volume pitch though used heavily throughout the game as the primary pitch.

 

[Jedi_Master]

What did you all think of the new format for the HR Derby?

 

[Use of Time]

What did you all think of the new format for the HR Derby?

I don't know. I've always thought the derby was kind of a snoozefest. It just takes way too damn long. I'll admit there are certain players I want to see in certain ballparks to see how far they can hit one but that is as far as my interest takes me on the derby.

 

[Jedi_Master]

What did you all think of the new format for the HR Derby?

I don't know. I've always thought the derby was kind of a snoozefest. It just takes way too damn long. I'll admit there are certain players I want to see in certain ballparks to see how far they can hit one but that is as far as my interest takes me on the derby.

The derby was not any shorter this year, especially with the rain delay. I think that they should have the top two from each league advance, and do away with the "swing off".

 

[Starbreaker]

I'm over the derby. It was cooler when I was a kid. I still find the actual all-star game very entertaining, though.

 

[Timby]

I generally think the Derby can be a touch too long, but when you have Stanton knocking moonshots like he did last night, I turn into a five-year-old all over again.

 

[Jedi_Master]

I generally think the Derby can be a touch too long, but when you have Stanton knocking moonshots like he did last night, I turn into a five-year-old all over again.

What a beast that guy is...

 

[Use of Time]

I enjoyed the Kansas City one because there were unobstructed sections past the outfield fence (no upperdeck overhang) where the ball was permitted to carry without hitting anything. I remember Prince Fielder and others hitting some incredible shots.

 

[Timby]

According to Timothy Burke, Derek Jeter's name was said exactly 100 times during last night's All-Star Game.

In those four hours, the deaths of Tony Gwynn and Don Zimmer were not mentioned once.