2012 Super 15 Thread

[NCC1701]

Miracles do happen, with both the Highlanders and the Chiefs winning against the Bulls, which is enough to send the Chiefs back to the top of the table until the Stormers inflict humiliation onto the Sharks at their home ground on Sunday morning NZT. Meanwhile, the Crusaders utterly humilated the Blues 59-12, which has seen Pat Lam remove 13 of last weekend's starting players, this week they're trying to avoid losing against the Highlanders, somehow I don't see them being that lucky to lose by just 3 points this time, even at Eden Park. And just to go against the grain of what I've been hearing over the last week, there is no fucking way the Rebels are going to win against the Hurricanes in Wellington, I see the Canes leading by four tries to one at halftime. Purely for table point reasons I hope the Brumbies win against the Reds, especially now that Cooper is re-instated at Fly Half, being at Canberra that shouldn't be too hard for them. Also, we have another wooden spoon clash, between the Western Force and Lions, I see the Lions taking it out to land the Blues the number 15 spot again. And I don't think the Waratahs have a shit show of beating the Cheetahs in Bloemfontein, we will see if they are the Australian team that has legs on an SA tour, stranger things have happened!

 

[Jono]

Reds won 13 - 12 in a pretty dour game. Holmes had a chance to win it for the Brumbies on the siren with a 40m penalty attempt and missed. To be fair if the Brumbies won they would have been the less deserving given the Reds outplayed them in most aspects. For some reason the Brumbies have put in their worst performances this season against the Reds. Apart from coincidence I'm guessing its to do with the aura the Reds gained from been the champions last year.

Both teams have pretty similar runs for the finals as they both have to play the Rebels and Tahs. They both have a NZ team in the Highlanders for the Reds and Blues for the Brumbies. The Reds do have a bye while the Brumbies other game is against the Force. Throw in the fact the Reds have more home games you could suggest they have the "easier" path. It's going to be super tight and the Brumbies fairytale may still somehow materialise.

 

[NCC1701]

^ Yep, not what I wanted to see with that match, might be because I can't stand either Cooper or Genia whereas I have no such beef with the Brumbies. The Sharks managed to win against the Stormers, a rare feat for both of SA's top teams to lose in one weekend this season. The Force actually managed to win a game for a change, the Cheetahs did well to hold out against the Waratahs, the Hurricanes smashed the Rebels as expected, and the Blues continue to suck, which is ironic because I might go see them play against the Chiefs at North Harbour Stadium on Saturday. Talking about which, the Chiefs have a pretty rough road going to the finals after the test break, facing the Crusaders at home and the Highlanders and Hurricanes away. I hope they manage to hang on that lead to get first place this year, they haven't looked this good ever!

 

[Orac Zen]

^
I've always been under the impression the Chiefs have been the least (for lack of a better word) of the NZ sides, so it's been odd to see them going well.

Not so odd to see the Waratahs travelling like lead balloons. I'm glad I'm overseas at the moment and thus missing out on the lowlights on the news; I have been keeping track via the SMH and I see the cretin who's still its head rugby writer is stirring the pot about the coaching situation - as usual (he ought to be writing a gossip column, since he's actually good at that). Injuries and other excuses aside, NSW does seem to have gone backwards this year (an oddly impressive feat, in a way) and Foley was apparently responsible for bringing Elsom - Cooper's only competition for the title of most overrated Australian rugby player - back to the 'Tahs. He should probably be sacked on that basis alone but the musical chairs approach to the NSW coaching situation has to end. Perhaps the people who "run" rugby in the state could follow Foley out the door if they do sack him, given their apparent uselessness.

[/mini-rant]

 

[NCC1701]

^ Yes, the Chiefs are traditionally one of our "underperforming" - read: shit - teams, but they have performed above all expectations this year, very glad to see a change up on this side of the competition at least. The Blues have well and truly taken over the wooden spoon for NZ this year, and I will be surprised if they are spared the embarassment of coming 15th overall at the end of the competition. For shame, for a team that came fourth last year!

Anyway, the Crusaders have made mince meat of the Highlanders tonight, winning 51-18 in Christchurch. I expected it against the Blues, but against the Highlanders? Crusaders look like they are keen to take top spot from the Chiefs, luckily for the Chiefs - and me! - their only head to head clash that remains is in Waikato, being at home should give them what they need to beat the Cantabrians. And as expected, Brumbies beat the Rebels tonight, they need to keep that up if they have any hope of keeping the Reds out of the top three.

 

[Jono]

Brumbies did beat the Rebels, but it wasn't the pasting they gave them earlier this year. The Brumbies are looking a bit tired, which isn't surprising given the lack of experience across the park, so the International break might not be so unwelcome for the bulk of the squad and allow the newer members of the squad to freshen up and hopefully hang on to the top conference spot. That said I noticed they are playing an exhibition match against Wales (or at least 2nd string Wales), so it won't be all time wasting.

It will be interesting to see what team Deans puts up for the mid-week game against Scotland given that Wales is on the weekend. It is an insane bit of scheduling. Not to mention that Channel Inept...I mean Nine is showing the game close to midnight in favour of showing the Queen's jubilee. I have a terrible feeling I'm going to be complaining about Ch.9 until 2015.

 

[Jono]

The Wallabies couldn't even beat a travelling Scotland team, Sigh. Need to let the disappointment go before I can comment properly. There are many excuses that can be made, most of the players played on the weekend, the weather was rubbish, it was a second string side (because the Wallabies play again on Saturday), but still one would expect at home that the Wallabies would win. Given the number of Tahs in the team maybe I shouldn't be surprised.

Edit: Many will compare this to the lose to Samoa, but this is no where near as bad. Scotland, while the came last in the 6N is a completely professional side while the sad thing is that Samoa (like all the PI nations) lack that true professionalism that would see them be more consistant forces in world rugby. The Wallabies only lost by a after the siren penalty whereas Samoa won by a large margin and led comfortably for most of the game. It isn't ideal, but the pitchforks don't need to come out either.

Scotland may have had an unhappy 6N but they played well against the Wallabies. In the first half they used the conditions well and pinned the Wallabies back and only wasted one of their opportunities. In fact they were unluckily not to score a try in the first 15 where they lost the ball in contact just about on the line 2 or 3 times. They also kept the Wallabies tryless in the second half when the Wallabies had the strong wind behind them and kept the ball for long periods in Scotland's territory. They had a fortunate TMO decision go for them that could have easily gone the other way, but their try line defence was very good.

The Wallabies were average. I don't know why the Wallabies didn't want the wind in the first half, but they showed some decent defence when Scotland had them down their end. The scrum had problems, but what's new? The second half was not fantastic. They could only muster 3 points in 40 minutes and they came in the first 2 minutes. They gave away some poor penalties in attack that kept the game open. None of the new faces really stood out, but given the weather the new backs were a bit stifled.

The question is how the Wallabies will go against Wales. The team will be different, but a couple of players will be backing up (one or two also from the Super 15 on the weekend), so the fitness is going to be tested. It will also be a big mental test for the team to turn around what should have been a "sure thing" to face the fresh 6N champs. I keep having to remind myself that after these tests there is still about 2 months of Super rugby before the Tri-nations, so I don't know how much you can take out of these internationals, but I guess the Wales games with a "fuller" strength Wallabies team would be a more accurate indicator.

The game against Scotland is a good example of the beauty of sport. You can have the ranking and rep but all that matters is after the game starts and how you play then and there. While I would prefer the Wallabies to win the fact that "upsets" can happen is half the reason I watch sport. Congratulations to Scotland, they deserved the win.

 

[NCC1701]

^ Yep, needless to say the Wallabies are a laughing stock again on this side of the ditch for a change, well done Scotland! Hoping the All Blacks mount much more of an effort against Ireland on Saturday night, although I have a feeling I won't be disappointed!

 

[Orac Zen]

When aren't we a laughing stock on your side of the ditch?

Needless to say I'm not even a bit surprised about last night's result. Disgusted, certainly, but not even a bit surprised. Geez.

 

[Jono]

Deans has made 8 changes for the team to play against Wales and all I can say is, really more Tahs?

Good to see Tomane getting a second crack. Hopefully there won't be too much rain if any and he'll get to show off his counter-attacking flair. Surprised to see Nic White on the bench. Given Phipps was on the bench against Scotland I was sure he'd be the first backup for Genia.

 

[Orac Zen]

I'd be surprised if anyone could mount a legitimate - ie. devoid of puerile state / provincial / whatever bias - argument against the all-NSW front row; from all accounts the NSW scrum is about the only aspect of their play that's functioned acceptably for most of the season. Otherwise...eh. Barnes hasn't been the same player since the concussion dramas but it's not as though we have many other options at 10 just now. Palu is the choice I really struggle with. When he's on he's a pretty good player but he's on so rarely it's ridiculous. IMO Higgenbotham hasn't grabbed his opportunities but he can't be any more ordinary than Palu is most of the time.

Hopefully we can put up a better effort against what's clearly a better side than Scotland. We'll need to.

It's becoming clearer and clearer that Deans isn't the coach his reputation suggests he is. Looking at some of the players the Crusaders fielded over the years one could suggest almost anyone could probably have coached them to success. How much of that success was down to him and how much to that playing group?

 

[Jono]

I obviously cursed Tomane as he was injured at training and they are saying he'll be out for 6 weeks. Just what the Brumbies needed, another injury in the backs. I wonder whose left? Ha! Just checked the Brumbies site and they still have Hewat in the squad profiles. I guess their tour match against Wales will have extra importance for the fringe backs to make a claim to join the 22.

 

[Jono]

The Wallabies won a tight game against Wales 27 - 19. I thought for a bit that Wales might overrun the rapidly tiring Wallabies, but they did enough to hold on. Of course the Wallabies have had problems backing up against the big teams, so the series is very much alive.

Can't think of any major complaints. They could have held on to the game a bit more, but I guess given the lack of really good counter attacking backs at the moment I guess holding it might not be a much better option. Oh, I thought of something! I couldn't believe Horne blew a certain try in the first half with what can only be a lack of awareness or white line fever. Bad Horne!

 

[Orac Zen]

That was better. With the exception of Horne butchering a try the much-maligned Waratah contingent all had pretty decent games, and Genia had his best game in a gold jumper in ages. He's a freakish player when he's on song (and seems to be immune to media criticism when he isn't, but that's another rant).

It's pretty sad when the English media offer more rational coverage of our national side than the local press do. Too many of our journos are either completely clueless, completely wrapped up in childish parochialism, or both. Makes for tedious reading most of the time.

The All Blacks and Springboks completed victories of their own, I see. No real surprise there.

 

[NCC1701]

Yep, 42-10 for a season opener is pretty good, I expected the All Blacks to be a bit rusty after 7 months of not playing together, but they performed above expectations, especially the newcomers Sovea and Aaron Smith. You really wouldn't have throught that was their first game for the year. Ireland were blown off the park by half time. Looking forward to the next two games in the series, and not to mention the Rugby Championship - is it me or is that the worst name they could have chosen? What was wrong with the Four Nations? - with Argentina winning over Italy at home as well.

 

[Orac Zen]

Agreed - Rugby Championship is about as inane and meaningless a name as they could possibly have chosen. I didn't even realise what it was referring to at first. I suppose they thought "Four Nations" was too similar to the old Five Nations or something equally idiotic, but it would have been a much better choice.

I expect Wales to be a lot better tonight. Whether we'll be correspondingly better is another matter entirely. One can but hope, I suppose.

 

[NCC1701]

Just a quick aside, but this thread should be renamed Southern Hemisphere Rugby Season 2012, judging by the lack of Super 15 for another two weeks, but hey.

The Irish looked much improved this week, they seemed to have learned their lesson, while the All Blacks haven't, having to rely on Dan Carter's third drop-goal attempt at 30 seconds out from full time to seal the win 22-19 with Dagg sent off for not using his hands in the tackle. McCaw was atrocious tonight, the backline didn't get any time with the ball and the forwards were average, especially the scrum, they really seemed to be channelling Australia in the second half. I have to ask, did the coaching staff reuse last year's game plain again tonight?

I see Australia-Wales went much the same way tonight, Harris nailing his kick as well to secure another tight game 25-23. I must give credit to both Ireland and Wales for playing their guts out tonight, time to have a shameful look at ourselves, Southern Hemisphere rugby!

 

[Jono]

Wales were good and looked every bit the Six Nations champs. Wales defended well, as did the Wallabies, for most of the game, which saw the boot become the main contributor. There was also the rarest of all sights: a meaningful Wallabies rolling maul! It was a tough close test, as most of the Wales v Wallabies encounters are.

I think Wales will be ruing that with 2 to go they opted to play territory and kick the ball away rather than hold the ball and wind the clock down. By doing so they took the control of the game out of their hands and handed it to Wallabies.

 

[Orac Zen]

Wales are entitled to be very disappointed by that result - they played particularly well and their defence was excellent (although there was far too much one-out stuff from our blokes, IMO). But as Jono said, in the end they really brought it on themselves. All they had to do was keep the ball in hand, work it upfield, run down the clock, and the game was theirs. But Priestland had a brain explosion and one mistake later, that was that.

Not overly impressive from us but I'll take the (series) win.

No offence intended, NCC, but I'm really disappointed for Ireland. Being absolutely flogged out of Euro 2012 and yet again failing to register a first-ever win over the ABs will be a huge letdown for a country that could use a lift from just about any source.

South Africa completed the business against England, although it seems the Poms gave them a run for their money. So the three NH sides had their opportunities and once again didn't take them. For all the NH media bluster about their teams, it's the same old story.

 

[NCC1701]

^ Haha none taken, TBH the Irish deserved to win or at least draw the way we were playing last night, it just so happened Carter pulled our asses out of the fire at the last second. Haven't seen the SA vs England match highlights yet, but from what I've read England played like shit, and SA rightfully won.

Hopefully Hansen wakes up and replaces Ali Williams for the next test after that penalty right in front of the goal posts, he really seems to be in the All Blacks for the ride, even more so than last year.