2387 Canon

[Relayer1]

As I've posted elsewhere, with THE remaining major 23rd century character 'leaving the building' soon, a major focus on Spock, his relationship with Saavik, his surviving human and Vulcan family family and his ambassadorship should permeate the 24th century novels until the Hobus event...

Why should it?

Well, there's no reason that they must, but I'd argue that they should. The split to the JJverse is a pretty huge event in itself. Being the exit of the iconic breakout character from TOS is bigger.

Simply as a matter of respecting the character, the event should be more than an afterthought. As a marketing opportunity for S & S it's too good to miss.

A loose series like we have seen recently would suffice - sub plots or lip service foreshadowing later events in a book or two, a Spock centric story or two leading into the Hobus event and a full biography would be my choice.

That's probably asking a bit much, but a 'Spock - The Beginning of The End' type marketing push makes sense AND serves the character.

 

[DS9forever]

I don't think that Pocket Books will even use the Hobus supernova idea for the destruction of Romulus storyline; given that the Hobus supernova is from an IDW comic.

 

[Sci]

I don't think that Pocket Books will even use the Hobus supernova idea for the destruction of Romulus storyline; given that the Hobus supernova is from an IDW comic.

No. The name "Hobus" is from IDW's Countdown comic. But the fact that a supernova destroyed Romulus in the Prime Universe was established canonically in Star Trek (2009).

 

[Markonian]

I don't think that Pocket Books will even use the Hobus supernova idea for the destruction of Romulus storyline; given that the Hobus supernova is from an IDW comic.

No. The name "Hobus" is from IDW's Countdown comic. But the fact that a supernova destroyed Romulus in the Prime Universe was established canonically in Star Trek (2009).

Whatever they do, I hope the keep the name Hobus. I've gotten used to that in all those years since the comic came out.

 

[Christopher]

I don't think that Pocket Books will even use the Hobus supernova idea for the destruction of Romulus storyline; given that the Hobus supernova is from an IDW comic.

No. The name "Hobus" is from IDW's Countdown comic. But the fact that a supernova destroyed Romulus in the Prime Universe was established canonically in Star Trek (2009).

Yes, that's true. Countdown only fleshed out the supernova backstory that Spock Prime's mind-meld exposition established onscreen. What is canonical is that a supernova occurred; Spock promised the Romulans he'd use red matter to stop it; he failed to do so in time to save Romulus; he still deployed the red matter black hole to save the rest of the known galaxy; a Romulan captain calling himself Nero attacked Spock out of revenge; and both their ships fell into the black hole.

Granted, there's nothing preventing one licensee from using ideas from another; concepts from other IDW comics have been mentioned in the novelverse, such as Klingon characters from Blood Will Tell showing up in "The Unhappy Ones" and an Andorian separatist group from Alien Spotlight being referenced in Paths of Disharmony. I drew on a couple of ideas from a different Alien Spotlight issue myself in my upcoming Tower of Babel. Tie-ins aren't required to adhere to one another's continuity, but that certainly doesn't mean they're forbidden to reference one another -- even if they take a reference out of one continuity and put it in a different one. So the books could theoretically use the name Hobus even if they disregarded other elements of Countdown.

 

[RandyS]

We'll either find out soonish, or the whole thing will be disappointingly skipped over.

That wouldn't be a disapointment. The two universes should be kept separate.

I don't expect that they will be, but they should be.

 

[dansigal]

Again?

I have to imagine this is a reference to the Ascendants storyline...

But anyway, I would hope it's not skipped over, BUT god only knows if this would create issues with this general business of the Abrahams camp not wanting any novelizations in the new timeline.

I think you mean novels. We've gotten novelizations of both movies.

Correct.

 

[Christopher]

That wouldn't be a disapointment. The two universes should be kept separate.

I don't expect that they will be, but they should be.

"Should" is overstating it. Star Trek has long been characterized for the interconnectedness among the many facets of the screen franchise -- five live-action series, an animated series, and a movie series all treating one another as, at least loosely, a continuous whole, rather than a bunch of separate realities as would typically be the case in many other genre franchises. Sure, there was a short-lived attempt to exclude the animated series from the canon, but since then it's been referenced repeatedly in later works and is now essentially treated as part of the whole. So if we're using the word "should," if we're pretending this is a conversation about obligation or propriety rather than just one fan's personal preferences, then I'd say that any sense of obligation or propriety ought to be based on the series' precedent and its distinct character as a multimedia franchise. And that precedent is that all the screen incarnations of the franchise are treated as continuous, even the parts that aren't as well-liked as other parts.

So there is no objective standard for claiming that different screen incarnations of Trek that were consciously designed to be connected "should" be kept segregated from one another by some kind of Sanctuary District wall. If there's a worthwhile story that can be derived from elements of any given part of the franchise, or by combining elements of different parts, then there's no good reason not to tell it. Plenty of good Trek novels have come from expanding on ideas from episodes or movies that many fans weren't crazy about.

 

[Relayer1]

Whatever they do, I hope the keep the name Hobus. I've gotten used to that in all those years since the comic came out.

Yeah, anything else would seem odd !

We'll either find out soonish, or the whole thing will be disappointingly skipped over.

I think they have to reference it when they reach that point - tie ins are obliged to adhere to screen canon. It need not be a large reference though...

 

[Avro Arrow]

I don't think that Pocket Books will even use the Hobus supernova idea for the destruction of Romulus storyline; given that the Hobus supernova is from an IDW comic.

No. The name "Hobus" is from IDW's Countdown comic. But the fact that a supernova destroyed Romulus in the Prime Universe was established canonically in Star Trek (2009).

I want to tread carefully here, since I don't want to get into story idea territory. But one thing that bothered me about the Hobus setup in Countdown was that they indicated it was a very far distance from Romulus. OK, so we can assume the shockwave propogated through subspace or whatever so that it could travel FTL. But if it was really that far away, it would imply that a large swath of the entire Romulan Empire (and some surrounding territories?) were similarly destroyed.

If Pocket has to touch on this incident at all (besides The Needs of the Many, of course), I hope they take a different path.

 

[Markonian]

In STO, the wave of devastation travelled through subspace. It was directed at Romulus. Praetor Taris and her Reman allies (only a faction of the Remans, not representing the entire species) produced it at the behest of the Iconians to destroy Romulus, specifically. Remus was lost as well but already abandoned because the Remans had migrated to Crateris. ("Ground Zero", "Taris", "Revelation")

The only planets mentioned and/or seen in STO has having been destroyed by the Hobus event are Hobus I-III, Romulus and Remus.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ Looks like we can be happy that STO isn't canon, then...

 

[F. King Daniel]

I don't think that Pocket Books will even use the Hobus supernova idea for the destruction of Romulus storyline; given that the Hobus supernova is from an IDW comic.

No. The name "Hobus" is from IDW's Countdown comic. But the fact that a supernova destroyed Romulus in the Prime Universe was established canonically in Star Trek (2009).

I want to tread carefully here, since I don't want to get into story idea territory. But one thing that bothered me about the Hobus setup in Countdown was that they indicated it was a very far distance from Romulus. OK, so we can assume the shockwave propogated through subspace or whatever so that it could travel FTL. But if it was really that far away, it would imply that a large swath of the entire Romulan Empire (and some surrounding territories?) were similarly destroyed.

If Pocket has to touch on this incident at all (besides The Needs of the Many, of course), I hope they take a different path.

Spock did say it "threatened to destroy the galaxy", and he's not prone to hyperbole. Trek Lit has seen plenty of similar over-the-top crisis, like the Genesis Wave or the events of The Body Electric.

 

[-Brett-]

In STO, the wave of devastation travelled through subspace. It was directed at Romulus. Praetor Taris and her Reman allies (only a faction of the Remans, not representing the entire species) produced it at the behest of the Iconians to destroy Romulus, specifically. Remus was lost as well but already abandoned because the Remans had migrated to Crateris. ("Ground Zero", "Taris", "Revelation")

The only planets mentioned and/or seen in STO has having been destroyed by the Hobus event are Hobus I-III, Romulus and Remus.

^ Looks like we can be happy that STO isn't canon, then...

The nova as a deliberate act caused by an advanced weapon is a reasonable attempt to explain a "supernova" that behaves nothing at all like a supernova. There's no good way to explain it, but that's a reasonable attempt. I'll give them points for trying, anyway.

 

[tomswift2002]

Again?

I have to imagine this is a reference to the Ascendants storyline...

But anyway, I would hope it's not skipped over, BUT god only knows if this would create issues with this general business of the Abrahams camp not wanting any novelizations in the new timeline.

I think you mean novels. We've gotten novelizations of both movies.

Don't forget we also got the 4-book Starfleet Academy series that is set right within the 3-year gap in Star Trek (2009).

 

[The Wormhole]

I don't think that Pocket Books will even use the Hobus supernova idea for the destruction of Romulus storyline; given that the Hobus supernova is from an IDW comic.

No. The name "Hobus" is from IDW's Countdown comic. But the fact that a supernova destroyed Romulus in the Prime Universe was established canonically in Star Trek (2009).

I want to tread carefully here, since I don't want to get into story idea territory. But one thing that bothered me about the Hobus setup in Countdown was that they indicated it was a very far distance from Romulus. OK, so we can assume the shockwave propogated through subspace or whatever so that it could travel FTL. But if it was really that far away, it would imply that a large swath of the entire Romulan Empire (and some surrounding territories?) were similarly destroyed.

If Pocket has to touch on this incident at all (besides The Needs of the Many, of course), I hope they take a different path.

Except that is also how it was depicted in the movie, and Pocket does have to stay consistent with the canonical depiction as presented in the movie were they to do this story.

 

[30fridge]

No. The name "Hobus" is from IDW's Countdown comic. But the fact that a supernova destroyed Romulus in the Prime Universe was established canonically in Star Trek (2009).

I want to tread carefully here, since I don't want to get into story idea territory. But one thing that bothered me about the Hobus setup in Countdown was that they indicated it was a very far distance from Romulus. OK, so we can assume the shockwave propogated through subspace or whatever so that it could travel FTL. But if it was really that far away, it would imply that a large swath of the entire Romulan Empire (and some surrounding territories?) were similarly destroyed.

If Pocket has to touch on this incident at all (besides The Needs of the Many, of course), I hope they take a different path.

Except that is also how it was depicted in the movie, and Pocket does have to stay consistent with the canonical depiction as presented in the movie were they to do this story.

Maybe, but what about The Good That Men Do? That novel set a precedent for reinterpreting canon.

 

[Christopher]

Except that is also how it was depicted in the movie, and Pocket does have to stay consistent with the canonical depiction as presented in the movie were they to do this story.

I don't recall the movie specifying how far the supernova was from Romulus. If anything, it was implicitly fairly close, since Romulus was the only world mentioned as actually being destroyed rather than simply threatened.

 

[Deranged Nasat]

By the way, welcome to the BBS, 30fridge

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Maybe, but what about The Good That Men Do? That novel set a precedent for reinterpreting canon.

And was quite justified in doing so, I might add.