MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

[Data Holmes]

But a 20 year old from a broken or breaking family who suffers from develemental disorders and displays OCD like tendencies lashing out at his mother and the kids in her class because of a precieved jealousy that she liked them more than him, or anger that she chose her "kids" at the school over his family can be looked at logically and provide both context and understanding of the situation beyond the emotional response to the event.

How do you know that she choose her 'kids' over him, or are you are just pulling a theory out from your arse.

They are now saying that his mother died at the house, and that she might have worked at the school in the past as a volunteer not as a teacher.

Huh. Adam Lanza may have snapped because his mother was going to have him committed, and targeted Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown after killing his mother early Friday because he believed she loved the school “more than she loved him,” and was committing him so she could spend more time there.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/1...sed-connecticut-madman-to-snap/#ixzz2FRO96hZQ

 

[gturner]

^ That sounds likely. The perp in the Bath Michigan school bombing wanted to kill all the town's children as vengeance for not electing him to some city office, so he spent a year in preparation and even left a sign saying "Killers are made, not born."

It's not unlikely that the mother had the weapons to protect herself and others from her son in case he went on a rampage, and any measures she might have been using to keep them secure were methodically undermined by the determined psycho. That would imply that she'd also had lots of contact with public health officials and the police, which we might learn about as the investigation procedes.

 

[RJDiogenes]

Interesting article on mental health and violence in today's New York Times.

That's weird. Lots of contradictions and mixed messages. But they have it right in the second-to-last paragraph, at least.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

Fact never to be spoken: British Americans probably have about the same murder rate as the UK, and African Americans have about the same murder rate as Africa, hitting 50 homicides per 100,000 in the nineties, whereas the overall US rate is 5, the white US rate is 2.5 to 3.5, and the European rate is 0.9 to 10. Hispanic rates are also high, as were Italian rates in the past.

Continue not speaking it lest you want to find out what the infraction rate for Irish-American moderators is, because it's baseless, bigoted bullshit that implies a direct correlation between race/ethnicity and violent behavior absent of circumstances.

I should also point out for anyone that thinks gturner has the least bit of credibility, he also has a tendency to pull completely made up statistics out of his ass or in this case fudge them to serve his needs, like those Wild West European Luxembourgers with their murder rate that's twice that of the US after a full gun ban, neither of which are true.

Luxembourg, for example, has a complete gun ban and a zero ownership rate, but twice the US murder rate...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2012/jul/22/gun-homicides-ownership-world-list

 

[gturner]

^ If you read the Harvard Law Review paper cited by the United States Supreme Court, you'll see the nine point one per one-hundred thousand homicide rate for Luxembourg, which has since dropped.

You can't read much of any academic criminology literature or USDOJ or FBI reports without noting that they break the stats down by race, age, gender, relationship, circumstance, weapon, and many other metrics. Your government does this, and its important enough to be an entire branch of academic research.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

^ If you read the Harvard Law Review paper cited by the United States Supreme Court, you'll see the nine point one per one-hundred thousand homicide rate for Luxembourg, which has since dropped.

What was the year which the data cited in the review came from? I see 1997 for the firearms ownership rates (mine dates from 2007, the most recent year of the survey) and homicide rates from 2000 (mine dates from 2011). In neither case would Luxembourg have a homicide rate twice that of the United States, though.

 

[MacLeod]

So a UNODC (United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime) says the murder rate in Luxembourg is 2.5 / 100 000 and 4.2 / 100 000 for the US, means that the murder rate is approx 1.5 times higher in the US than in Luxembourg.

Whilst a US government report may break them down into race etc... The overall rate per 100 000 population such as used by the UNODC is easy to work it.

And in general the murder rate in countries with more restrictive gun laws is lower.

You can't just pick and choose which stats you use, using the overall figure eliminates things such as ethnic background.

 

[gturner]

I saw this note that said:

LUXEMBOURG: bans all guns. Its murder rate is often comparable to the western European average. But in many other years it is 2-4 times higher.

It cited the nine point one {my number keys are acting up} figure with the souce as

>From JURISTAT: Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics pamphlet "Homicide in Canada, 2002" by Josee Savoie at p. 3, Table titled Homicide Rates for Selected Countries, 2002

But I also see contradictory information on their rates of gun ownership here, which says both that civilians are banned from possessing handguns and longguns {but somehow can get permits for full auto weapons} and that the number of privately held civilian guns in Luxembourg is seventy-thousand, or fifteen point three guns per hundred people, which is more than Venezuela and ranks them as forty-one in the world for gun ownership.

It was interesting that France and Austria let anyone keep pistols, and some gun owners familiar with the country said that Luxembourg was actually less restrictive than Maryland.

ETA: The massive contradictions between Luxembourg's law and the data might be the result of grandfathering in most of what was already owned when their law was passed, which is very commonly done.

 

[Tora Ziyal]

Interesting article on mental health and violence in today's New York Times.

That's weird. Lots of contradictions and mixed messages. But they have it right in the second-to-last paragraph, at least.

Yeah. That was my take on it, but I was curious what others would think. I expect better of the NYT.

 

[gturner]

I'm not sure I understand your comment about us exporting our potential troublemakers?

For an extremely long time the British government would round up all the people they perceived as trouble-makers and low-lifes and ship them to places like Barbados or Australia. They figured they could deport their criminal class and make England a better place.

Obviously it didn't work or England wouldn't have so many soccer hooligans, or maybe it did, since Barbados has ten times the homicide rate of the UK.

 

[cooleddie74]

Why do you think a small island nation such as Barbados has a murder rate that high? Culture? Demographics? A large number of available weapons?

Why?

 

[gturner]

No idea, but probably all those play a role. Almost the entire Carribean has a similarly high homicide rate, including the Virigin Islands, Haiti, Cuba, the Bahamas, Trinidad, Puerto Rico, etc. Perhaps it's as simple as the killing season in the tropics being twice as long, so they kill twice as many people per season.

 

[Starkers]

I'm not sure I understand your comment about us exporting our potential troublemakers?

For an extremely long time the British government would round up all the people they perceived as trouble-makers and low-lifes and ship them to places like Barbados or Australia. They figured they could deport their criminal class and make England a better place.

Obviously it didn't work or England wouldn't have so many soccer hooligans, or maybe it did, since Barbados has ten times the homicide rate of the UK.

Er, transportation was centuries ago

And football hooligans? It isn't 1985 dude...

 

[Miss Chicken]

I'm not sure I understand your comment about us exporting our potential troublemakers?

For an extremely long time the British government would round up all the people they perceived as trouble-makers and low-lifes and ship them to places like Barbados or Australia. They figured they could deport their criminal class and make England a better place.

Obviously it didn't work or England wouldn't have so many soccer hooligans, or maybe it did, since Barbados has ten times the homicide rate of the UK.

Before the British settled Australia at least 50,000 convicts were sent to America (mainly to Maryland and Virginia).

 

[Gov Kodos]

Besides, many were sent for theft, supporting Irish Home Rule, or other trouble making actions. http://vcp.e2bn.org/justice/page11405-background-and-reasons.html

 

[Miss Chicken]

And Canadians and Americans who took part in the Canadian Rebellion also ended up in Tasmania. We even have a monument dedicated to them in a Hobart park.

 

[Gov Kodos]

The idea gturner is selling, that convicts were societal dangers, just doesn't fly. Many simply were not by our standards today. In addition, as seems to be the point of bringing up Transportation, that their descendants would be prone to crime is simply idiotic.

 

[gturner]

I'm not sure I understand your comment about us exporting our potential troublemakers?

For an extremely long time the British government would round up all the people they perceived as trouble-makers and low-lifes and ship them to places like Barbados or Australia. They figured they could deport their criminal class and make England a better place.

Obviously it didn't work or England wouldn't have so many soccer hooligans, or maybe it did, since Barbados has ten times the homicide rate of the UK.

Before the British settled Australia at least 50,000 convicts were sent to America (mainly to Maryland and Virginia).

Yeah. We got the UK's chavs.

There is a hilarrious book by Jim Goad {a whisky or coke fueled rant} called "The Redneck Manifesto", which explains that not everyone came here voluntarily, and that what American's call trailer trash is the last oppressed group that it's okay to insult without social repercussions, because they're just redneck trailer trash, and have been ever since they were hounded out of Britain {and the single wide was invented}.

One of the ongoing thoughts on black violence and culture is that it almost exactly like that of the American southerners who came from southern England, fixated on reputation, honor, and "street cred." As you dig into it, the connections between us all, and the cultural influences become more and more fascinating. I say this as a member of a family fought a feud that killed about a hundred in extended battles, and who had a cousin who was the only U boat commander executed for war crimes. I am from the deep hills of Appalachia.

 

[Scout101]

I am from the deep hills of Appalachia.

Explains almost everything you've ever said.

 

[cooleddie74]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around his assertion that African-Americans and natives of the Caribbean region are naturally more prone to criminal activity and are thus "naturally" more dangerous and likely to commit murder than most persons of European descent.

I'm not really sure I want to.