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Discovery starship discussion [SPOILERS]

*cough cough* Steamrunner, Saber, Akira and Norway class registries *cough cough cough*
Just because we don't see them doesn't mean they aren't there. Also, "somewhat chronological" can cover a lot of sins.

Also, this is in TOS era, so how TNG era registries work really has no bearing.
Oh, thank God, there's still time. I have to warn RFK before it's too late!

Despite it's setting, DSC definitely takes place in a post-TNG articulation of the universe. Granted, behind the scenes people have mentioned Discovery being a "newer ship" than the Enterprise, but unless they give a hard-and-fast history of the ship, I think the most reasonable interpretation is that Glenn and Discovery were gutted to the rafters TMP-style and rebuilt around the spore drive, and there are other, different Crossfield-class ships (maybe looking more like the ComicCon preview version or the leaked test shots) either flying around or sitting in mothballs.
 
Despite it's setting, DSC definitely takes place in a post-TNG articulation of the universe. Granted, behind the scenes people have mentioned Discovery being a "newer ship" than the Enterprise, but unless they give a hard-and-fast history of the ship, I think the most reasonable interpretation is that Glenn and Discovery were gutted to the rafters TMP-style and rebuilt around the spore drive, and there are other, different Crossfield-class ships (maybe looking more like the ComicCon preview version or the leaked test shots) either flying around or sitting in mothballs.
People who make this show have said it's a newer ship, it looks like a newer ship, it is presented as a new ship in the show. The most reasonable interpretation is that it is a new ship.
 
People who make this show have said it's a newer ship, it looks like a newer ship, it is presented as a new ship in the show. The most reasonable interpretation is that it is a new ship.
She is and she isn't. Her registry says she is old. But, because a career starfleet officer that been in the service for seven and a prison inmate that knew every Federation ships that exist, didn't recognized her.
 
In set design terms, many of the rooms suffer from having a corridor beyond the door...

That is, if you look out towards the door of the Burnham/Tilly cabin, you see portholes on the right wall, but also a corridor passing the door and continuing to the right. Does that corridor continue into one of the spokes so that the cabin (with somethingsomething-07 on the doors) is on the outer rim of the inner ring or the inner rim of the outer ring?

Similarly, if you look out towards the door Lorca's secret arsenal cum water bear pen, a corridor runs past. But the porthole on that room is not opposite the door, but to the side - so the corridor again must run normal to the outer wall, not parallel to it, and must truncate abruptly. Which we obviously and explicitly see is not the case at all.

The more we interpret "portholes" as mere "viewscreens", the better, then.

Timo Saloniemi
 
*cough cough* Steamrunner, Saber, Akira and Norway class registries *cough cough cough*

The idea that these ships would be brand new Borg-fighters is rather seriously undermined by the act that they are no good at fighting the Borg...

When a ship appears on screen for the first time, this is no reason to assume the ship is new unless something to the effect is actually stated. With the Discovery, we got this statement right off the bat. With the Defiant, we learned she wasn't brand new but we did learn the date of her inception. With all other ships, we had to wait for a while; sometimes we got surprised, sometimes not.

Clearl, though, we cannot assume that the first appearance of a ship indicates the birth of a new ship class. The writers and VFX artists must be given the permission to create an old pseudo-reality whenever they so wish - and indeed it would be best to assume everything in Trek is sort of medium old unless otherwise stated, because shiny and ancient warrant mention, ordinary does not.

Timo Saloniemi
 
This episode also features a new Admiral rank insignia. While Anderson had 4 gold laurel leaves on each side of the Starfleet insignia, Cornwell only has 3 gold and 1 black.

Good eye, I didn't notice that.

I would assume that Anderson's four gold leaves designate a full Admiral (cf to TNG's "four boxed pips") whereas Katrina Cornwell is a Vice Admiral (cf TNG's "three boxed pips").
 
I kind of like the "new" holographic technology. Especially when Burnham said "Computer, mirror off" and her mirror-hologram disappeared. I guess this means we just never caught any of the Enterprise crew using their holographic mirrors or viewscreens but invisibly, the tech was there, or has only recently gone out of fashion.

Alternatively, maybe these holographs are only visible through the eyes of the crew (via lenses in their eyes or similar), and TOS just never showed us that ;P
 
In set design terms, many of the rooms suffer from having a corridor beyond the door...

That is, if you look out towards the door of the Burnham/Tilly cabin, you see portholes on the right wall, but also a corridor passing the door and continuing to the right. Does that corridor continue into one of the spokes so that the cabin (with somethingsomething-07 on the doors) is on the outer rim of the inner ring or the inner rim of the outer ring?

Similarly, if you look out towards the door Lorca's secret arsenal cum water bear pen, a corridor runs past. But the porthole on that room is not opposite the door, but to the side - so the corridor again must run normal to the outer wall, not parallel to it, and must truncate abruptly. Which we obviously and explicitly see is not the case at all.
I really don't think they build sets to withstand that sort of scrutiny.
 
- Most detailed replicator sequence ever. So THAT's what all the sparking is like up close.

- Alright! So we see more of the sequence Michael went through yesterday to suit up in a nondescript short sleeve jumpsuit. The whole thing appears in a slot with a fancy door that opens up when done. DOES food get replicated here too, or is it only down in the mess hall? The uniform appears on a layer padding of some sort inside the slot, so I'm guessing this isn't really for food.

- The "Alice in Wonderland" book is on the coffee table. I guess only officers get bookshelves in their ready rooms.

- We see that when Starfleet puts their mind to it, they can create a fully opaque hologram when they want to in this era. :) So how is this not applied to the holocomms?

- The code on the door to Burnham and Tilly's shared quarters reads "S-06//07 DK-C//Q4". YMMV, but to me this means their quarters are in Section 6-7 of the fourth quarter on C Deck. Thoughts?

- As Burnham heads to the lift under the watchful eye of EVERYONE ON THE SHIP, she passes by someone already apparently waiting for a door to open. Multiple lifts to multiple places, perhaps, or a different lift shaft altogether that would not efficiently get to the bridge? When she gets to "her" lift door, it has a helpful number counting down, presumably the number of decks before the lift car arrived. But what happens if she's at a place where the car arrives laterally?

- "Bridge. Direct.". Maybe that answers one of my questions above, but I'm sure curious what would have happened if she didn't say "direct". :) The turbolift doesn't SEEM to change direction, and the graphics don't seem to support anything but a straight line voyage..

- So biologically, what ARE Saru's threat ganglia meant to do? I get that it's a really obvious version of the hairs on the back of your neck sticking up, but what is the practical point of people around you knowing that you're sensing the coming of death (TM)? Is it a sensory organ of some sort?

- I wonder if the combat drill Burnham and Saru find in progress on the bridge was announced or scheduled. For one, Saru didn't seem to know about it (or didn't want to tell Burnham about it, if he were scheduled not to be there). We don't see him particularly surprised at what was going on, but if he knew about it, would he be on his way to potentially interrupt it if he were going at all?

- I spent some time looking up what the bridge stations are from the display texts. On the port side we have tactical up front, in much the same space as on the Shenzhou. Aft of that is Engineering. On the starboard aft is communications, but VERY interestingly, the final station is labeled "DRIVE", and the various graphics list off "SPORE DRIVE", etc. This is where Commander Airiam sits and her dialogue mostly consists of relaying stuff that is happening down in Engineering. So it looks like the spore drive has its own dedicated station - neat! And I presume this is where Stamets will be placed should he ever need to do stuff on the bridge.

- As for the rest of the bridge, Saru's place is his familiar perch behind the Captain's right shoulder, but he was using it as an additional science station on the Shenzhou. Perhaps they're both generic command stations there and here, but here I'm guessing it would be more dedicated to science stuff given there isn't a big station on the bridge labeled as such.

- And along the back, that "computer alcove" seems to be manned by two people at most times, who seem to always be visually inspecting whatever is going on back there. Before Discovery's first jump, they're even shown to hold still and apparently use hand holds in anticipation of turbulence!

- So for a ship with 300 science missions going simultaneously (a Starfleet record), there's enough extra space such that Lorca can close down (most of?) an entire deck for his private lab.

- How long has Lorca been in command of Discovery? The battle drills suggest that his efforts at training the crew of "wide-eyed explorers" for battle is a recent thing, as he doesn't seem to be the kind of guy to be lax in that department simply because it's peacetime. By the same token, if Starfleet does consider Discovery to be the tip of the spear in the war against the Klingons, shouldn't they send more than a battle-hardened Captain (and maybe tactical officer) over there to make it so? There's (most of?) a whole deck down there that can house more soldier-type officers.

To be continued...

Mark
 
Just finished something tonight that I'm going to include in another project. It's a rough first draft of an analysis of the battle of the binary stars, complied as a pdf (the host will delete it after 30 days). No formatting or spell-checking done, but feel free to comment if there's anything that I missed. https://ufile.io/9hoi6

By the way, trek tech now has 1701 threads. :)
 
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:rofl: :guffaw:

Let’s see...
good-good-let-the-butthurt-flow-through-you.jpg


Might be the class is built to do science, and to accommodate crazy experiments - and that one accommodating feature is a swappable saucer, in this model swapped for a Spore Drive Bleedoff Ring Thing.
That's more likely than anything just an external modification to the saucer itself. I got the impression that Discovery -- and the Crossfields in general -- are multirole, highly advanced scientific platforms more than anything else. It is mentioned and heavily implied, after all, that the spore drive is brand new and untested technology and is only being tried on the Discovery and Glenn because Strfleet, six months into the war, is desperate for a new tactical weapon that can help turn the tide. Six months isn't enough time to design an entire starship just to house a new and untried propulsion system, but it's more than enough time to retrofit an existing science vessel with an experimental propulsion system (hell, Voyager did this every other week without the aid of a space dock).

Do all Crossfields have the long nacelles?
Probably. Spore drive notwithstanding, there doesn't seem to be anything all that unusual about Discovery's warp drive.


not for a minute - a change in design that substantial like moving saucer sections (to facilitate and totally new propulsion system) defines not just a subclass. that's like uss nautilus being a subclass of (just to have a name) the gato class subs.
It might for space ships, which even in modern times are designed with a certain amount of modularity. From what we've seen, it's possible that the "class" of a starship is defined entirely by the crucial hardware/software configuration of its computers and navigational systems.
 
- "Bridge. Direct.". Maybe that answers one of my questions above, but I'm sure curious what would have happened if she didn't say "direct".

Maybe "direct" is just an instruction not to pick up anyone on the way. Starfleet ships, at one point or another, probably have a certain amount of situational awareness. Heck, my phone can guess based on my habits and calendar what destinations to offer me on GPS when I approach my car. The ship's computer probably uses a kind of thing to figure out turbolift routing so it doesn't give people a car that's going in the opposite direction from where they need to be (since people don't say where they're going until they're on the cab). I could be an in-between stage of convenience, and later ships don't just figure out your probable destination, they also factor in your degree of urgency, so someone summoned by the captain to the bridge immediately doesn't have to remind the lift to make it snappy.

- So biologically, what ARE Saru's threat ganglia meant to do? I get that it's a really obvious version of the hairs on the back of your neck sticking up, but what is the practical point of people around you knowing that you're sensing the coming of death (TM)? Is it a sensory organ of some sort?

Could be a social function. People on the outer edges of the group detect something amiss, and the ganglia spread the signal (visually, or maybe with pheromones or something, as well) so they can all be alerted without a lot of shouting or commotion that would draw more attention from whatever is threatening them.
 
I really don't think they build sets to withstand that sort of scrutiny.

The thing is, it's not really much in the way of "scrutiny". I mean, it's not a spacey-wacey, Star Trekky scifi thing. It's just that for the first time, these people are building sets with windows, and they aren't noticing they are making the windows face the walls.

Is there a dedicated Union of Trek Carpenters whose 80-somethings refuse to budge and can't quite wrap their brains (or adjust their glasses) around the idea of windows?

- Most detailed replicator sequence ever. So THAT's what all the sparking is like up close.

It's not quite molecules lining up, now is it? Perhaps the resolution we see here is indeed apt for "fabricators", as opposed to "replicators", or whatever.

- The "Alice in Wonderland" book is on the coffee table. I guess only officers get bookshelves in their ready rooms.

...Once again, we're left to wonder why cabin tabletops get better inertial dampeners than bridge seats.

- We see that when Starfleet puts their mind to it, they can create a fully opaque hologram when they want to in this era. :) So how is this not applied to the holocomms?

Bandwidth? Sending stuff across interstellar distances must cost more than sending it across one meter.

- The code on the door to Burnham and Tilly's shared quarters reads "S-06//07 DK-C//Q4". YMMV, but to me this means their quarters are in Section 6-7 of the fourth quarter on C Deck. Thoughts?

Or then they are in the fourth Quarters of Section 6-7 on Deck C, as opposed to, say, the third Broom Closet.

- As Burnham heads to the lift under the watchful eye of EVERYONE ON THE SHIP, she passes by someone already apparently waiting for a door to open. Multiple lifts to multiple places, perhaps, or a different lift shaft altogether that would not efficiently get to the bridge?

She does say "Bridge. Direct." which leaves one to wonder about the alternatives. Methinks she's testing whether she can "still" use a Command Override so that somebody else's destination gets delayed in favor of hers - although it's a poor time to test that as she must realize Saru shares her destination.

When she gets to "her" lift door, it has a helpful number counting down, presumably the number of decks before the lift car arrived. But what happens if she's at a place where the car arrives laterally?

The countdown could be in seconds rather than decks, just as in traffic lights.

- I wonder if the combat drill Burnham and Saru find in progress on the bridge was announced or scheduled. For one, Saru didn't seem to know about it (or didn't want to tell Burnham about it, if he were scheduled not to be there). We don't see him particularly surprised at what was going on, but if he knew about it, would he be on his way to potentially interrupt it if he were going at all?

For all we know, he was coming from the Bridge, to intercept Burnham...

Lorca's antics do seem to indicate this is the first time through. But since basically nobody looks like they'd think they are going to die, this may be a "surprise but announced" thing.

This is where Commander Airiam sits and her dialogue mostly consists of relaying stuff that is happening down in Engineering. So it looks like the spore drive has its own dedicated station - neat! And I presume this is where Stamets will be placed should he ever need to do stuff on the bridge.

Yup - didn't some offshow source or another already report that Airiam is to be the bridge liaison for Spore Drive? In trading card style?

...here I'm guessing it would be more dedicated to science stuff given there isn't a big station on the bridge labeled as such.

A "science vessel" might be the place to go if you wish not to find a dedicated Science Station or even a Science Officer. It would be a bit like seeking the Combat Station or the Fighting Officer aboard a warship...

- So for a ship with 300 science missions going simultaneously (a Starfleet record), there's enough extra space such that Lorca can close down (most of?) an entire deck for his private lab.

Nothing indicates he didn't shut down 270 of those missions in the process. After all, he only really needs two. 300 is just a potential.

- How long has Lorca been in command of Discovery? The battle drills suggest that his efforts at training the crew of "wide-eyed explorers" for battle is a recent thing, as he doesn't seem to be the kind of guy to be lax in that department simply because it's peacetime. By the same token, if Starfleet does consider Discovery to be the tip of the spear in the war against the Klingons, shouldn't they send more than a battle-hardened Captain (and maybe tactical officer) over there to make it so? There's (most of?) a whole deck down there that can house more soldier-type officers.

I guess it's again a question of how dedicated NCC-1031 is in terms of construction. Did Lorca become the speartip overnight when Stamets' silly project actually panned out (and the equally silly projects of a dozen other onboard scientists were put on back burner)? Unlikely if the spinning things were built to Stamets' specs.

But Lorca could have been assigned here recently to see if there was anything to Stamets' findings. Him and perhaps half a dozen other invalids who could be spared from the actual fighting. Using the testbed ship for combat would be a silver bullet thing, while Starfleet must also be thinking in terms of giving every combat starship its own mushroom engine eventually.

Timo Saloniemi
 
We still lack explicit description of which parts of the ship are related to the Spore Drive. The spinners, apparently (but they might have other uses as well). But what else? What was the point of that plexiglass chamber before they put the water bear in it? What really happens when Stamets puts a cylinder of spores into the hole in his Engineering console? Why is that console at Engineering in the first place, apparently near the conventional warp powerplant thingamabob? Or at least near the doodads familiar from Scotty's workplace, whatever those were?

So... Do the nacelles have extensions clipped on for Spore Drive?

(Perhaps the ship did look very different, oh, six months ago, with a monobloc saucer and shorter nacelles? :devil: )

Timo Saloniemi
 
Continuing on. I realize my observations are later than they used to be. My un-married, no-kids, significantly more overweight me would be laughing at me from his reviews of 199x-2005 and laughing as he pounded his posts out within an hour of first watch. :) Still doing them though. Onwards!

- Voq is found making "art" in a holo chamber of some sort, linking the various starship hullks still floating around the binary star (I suppose said binary doesn't exert THAT much excess force on stuff just outside the belt, or else everyone would be worried about being dragged in as the Shenzhou almost was). Anyway, what'st he purpose of the chamber? Everything is so ornately designed it's tough to figure out specific areas or stations.

- Regardless of rank, everyone in the mess hall last week ate off of gary gray plastic trays and gray or transparent green plates. Captain Lorca gets the fine porcelain dinnerware, naturally emblazoned with his ship's name; however, he still eats his salad with his hands and no silverware apparent. RHIP! Notably, there seems to be a hypospray right next to his plate. Drugs for his eyes, or thousand island dressing?

- Corvan II is home to the Corvan Gilvo species, which resembled branches and sock puppets. Two rare specimens would be transported by the Enterprise-D when they were almost killed by, ironically, someone ELSE figuring out a "new way to fly". Still, they were common enough to be seen as a one-off Ferengi pet a couple years later. Poor gilvos, never catch a break.

- As Admiral Cornwell relays the distress call, her hologram gestures to Lorca's monitor and then watches the message with him. More food for thought as to whether Cornwell actually has a monitor on her side, can see Lorca's from where she is (and not just him eating salad off an invisible plate), or if the computer is being nice enough to pretend she's in fact gesturing to his monitor instead of hers. She probably has an aide just offscreen, or someone to cue the Discovery's monitor to play the message.

- It's already been discussed, but yes, I'd think the source of 40% of the Federation's dilithium would warrant more protection. We don't know how big the "patrol ship" force was (or if it was also separate from the ships Cornwell said were blockading the place), so for all we know we missed an intense battle that wiped out a sizeable Federation AND Klingon force, including any friendly forces nearby, leaving a few pesky BoPs to slowly siege the Corvan population and win a strategic victory.

- So, after wondering what Engineering actually WAS last week, we pretty much confirm that the set IS the primary Engineering, and "test bay alpha" must refer to the place where the bear goes.

- Ah! Just before the spinning starts, Lorca specifically queries Commander Airiam by saying "Drive?". Dedicated "Drive station" on the bridge, confirmed!

- Let's dive into the statement "excess energy cavitation", which is that Commander Airiam initiates - and which is meant to be linked to the spinning saucers. In seagoing vessels, cavitiation is the phenomenon by which bubbles are created from a spinning propeller. Strictly-speaking, those bubbles are actually steam caused by water boiling as a result of low pressure areas created by the spinning propeller (the water boils because pressure is low, not because the propeller heats it up). Applying that to the spore drive, I'd surmise that some sort of subspace manipulation is being accomplished by doodads within the spinning saucers, creating "low pressure" areas within subspace resulting in the either creating the means by which the ship enters spore space (sic) or to facilitate the energy transfer by which the ship makes the jump. Either way, no spinning, no spore drive. Thoughts?

- Sticking with real-world physics though, I'm happy that there ARE two discs spinning in opposite directions, so as to MAYBE minimize the torque effect created by the rotation relative to the main mass of the ship. We don't know how much volume are actually in the spinning sections (my guess is not much, and that they're bascially the skin of the saucers), but at least someone is thinking about spinning masses in zero gravity and the effects produced thereof for non-spinning sections. Looking at YOU, Babylon 5.

- Saru orders Landry to reroute impulse power to phasers, and the latter replies that they's now "double hot", suggesting a significant, or even doubly powered array (and possibly no way to maneuver at significant sublight speeds right away after sporing to the destination..). No word on torpedoes, though? No way to make THEM double-hot? ;)

- Discovery's errant first jump literally "drops" them into a star's corona (the effects suggest they actually arrive by moving into position by a Z-axis drop). Good thing they were oriented top side away from the star, otherwise people would be confused </sarcasm>

- SCIENCE! An O-type star is usually 15-90 times more massive, 30,000-1,000,000 more luminous, and 5-10 times hotter than our sun. It didn't look THAT big here, but maybe it's just really dense. :P In any case, nerds like us find ample justification that Discovery is in trouble by how much more EVERYTHING this star is compared to our own. Heck, they're pretty rare to begin with (about one in five to twenty million stars in the Milky Way is O-type).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O-type_main-sequence_star

- Discovery has had several alert klaxons for different ship and statuses. Here, we at last here one derived from the TOS Enterprise, and not a straight up re-use of one from the TNG era. The black alert sound was new too. Maybe the show runners wanted a unique sound profile for the main ship, and for the Shenzhou and other vessels, they just gave a USB drive filled with sounds they had franchise rights to, and told the effects guys to have fun...

Mark
 
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