Is Christmas still celebrated in the Federation?

[Locutus of Bored]

^ So, your only response to an accusation that your argument amounts to little more than saying "No U!" is to actually say, "No, you!"? Lulz.

Is Christmas still celebrated in the Federation?

Yep!

That kid in the background on the far left is pretty clearly reading the Koran and preparing to prostrate in prayer toward the Mecca Nexus.

 

[-Brett-]

Them being secular and all that. What would replace it in terms of significance?

Them being a free society and all, I'd imagine they can celebrate whatever they feel like.

American Christians, at least the most vocal ones, seem to feel like their rights are somehow being infringed if they can't force society at large to celebrate christmas with them. I would hope this attitude dies out (soon), and that by the 23rd century christians learn to celebrate christmas on their own time.

 

[Kestra]

There was a Christmas-themed issue (#2) of DC Comics' first TNG mini-series. A alien race resembled The Grinch (who stole Christmas). A Christmas tree is on the front cover.

http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Spirit_in_the_Sky

Also yes! (Sorry about the bad quality of the pics)

 

[BigJake]

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b341/Kestra_Miral/7474F388-C240-4C5C-98D7-56569DF093CF_zpstgzi0wyz.jpg[/IMG]

Wow. That is really... something.

 

[PicardSpeedo]

Ah, a message favoring the hilarious "War on Christmas" (that most secularists celebrate as well) and displaying rampant Islamaphobia.

Lovely.

You just made PicardSpeedo's point for him...

His point was that discussions on Trek message boards will lead to the downfall of Christianity and Islamic dominance over the entire world? Damn, TBBS is more powerful than I ever imagined.

A phobia doesn't necessarily have to include hostility. It could just mean fear.

And thinking that Christianity will decline into non-existence and Islam will conquer the entire globe within 300 years seems pretty fearful (not to mention unrealistic) to me.

When was the last time someone screamed 'rampant' Christianophobia; how often does this happen? For affirmations that are direct attacks against christianity and its belief system - nothing veiled or intrepretable?

Practically every day on Fox News and in other conservative and/or Christian media outlets, with a triple helping during the holiday... sorry, I mean CHRISTMAS exclusively and nothing else, season.

As said - the more militant religion ALWAYS wins out. It always converts or tames the population more effectively.

Since the original topic was about Star Trek and The Next Generation (and spin-offs) and not Glenn Beck: The Next Generation, perhaps you or PicardsBananaHammock might care to elaborate on how anything in any of the 22nd, 23rd, and 24th century series indicates that Earth is dominated by Islam in order to make your comments somewhat relevant to the actual topic and not just an "OMG, teh MOSLEMS are coming!" fearmongering tract?

I expect lots of references to Dr. Bashir looking kind of shifty.

There is absolutely no evidence to support your suggestion that Julian Bashir was a Muslim terrorist.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

You just made PicardSpeedo's point for him...

His point was that discussions on Trek message boards will lead to the downfall of Christianity and Islamic dominance over the entire world? Damn, TBBS is more powerful than I ever imagined.

A phobia doesn't necessarily have to include hostility. It could just mean fear.

And thinking that Christianity will decline into non-existence and Islam will conquer the entire globe within 300 years seems pretty fearful (not to mention unrealistic) to me.

Practically every day on Fox News and in other conservative and/or Christian media outlets, with a triple helping during the holiday... sorry, I mean CHRISTMAS exclusively and nothing else, season.

As said - the more militant religion ALWAYS wins out. It always converts or tames the population more effectively.

Since the original topic was about Star Trek and The Next Generation (and spin-offs) and not Glenn Beck: The Next Generation, perhaps you or PicardsBananaHammock might care to elaborate on how anything in any of the 22nd, 23rd, and 24th century series indicates that Earth is dominated by Islam in order to make your comments somewhat relevant to the actual topic and not just an "OMG, teh MOSLEMS are coming!" fearmongering tract?

I expect lots of references to Dr. Bashir looking kind of shifty.

There is absolutely no evidence to support your suggestion that Julian Bashir was a Muslim terrorist.

You better loosen your speedo, Captain, because I can see you're nuts.

Given all the rest of the scatological-based threads you've started, I know you're just bullshitting me here, but you were the one who started in with the whole "The Muslims will control the future!" nonsense, which I was clearly mocking with the Bashir comment (not that I said anything about terrorism, anyway). You really need to try harder to provoke an angry response, because right now I just find you adorable.

 

[PicardSpeedo]

His point was that discussions on Trek message boards will lead to the downfall of Christianity and Islamic dominance over the entire world? Damn, TBBS is more powerful than I ever imagined.

A phobia doesn't necessarily have to include hostility. It could just mean fear.

And thinking that Christianity will decline into non-existence and Islam will conquer the entire globe within 300 years seems pretty fearful (not to mention unrealistic) to me.

Practically every day on Fox News and in other conservative and/or Christian media outlets, with a triple helping during the holiday... sorry, I mean CHRISTMAS exclusively and nothing else, season.

Since the original topic was about Star Trek and The Next Generation (and spin-offs) and not Glenn Beck: The Next Generation, perhaps you or PicardsBananaHammock might care to elaborate on how anything in any of the 22nd, 23rd, and 24th century series indicates that Earth is dominated by Islam in order to make your comments somewhat relevant to the actual topic and not just an "OMG, teh MOSLEMS are coming!" fearmongering tract?

I expect lots of references to Dr. Bashir looking kind of shifty.

There is absolutely no evidence to support your suggestion that Julian Bashir was a Muslim terrorist.

You better loosen your speedo, Captain, because I can see you're nuts.

Given all the rest of the scatological-based threads you've started, I know you're just bullshitting me here, but you were the one who started in with the whole "The Muslims will control the future!" nonsense, which I was clearly mocking with the Bashir comment (not that I said anything about terrorism, anyway). You really need to try harder to provoke an angry response, because right now I just find you adorable.

Islam being the primary religion in the future =/= Julian Bashir is a terrorist. Apparently there is a misconception that people from the Middle East all belong to the same religion and have terroristic leanings. This is untrue.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

There is absolutely no evidence to support your suggestion that Julian Bashir was a Muslim terrorist.

You better loosen your speedo, Captain, because I can see you're nuts.

Given all the rest of the scatological-based threads you've started, I know you're just bullshitting me here, but you were the one who started in with the whole "The Muslims will control the future!" nonsense, which I was clearly mocking with the Bashir comment (not that I said anything about terrorism, anyway). You really need to try harder to provoke an angry response, because right now I just find you adorable.

Islam being the primary religion in the future =/= Julian Bashir is a terrorist. Apparently there is a misconception that people from the Middle East all belong to the same religion and have terroristic leanings. This is untrue.

You should probably stick with starting more poop and fart threads like your other ones and leave the actual debate to the big kids.

Not that this thread really needed a religious debate anyway, since it was just asking a harmless question with an obvious "Yes, some people clearly do still celebrate Christmas in Star Trek" answer, but I admire your attempt at making it all about "teh Muslims!!!" and strawmanning the hell out of other's points.

 

[Timewalker]

In Europe, christianity is all but dead ...

Wouldn't it be fair to say that "indigenous" Europeans with their below replacement birthrate would be gradually dying if not for the influx of immigrants (and their religions) from elsewhere in the world? Buddhism and Islam are increasing in numbers in Europe faster than atheism. Plus there is a increase in European Catholicism with the new Pope, especially with the young.

The highest birthrates in Europe is among those with religion.

Edit_XYZ, atheist Europeans are being replaced.

Who says some of these people and/or their descendants will not someday become atheist?

As for star trek - in TNG, the future was supposed to be entirely atheistic - as per Rodenberry's dogma.
In DS9 - not even close.
As for the other series - they never treated the issue in any serious manner.

So, the question is - are we talking about a TNG or DS9 Christmas?

Did they ever celebrate anything Earth-based in DS9? I remember a lot of Bajoran holidays and one or two ceremonies that were Ferengi-related, but nothing like Christmas.

the legal code of some islamic countries - thought crimes and punishments.

Mmm-hmm. Do go on, please.

Mmm-hmm:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoning#Usage_today

And here you go - for a more detailed treatment of the subject:
http://www.amazon.com/Why-I-Am-Not-Muslim/dp/1591020115

Let me guess - islamophobia, yes?

Your'e pushing pig-ignorant bigotry with a conveniently self-sealing rationale, yes.

And you're inconsistent: by your own criteria, you're pushing 'pig-ignorant bigotry' vis-a-vis christian fundamentalists but are a big defender for islamic fundamentalists.
As said - the pros sure know how to tame people.

Given the number of horrific "honor killings" that have taken place in Canada, it's unlikely that any sensible person would be amenable to playing favorites with Islamic fundamentalists.

If they want to be strict observers of their religion, fine... up until the point where it clashes with the law or other peoples' Charter Rights.

 

[BigJake]

Given the number of horrific "honor killings" that have taken place in Canada, it's unlikely that any sensible person would be amenable to playing favorites with Islamic fundamentalists.

I'd say that "honor killing" has more to do with ignorance than fundamentalism, but the two go together often enough. No doubt much like abortion clinic vandalism and assaults.

 

[Timewalker]

Given the number of horrific "honor killings" that have taken place in Canada, it's unlikely that any sensible person would be amenable to playing favorites with Islamic fundamentalists.

I'd say that "honor killing" has more to do with ignorance than fundamentalism, but the two go together often enough. No doubt much like abortion clinic vandalism and assaults.

I was just going by one of the reasons given for killing the girls: refusal to wear the hijab. And yes, I know it's not a requirement set down in the Koran. But it's one of the attitudes displayed by Shafia toward his daughters and he looked on it as a religious issue.

 

[BigJake]

it's one of the attitudes displayed by Shafia toward his daughters and he looked on it as a religious issue.

Yes, like I said... ignorance and "fundamentalism" seem to coincide quite often.

 

[PicardSpeedo]

it's one of the attitudes displayed by Shafia toward his daughters and he looked on it as a religious issue.

Yes, like I said... ignorance and "fundamentalism" seem to coincide quite often.

This is most probably why Islam is the most popular religion in American prisons. Ignorance and encouragement of violence as a solution to life's problems.

 

[Timewalker]

You don't need Islam to have that combination.

 

[IndyJones]

This is most probably why Islam is the most popular religion in American prisons.

Care to provide a source for that? I can provide one that shows it's bunk.

 

[Misfit Toy]

Thread closed - at least until I sort this clusterfrak out...

This forum is NOT to be used to attack religions OR those that choose not to believe.

EDITED To Add: Okay - for a thread that asked a really easy to answer question, it quickly turned rancid. There was enough arrogance and bigotry sprinkled throughout that I really don't have enough pixels left to burn through warnings and/or infractions.

I will, however, ask/demand that all concerned remember that General Trek Discussion is not a wretched hive of scum and villainy, so hot-button religious and political topics are to be relegated to Miscellaneous or The Neutral Zone.