Arena fight re-enactment with original Gorn actor

Discussion in 'Star Trek - The Original & Animated Series' started by spockboy, Jun 1, 2016.

  1. spockboy

    spockboy Captain Captain

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    http://www.scvhistory.com/scvhistory/lw2098f.htm

    To me this episode has one of the best first acts in all of Star Trek. However, I am aware of how this episode has taken a lot of heat for the.....er.... fighting aspects. (the Gorn moving so slowly etc) I have thought a great deal about whether or not it would be possible to make it look better somehow. Has anyone else thought about it?

    What could be done?
    Any thoughts?

    :)Spockboy
     
  2. Noname Given

    Noname Given Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    IMO - it was fine. The Gorn moving slowly WAS a plot point of the story (and the fight.) Kirk was small fast and agile. The lizard Gorn was immensely strong and tough; but slow. Unless you want a better CGI character to replace the man in the suit, there's nothing really to 'fix'.
     
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  3. ToddPence

    ToddPence Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    There were actually TWO original Gorn actors - stuntmen Gary Coombs and Bobby Clark.
     
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  4. Marsden

    Marsden Commodore Commodore

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    Marsden is very sad.
    And voice Ted Cassidy.

    And I would not change anything. The fight was awesome.

    One of my favorite scenes of any show/movie ever is when Kirk takes almost all his strength to throw that rock down and smacks the Gorn and then the Gorn picks up the boulder and throws it up at Kirk. The expression on Kirk's face after that is perfect.

    I wasn't too happy they (TOS_R) had to give the Gorn eyelids, but it's not too much of a difference to bother me.

    If I had to fix anything, there are two quibbles I have: Not have Uhura scream like she saw a rat and not make the horror face when the Gorn is shown, (I consider that one thing those two) and the other thing is tone down Spock's "Good good" business, I don't find it very logical to make running comments on something, comments do not aid the effort in any way. If Bones asked first, explanation would be warranted, as it was Bones was getting rankled with the commentary.

    I don't think cg can fix those.
     
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  5. Redfern

    Redfern Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    "MythBusters'" analysis of the bamboo cannon proved enlightening and certainly implied a potentially very different outcome. For those few who have not yet seen the science show segment, the "Build Team" demonstrated two drawbacks to Kirk's strategy. One, it is a major challenge to "mix" gunpowder/black powder by "eye" even under controlled circumstances, let alone "in the wild" as Kirk did. The best Tori and Grant managed was a rather energetic "smoke bomb" formula. But, in theory it's not impossible. Let's assume as a youth lil' Jimmy Kirk was something of a mischievous prodigy and learned to "eyeball" the formula, irritating his cantankerous uncle to no end. (Yeah, I know Kirk's dad supposedly lived long enough in the prime timeline to see Jim graduate. We'll assume these were summer visits rather than a custody scenario.)

    And while it was clever to wrap a length of "fiber" (a naturally growing rope-like vine native to that world?) to help reinforce the bamboo, the "Build Team" discovered it didn't help when they poured professional grade gunpowder into the "chamber". When it ignited, it promptly exploded, "taking out" the crash test dummy the production affectionately nicknamed "Buster" (who filled in for "Kirk" though wearing a red shirt). But, to their surprise, some shards of crystal (quartz substituting for the "diamond") did indeed strike a life-size cutout depicting the Gorn they had made for the experiment. As with the chances of mixing viable gunpowder by eye, we'll make allowances for the episode. Let's say the "bamboo" was a far tougher plant compared to its terrestrial counterpart.

    At the end of the segment Tory noted that Kirk might have been better off giving the cannon to the Gorn. As described, the first thing that came to my mind was a Warner Bros./Tex Avery slapstick scenario. I suddenly imagined cartoon Kirk in a kind of Bugs Bunny role politely handing the lit bamboo cannon to a bug eyed gator-like creature, nearly twice Kirk's size with hulking shoulders and rams but with teeny lil' legs, almost Tasmanian Devil proportions. "Aww, what's up, Croc'? Here; this might help." As the Gorn hefts the woody cylinder upon his shoulder to take aim... "BOOM!!!" Once the smoke clears, we see a soot covered, black silhouette, the faceted eyes suddenly much more human looking and "crossed" for humorous effect. Crumpling into a modest pile of dust, a tiny white flag emerges, waving defeat.

    But oddly enough, I think this setup could have been portrayed seriously. Kirk has mixes the ingredients and has poured the contents and shards into the bamboo as depicted in the episode. But while trying to "flint" the strip of fabric to serve as a fuse, the Gorn draws closer than he managed in the show. He swings his obsidian dagger at Kirk who ducks out of the way. But now he's out of reach of his improvised cannon. The alien reptile realizes the purpose of the tube. Knowing the human can outrun him, the Gorn lifts the bamboo construct to his hip intending to turn Kirk's weapon against him. He places the burning fabric to the hole... But, as in the real life experiment, the assembly explodes instead of properly launching the diamond fragments. the Gorn crumples to the ground and the scene plays out pretty much as in the broadcast episode.

    Instead of two improbable conditions, Kirk mixing viable gunpowder AND the construct NOT exploding violently enough to kill him, we just have one "questionable" factor.

    Sincerely,

    Bill
     
  6. FormerLurker

    FormerLurker Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The earlier draft of the script that James Blish used to fashion his adaptation specified that the "bamboo" and the rope were of far tougher stuff than what is found on Earth. The bamboo is described as metallic, and that Kirk couldn't bend it with just his hands, which is what prompted him to use it build his cannon.

    There is so little of this left in the actual episode it is easily missed. Kirk finds the cache of bamboo, and bangs one smaller length on the ground once to test its strength. He then picks up the larger diameter piece and begins collecting his ingredients. Knowing the adaptation's description, one can see Kirk realizing his best bet is to use the larger piece, as the smaller diameter ones would be little better than a quarterstaff, with no way to bore out a barrel. But, as said, with no dialog or voiceover to describe what Kirk is thinking, it's easy to miss.
     
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  7. Warped9

    Warped9 Admiral Admiral

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    Simple fact is if the Gorn were as quick and agile as Kirk the game is over. He would rip Kirk apart.
     
  8. Capn Nick

    Capn Nick Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I love the Gorn's slow moving. It also sets up the cool tactical idea of them both designing weapons to compensate for weakness so you see how the Gorn is crafty.

    Kirk makes a canon because he needs more power, the Gorn makes a net trap because he needs Kirk to slow down.
     
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