Nicely put.
Yeoman Rand & Production order
- Thread starter EnriqueH
- Start date
Nicely put.
I would argue that the "breakthrough" (such as it was) was the fact that women were there at all and that some of them were department heads or held positions of considerable responsibility. The show was supposed to be in "the future", but the writers were in the present.
Are you sure? When I watched Trek in the early 70's they WERE in a certain order. I kept a Star Trek notebook (I know I'm a nerd) and one of the things I did was to keep a record of which episodes played and in what order. Even though the show would be on the air, go off and come back; the order of episodes was always the same. Not sure why I wasted everyones time with this, lol.
True enough -- but as I mentioned above, there were other TV shows on the air at the same time that did successfully show stronger, more assertive and independent female characters. Rand doesn't just come off badly compared to modern female protagonists, but to a number of her own contemporaries. As I said, the myth is that TOS was on the vanguard for its era, but while it was making an effort to be inclusive and progressive, there were a number of other contemporary shows that did it significantly better. And sometimes TOS cancelled out its own progressiveness with some really blatant sexism.
Interesting. I would imagine that each station would cycle through them in the order they came in the syndication package, but there's no telling what the basis for that order was, if any. Maybe "random" is the wrong word, but what I meant is that the '70s syndicated episodes were not in any meaningful order that I'm aware of. But eventually, there was a syndication package released in production order, and that was the standard for quite a while.
You win.
Wow, you guys are picky in what order you watch them in! 
I just wish now that I could recall the order I'd first seen the episodes in. I specifically know the first scene I ever saw was from The Mark of Gideon. Next I clearly recall For the World is Hollow and I Have Touched the Sky.
It'd be interesting to know that...
I just wish now that I could recall the order I'd first seen the episodes in. I specifically know the first scene I ever saw was from The Mark of Gideon. Next I clearly recall For the World is Hollow and I Have Touched the Sky.
It'd be interesting to know that...
The first episode I ever saw was "The Cloud Minders." The last (to have seen at least once) was "The Squire of Gothos." The rest I have no real clue.
Yeah, keeping a viewing diary wins the thread!
Yeah, keeping a viewing diary wins the thread!
The show's first ever release on DVD was in production order, back in the days when they individually released two episodes on one disc. That makes it even more baffling and aggravating that after getting it right the first time Paramount would inexplicably revert back to the arbitrary original airdate order for the later box set releases.
No argument that there were plenty of sexist elements in TOS. While other shows may have done a better job of consistently portraying women as strong and independent, I think characters such as Helen Noel and Ann Mulhall were interesting combinations of brains and courage. Overall, I think there was some boundary pushing. Not as much as we might want to believe in retrospect, but some.
You can see development in Rand if you watch the episodes in their correct order and she is not always portrayed as just a secretary even if her portrayal was rather sexist. She takes over the helm in an emergency and makes coffee using a hand phaser, which shows she is capable of improvising.
Her best episode is the Man Trap IMO. I thought she was too passive in Miri and should have been shown thinking for herself rather than just waiting for Kirk to rescue her even if ultimately that's what happened.
Interestingly, in the CotEoF comic, Ellison has Rand using a phaser rifle to blast open a door and has her as part of the search team. It's always nice to see Uhura get off the ship but the role was clearly Rand's. It's possible that the writers or Shatner would have given the gun back to the man but if true to the original script, it does show that they would have continued to develop her character beyond unrequieted love, which they laboured too often in the early shows.
Rand might have had a meatier role than Mears in Galileo 7 as well.
I agree, I would have loved to see Rand guest in a couple of shows in seasons 2 and 3.
I based my Youtube comic in TMP era partly because all the main recurring cast feature and I love using Rand as the everyman. She's not overly smart but she thinks on her feet and improvises when she has to. She's great fun to write.
Her best episode is the Man Trap IMO. I thought she was too passive in Miri and should have been shown thinking for herself rather than just waiting for Kirk to rescue her even if ultimately that's what happened.
Interestingly, in the CotEoF comic, Ellison has Rand using a phaser rifle to blast open a door and has her as part of the search team. It's always nice to see Uhura get off the ship but the role was clearly Rand's. It's possible that the writers or Shatner would have given the gun back to the man but if true to the original script, it does show that they would have continued to develop her character beyond unrequieted love, which they laboured too often in the early shows.
Rand might have had a meatier role than Mears in Galileo 7 as well.
I agree, I would have loved to see Rand guest in a couple of shows in seasons 2 and 3.
I based my Youtube comic in TMP era partly because all the main recurring cast feature and I love using Rand as the everyman. She's not overly smart but she thinks on her feet and improvises when she has to. She's great fun to write.
I don't think I'm the only one here who would have also loved to see Rand (or Uhura) save the day.
But maybe you're right in TOS someone would have stopped that from happening.
I can't see Rand talking back to Spock like Mears did in Galileo 7. I think her character would have been supportive. And I tend to think she would have been a bit more useful on the Galileo.
I can't see Rand doing the bunny hop onto the floor as they start to move, either.
Compared to many of the younger Yeomen, Rand was much more mature and capable. It would have been great if the didn't cut her, but it would have been great if a lot of things happened that didn't too. I feel lucky we got what we did.
Regarding production order vs airdate on DVD on home video; I used to carp about the fact that it was changed back to airdate order and felt that production order made more sense in terms of character and series evolution. But honestly, that only really matters if you intend to watch the series in order. Do many of you do that? I tend to just pop on an episode I'm in the mood for. Or maybe I'll pick one that I haven't seen in a while. But I really never watch the series from start to finish, so it makes zero difference to me if the episodes are in airdate or production order.
Reminds me of the Cialis commercial. She's at the age of knowing how to get things done.
I haven't given it a second thought. I watched them in production order on pbs channel 44 when they bought the package in the original unsyndicated cuts. Then I got the VHS with 2 episodes per tape and they were in no order at all, and now I have DVDs in airdate order.
When I first got my DVDs I watched them all straight through, but now I do want to watch them in production order. That shouldn't be too hard, just some disc shuffling.
My whole life, I've popped in whatever episode I was in the mood for or whichever episode happened to be on TV.
This is the first time I've attempted to watch in production order: I highly recommend all hardcore fans try it.
I'm by Tomorrow Is Yesterday and it's very interesting to watch the characters develop. Obviously, the episodes don't reference the previous much at all at this point, but it's interesting in terms of the characterization and character relationships, which is---I'm sure---a very big reason we love the show.
On a separate note, it's been bothering me for a long time that we never saw Uhura take the conn.
It was cool to see her and Rand take the helm a couple of times.
I didn't like the "captain, I'm scared..." moments for these characters.
I was especially pissed when Joachim smacks Uhura in Space Seed and needed to be saved by McGivers.
It was cool to see her and Rand take the helm a couple of times.
I didn't like the "captain, I'm scared..." moments for these characters.
I was especially pissed when Joachim smacks Uhura in Space Seed and needed to be saved by McGivers.
I thought Space Seed was a good episode for Uhura. I admired her defiance of Joachim here.
When he tries to hit her the second time she stands up instead of ducking and makes a total "come at me bro" face. I always like that.
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