If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show around?

[cardinal biggles]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I don't think that sanctity of whether the Tonight Show airs before or after midnight is much of a real issue. If they for some reason just decided to add another 30 minutes to local news or something, I doubt Conan would've left. It's not about when the Tonight Show airs, it's about Leno pushing him out of his timeslot. It sounds good to talk about the heritage of the show and all that, bu the simpler explanation is the massive egos that these guys all have.

Part of it is definitely ego, but there is something to be said for the same show in that time slot going all the way back to 1954.

I do think that Conan probably hates being out of the game, essentially sidelined on TBS not even competing with the other hosts. It would have been super interesting if he had went back to being the post-Leno guy... would that mean that now both Leno and Conan would be getting pushed out for a Fallon Tonight Show returning to its old timeslot?

Well, it's just speculation. And he's a professional. I'm not saying he doesn't enjoy his TBS show. But he does occasionally throw out a self-aware joke about being on basic cable, or that nobody is watching.

That's par for the course. All of these guys make fun of whatever network they're on. Conan's barbs about TBS aren't any more or less pointed than the jokes he made about NBC when he was on Late Night and Tonight.

 

[Agent Richard07]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I'm sure that seeing Jimmy get the Tonight Show just a few years later and staying in New York to boot is a bit of a sore spot.

And thanks Timby. I'll have to check out that book too.

 

[J.T.B.]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

And thanks Timby. I'll have to check out that book too.

I re-read The Late Shift before reading The War for Late Night and recommend doing it that way if possible. The parallels with and repercussions from '91-'93 are fascinating, it's almost like one big 20-year long story.

 

[Aldo]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

And thanks Timby. I'll have to check out that book too.

I re-read The Late Shift before reading The War for Late Night and recommend doing it that way if possible. The parallels with and repercussions from '91-'93 are fascinating, it's almost like one big 20-year long story.

Not to pull this thread too far off course, but what I found fascinating about the incident 20 years ago is that I thought Letterman left for CBS right after it happened. But from what I was reading he stuck around on NBC for at least another year or two before heading to CBS and the earlier time slot.

 

[urbandefault]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

Going by my rapidly failing memory, Letterman left NBC in mid-93. Leno had taken over the Tonight Show in 92, after Carson's retirement. The Late Show debuted on CBS in the fall in 1993.

Fox tried to capitalize on the tumult by putting on a competing show starring Chevy Chase. That was just sad.

Conan's first time on Late Night was painful to watch. He was visibly shaking through the monologue, and the rest of the show wasn't much better. Lucky for him NBC didn't pull the plug.

If I were Conan and NBC had offered me the Tonight Show, I'd have made sure that there was a clause in the contract that said if they fired me they'd have to hire Letterman back. That would have been hilarious.

As for the TBS show, I have it on tv most every night, but I don't really watch it. I like Jimmy Vivino. He's the real deal.

 

[Mr Light]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

What was Letterman doing for that year at NBC while Leno was hosting the show?

 

[Aldo]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

Actually come to think of it, I can (just barely) remember watching Letterman after Leno on the same channel. It must not have been for very long, but it feels very familiar.

 

[urbandefault]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

What was Letterman doing for that year at NBC while Leno was hosting the show?

It wasn't a year, more like a few months, until Letterman's contract was up.

As I remember, he didn't talk about it specifically but as time went on the jokes got snarkier until the show ended. A few months later, the CBS show started. Once it got on its feet and the new wore off he sort of picked the snark back up and ran with it.

I don't think Dave ever got over being snubbed by NBC.

 

[Aldo]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I don't think Dave ever got over being snubbed by NBC.

He was very vocal the whole time the Conan/Jay thing was going on. And from the tone of his voice through all his thoughts on the matter it was very clear he wasn't over it.

Hell I remember years ago when Norm McDonald was fired from Saturday Night Live he went on Letterman because he knew Letterman would put him on because it was something he could relate to.

 

[Timby]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

Yeah, Letterman had very little respect for Leno after what happened in '92, and after Leno executed his putsch in 2010, you could tell that whatever respect he had left was gone.

 

[the G-man]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

Conan's real problem was that he didn't name Lorne Michaels as his executive producer when he took over Tonight. Lorne has more pull than nearly anyone at NBC and when the ratings didn't look good he didn't have Lorne to protect him (the way he did at the beginning of his Late Night run when things didn't look good).

Fallon has Lorne. Fallon will be there forever.

As for Leno, this whole "Jay is the devil" thing is a little ridiculous.

He wanted a job. He fought for a job. He got the job. Later, they fired him from the job and, when the new guy didn't work out, they offered him his job back. Who wouldn't do the same thing he did for a job they loved?

 

[Yoda]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

So... we all know where this is headed right? Jay Leno is going to take over the Tonight Show from Jimmy Fallon in 2015?

 

[Spot's Meow]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

He wanted a job. He fought for a job. He got the job. Later, they fired him from the job and, when the new guy didn't work out, they offered him his job back. Who wouldn't do the same thing he did for a job they loved?

I think the feeling is that this situation is different because it wasn't just a matter of the new guy not working out, it was more that the old guy was conspiring/sabotaging the new guy to make sure he got his old job back. I'm not saying that is 100% what happened, but I think that's how a lot of people feel. Many believe, me included, that Conan's show would have been more successful if Leno did not have his primetime trainwreck on in the previous time slot.

It feels more like the new guy was pushed out without being given a fair shot, rather than things just not working out.

I also think that people would blame NBC a lot more than Leno if it had not been for Leno's previous troubles with Letterman in the early 90s. If this sort of situation happens to you once, okay maybe you were just in a bad spot and don't deserve so much blame. But when it happens twice, it's harder to ignore that maybe one of the main problems is the guy who happens to be involved in all of these problems...

 

[J.T.B.]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

What was Letterman doing for that year at NBC while Leno was hosting the show?

Doing his show. Carson's last show was May 22, 1992 and Leno started the next week. Letterman was under contract to NBC till June 1993, and NBC had rights to first negotiation and to match any other offers. In the meantime CBS won the bidding war in offers for Letterman, and NBC made a counter-offer that would kick Leno out and give "Tonight" to Letterman, similar to what they'd later do to Conan. In January '93 Letterman decided to go to CBS for a number of reasons, including having to wait over a year for "Tonight," not having ownership of the show, and how he had been treated by NBC earlier. The last "Late Night with David Letterman" was June 25, 1993, and "The Late Show" started on CBS in August.

As for Leno, this whole "Jay is the devil" thing is a little ridiculous.

He wanted a job. He fought for a job. He got the job. Later, they fired him from the job and, when the new guy didn't work out, they offered him his job back. Who wouldn't do the same thing he did for a job they loved?

Come on. Fighting for a job and getting a job does not justify all acts of disloyalty, dishonesty, intimidation &c. employed to get the job. He is a public figure and people will quite naturally have opinions on whether the tactics he used were respectable or not. Likewise about whether the new guy who didn't work out was given a fair shake or not.

 

[gblews]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

He wanted a job. He fought for a job. He got the job. Later, they fired him from the job and, when the new guy didn't work out, they offered him his job back. Who wouldn't do the same thing he did for a job they loved?

Letterman, apparently. (bolding mine)

In the meantime CBS won the bidding war in offers for Letterman, and NBC made a counter-offer that would kick Leno out and give "Tonight" to Letterman, similar to what they'd later do to Conan. In January '93 Letterman decided to go to CBS for a number of reasons, including having to wait over a year for "Tonight," not having ownership of the show, and how he had been treated by NBC earlier.

 

[Finn]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I never bothered watching. I never really found Conan amusing or entertaining

 

[Aldo]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

What was Letterman doing for that year at NBC while Leno was hosting the show?

Doing his show. Carson's last show was May 22, 1992 and Leno started the next week. Letterman was under contract to NBC till June 1993, and NBC had rights to first negotiation and to match any other offers. In the meantime CBS won the bidding war in offers for Letterman, and NBC made a counter-offer that would kick Leno out and give "Tonight" to Letterman, similar to what they'd later do to Conan. In January '93 Letterman decided to go to CBS for a number of reasons, including having to wait over a year for "Tonight," not having ownership of the show, and how he had been treated by NBC earlier. The last "Late Night with David Letterman" was June 25, 1993, and "The Late Show" started on CBS in August.

I realize I can google it, and I just may here in a minute. But I'm curious, did Conan start on Late Night as soon as Letterman left?

 

[J.T.B.]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I realize I can google it, and I just may here in a minute. But I'm curious, did Conan start on Late Night as soon as Letterman left?

Not immediately, NBC showed LNwDL reruns till Conan came on in September.

 

[Samurai8472]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

He wanted a job. He fought for a job. He got the job. Later, they fired him from the job and, when the new guy didn't work out, they offered him his job back. Who wouldn't do the same thing he did for a job they loved?

It's the workacholic in jay. He didn't want go in 2009 so NBC gave him a 10 pm show to please him

I still remember the promos. First it was 10 pm on the side of the car then a sticker pulls back saying 11:35pm

 

[the G-man]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

He wanted a job. He fought for a job. He got the job. Later, they fired him from the job and, when the new guy didn't work out, they offered him his job back. Who wouldn't do the same thing he did for a job they loved?

Letterman, apparently. (bolding mine)

In the meantime CBS won the bidding war in offers for Letterman, and NBC made a counter-offer that would kick Leno out and give "Tonight" to Letterman, similar to what they'd later do to Conan. In January '93 Letterman decided to go to CBS for a number of reasons, including having to wait over a year for "Tonight," not having ownership of the show, and how he had been treated by NBC earlier.

Not the same thing at all. By what you've posted Letterman really no longer wanted the job. Obviously, Jay did.