Breaking Bad - Season 5

[stj]

Walt is the protagonist and Hank is the antagonist. Hank should be the one who takes Walt down.

What Jesse is, is the antivillain to Walt's antihero. I think what would be most esthetically pleasing is to contrast Walt's failure to redeem himself to Jesse's success. (This does not mean that Jesse gets away, either alive or dead. Really, Jesse simply confessing would be richly satsifying, not least as a sharp contrast to Walt's endless rationalizations.)

Hank's job is gone, no matter what. As written, he will do it anyhow.

Walt's attempt to protect someone still sounds like a redemption motif tacked on to satisfy the love for the vicarious badass to win.

Skylar showing the money to Walt was showing her finally trying to deal with the situation. Her supposed plan of waiting was one way of course, but they showed her not waiting, but attempting repeatedly to torment Walt. Wanting to is perfectly natural but her doing so when she specifically said she would do something else made her look stupid, even kind of bitchy.

 

[Guy Gardener]

The final show down... Walt vs Hank?

"If this goes up the ladder to your superiors, I am going to jail, Skylar is going to jail, you are going to jail and Holly is going into the system. Can you imagine what despicable things those perverts will do to your niece night after night for the next two decades just because you couldn't keep your damn yapping mouth shut?"

 

[TheGodBen]

I had a strong feeling that this was the episode where Hank would have his "Holy shit!" moment (although, I didn't imagine it being quite so literal), and the moment I saw the Walt Whitman book at the beginning I was fairly certain. Then Walt and Hank had that one-on-one chat, and I figured that the show was giving them one last scene together before the bomb dropped. So, a somewhat predictable ending, but it had to happen at some point, and the fact that Walt has chosen to walk away from the meth business now adds an unexpected new dynamic to the show.

Wow.

So have we seen that copy of Leaves Of Grass before?

Amazingly, yes. Back in episode 3x06, Walt and Gale meet for the first time and Gale talks about his favourite poem by Walt Whitman, and later Walt is seen reading that book in his apartment. We don't see Gale give Walt the book or the inscription, so that part is a bit of a cheat, but the book was there ever since Gale was introduced to the show.

 

[J.T.B.]

If I'm not mistaken, and I probably am, and someone correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the book the object at Gail's apartment that Walt (and Gus) needed to confiscate before the place was searched? Wasn't Victor the one who recovered the book (and was subsequently killed by Gus for being seen by the cops)? Or was that something else?

The way I remember it, Victor was on his way to secure Gale before Walt could get to him, arrived just too late, looked over the scene and was seen by witnesses, and turned around and left. Then he spotted Jesse in the parking lot. I'm pretty sure he didn't take anything from the crime scene. Then at the end of the episode the crime lab people are going over Gale's apartment and the camera ends up on his lab notebook.

ETA: TheGodBen has given a spotting report for the Leaves of Grass book, well done!

Justin

 

[TheGodBen]

ETA: TheGodBen has given a spotting report for the Leaves of Grass book, well done!

Justin

Well, I didn't remember it personally, I read about it on another site and checked the episode to confirm it. Walt's reading it right when Hank calls him to ask if he knows anything about Jesse's RV meth lab.

 

[Tom]

Hank has a lot to lose not just his job so it's alot for him to consider. Skylar will go done as an accessory if Walter is busted, who knows how Marie will be affected, yup a lot for Hank to consider. The first episode made it seem as if Walter was in witness protection, so perhaps Walter makes a deal with Hank to help bust the Pheonix group and also Lydia in return for witness protection.

 

[Tom]

The book only proves that Gale and Walter knew each other. Both are proffesional chemists, so Walter could say to Hank that Gale appoached him for some work because he admired Walt and Walt declined his offer. Walter can then appologize to Hank for not telling him because he did not realize Gale was cooking meth and did not want to get in trouble.

 

[Dorian Thompson]

Yeah, but you all are forgetting something crucial in terms of how Hank is regarded--Walter's drug money paid his medical bills. Marie lied and said their insurance was enough to cover it, and Hank being so distressed over being disabled, he didn't question it.

That is the hot potato. Oh, you didn't know what he was doing, he just conveniently paid your bills? Any good defense lawyer for Walt could use that to nefarious success. I can't see Hank being too happy if/when that comes to light. He was mean enough to Marie when she was trying to take care of him. Knowing she accepted her brother-in-law's monetary help which turned out to be drug money (even though she didn't know) might finish their marriage. Then again, that hot potato might be the leverage Walt could use to get himself into witness protection. Possibilities, possibilities.

What Jesse is, is the antivillain to Walt's antihero. I think what would be most esthetically pleasing is to contrast Walt's failure to redeem himself to Jesse's success. (This does not mean that Jesse gets away, either alive or dead. Really, Jesse simply confessing would be richly satsifying, not least as a sharp contrast to Walt's endless rationalizations.)

Walter breaks bad, while Jesse breaks good. Normally I'd think that was too schmaltzy, but Aaron Paul could probably pull it off convincingly, and people seem to sympathize far more with Jesse.

 

[IndyJones]

Hank has a lot to lose not just his job so it's alot for him to consider. Skylar will go done as an accessory if Walter is busted, who knows how Marie will be affected, yup a lot for Hank to consider. The first episode made it seem as if Walter was in witness protection, so perhaps Walter makes a deal with Hank to help bust the Pheonix group and also Lydia in return for witness protection.

I didn't get the sense that it was witness protection so much as that Walt had got gotten fake ID and gone on the run.

 

[sidious618]

...but I didn't think it'd happen in this episode until I saw the fly in his backyard. Then I knew.

Huh. How was that the tip-off?

Back in season three there was the bug flying around the lab and Walt kept calling it a contaminant. Then there was the fly in the teaser to this episode which told me something ominous was coming. When the bug showed up again and the end I knew we were about to see something explode, and I don't just mean Hank's diarrhea.

 

[Gepard]

Ah. Okay. I wasn't thinking "containment" in general; I thought you meant it had some specific connection to the Walt Whitman book. Which was really confusing.

 

[davejames]

Damn, that was good. I just loved how they had you on edge the entire episode, wondering who Walt might kill next (Lydia? Skyler? Jesse?). Every one of those scenes was just packed with tension.

I do agree the Hank finding the book was a bit too convenient and obvious, but I think I can live with it. By this point, no matter how he found out, it was probably going to seem that way a little bit.

 

[Trubinator]

Yeah, but you all are forgetting something crucial in terms of how Hank is regarded--Walter's drug money paid his medical bills. Marie lied and said their insurance was enough to cover it, and Hank being so distressed over being disabled, he didn't question it.

That is the hot potato. Oh, you didn't know what he was doing, he just conveniently paid your bills? Any good defense lawyer for Walt could use that to nefarious success. I can't see Hank being too happy if/when that comes to light. He was mean enough to Marie when she was trying to take care of him. Knowing she accepted her brother-in-law's monetary help which turned out to be drug money (even though she didn't know) might finish their marriage. Then again, that hot potato might be the leverage Walt could use to get himself into witness protection. Possibilities, possibilities.

What Jesse is, is the antivillain to Walt's antihero. I think what would be most esthetically pleasing is to contrast Walt's failure to redeem himself to Jesse's success. (This does not mean that Jesse gets away, either alive or dead. Really, Jesse simply confessing would be richly satsifying, not least as a sharp contrast to Walt's endless rationalizations.)

Walter breaks bad, while Jesse breaks good. Normally I'd think that was too schmaltzy, but Aaron Paul could probably pull it off convincingly, and people seem to sympathize far more with Jesse.

You're forgetting that Jesse still cooked meth before Walter came into his life. And he did murder Gale ... as well as commit countless other felonies. Yes, he has a higher value for human life than Walter but let's not absolve him for everything he's done and act like Pinkman is a saint!

 

[Guy Gardener]

You don't need an m60 machine gun to take out Jesse Pinkman.

You secret Santa him enough meth to od, and he'll od.

 

[PKerr]

So there are a few things that I’m wondering about when it comes to Walt and crew and leaving loose ends.

First, how does the chemical process work for getting rid of “evidence”.
Does the process of getting rid of the bodies completely dissolve them or does it leave a vat of goo?
The reason I ask is they start a new barrel each time they want to get rid of someone, if it completely gets rid of them why start a new barrel every time?
Wouldn’t the large volume of purchasing that particular chemical raise some eyebrows somewhere?

If it doesn’t how and where do they get rid of the goo?
If they are dumping down a drain wouldn’t the chemical that dissolves people and motorcycle parts also eventually dissolve the drain pipes as well?

Second, I know Walt and crew (actually more Walt than anyone else) felt the need to get rid of the 10 guys in prison and it needed to be done quickly but the way it was done in a two minute timeframe screamed conspiracy.
I would think that every type of law enforcement would be jumping all over that and Walt just created 30-40 new loose ends as each of the 10 guys had 3-4 people taking care of them.
True that the guys in prison only followed the orders of the white supremacist and his two buddies and they have no idea who Walt is BUT it only takes one of those 30-40 guys to point the finger at the white supremacist guys, plus the fact that that the authorities should be able to piece the connections together back to the white supremacist guys with that many piece of the puzzle left behind.
With those guys obviously being in prison more times than once they are already in the system and should be easy enough to track down, once caught you know they are going to point the finger at Walt and possibly Todd.
Walt is going to have to get rid of the white supremacist guys, that will not sit too well with Todd so he will possibly have to get rid of Todd as well.

Lastly, Lydia.
Why keep meeting her in the coffee house?
I get that she wanted a public place for the name exchange meet but why make it easier to get caught or raise suspicion by meeting weekly in such a small public place with regular patrons, employees and in store cameras?
Why use a woman’s handbag that anyone could easily see in?
No one would eventually find it strange that this woman walks in with the bag and Walt walks out with it? And if no one did why risk possibly videotaping that exchange?
Walt is a smart guy, why not use identical briefcases and meet in a park or mall if Lydia still doesn’t trust him enough to meet out in the desert or something?

All I’m saying is with Walt seemingly wanting to tie up loose ends he seems like he is creating a lot more.

 

[Robert Maxwell]

So there are a few things that I’m wondering about when it comes to Walt and crew and leaving loose ends.

First, how does the chemical process work for getting rid of “evidence”.
Does the process of getting rid of the bodies completely dissolve them or does it leave a vat of goo?
The reason I ask is they start a new barrel each time they want to get rid of someone, if it completely gets rid of them why start a new barrel every time?
Wouldn’t the large volume of purchasing that particular chemical raise some eyebrows somewhere?

They use hydrofluoric acid, which has numerous legitimate applications, so wouldn't be hard to come by if you sound like you're an industrial user of it (which Madrigal would be.)

That said, hydrofluoric acid is not capable of dissolving bodies. It is extremely dangerous and deadly if mishandled, but other than causing a lot of tissue damage, it doesn't do a lot to dead bodies--it certainly wouldn't liquefy them. To destroy a body, you'd need to oxidize it, using a base like sulfuric acid. HF is evil, evil stuff, but it doesn't do what the show indicates. I would suspect they deliberately mislead viewers on what chemicals do what to thwart the "let's try that at home" crowd, except anyone fucking around with HF is probably just going to wind up dead.

If it doesn’t how and where do they get rid of the goo?
If they are dumping down a drain wouldn’t the chemical that dissolves people and motorcycle parts also eventually dissolve the drain pipes as well?

They were sending the barrels off in Madrigal trucks, probably to a hazmat disposal facility.

Second, I know Walt and crew (actually more Walt than anyone else) felt the need to get rid of the 10 guys in prison and it needed to be done quickly but the way it was done in a two minute timeframe screamed conspiracy.
I would think that every type of law enforcement would be jumping all over that and Walt just created 30-40 new loose ends as each of the 10 guys had 3-4 people taking care of them.
True that the guys in prison only followed the orders of the white supremacist and his two buddies and they have no idea who Walt is BUT it only takes one of those 30-40 guys to point the finger at the white supremacist guys, plus the fact that that the authorities should be able to piece the connections together back to the white supremacist guys with that many piece of the puzzle left behind.

You're assuming the white supremacist guys even know who Walt is. If a guy shows you a fat wad of money and will pay you for offing some guys already in the joint, do you really want or need to know his name? Nope, just show me the Bennies.

With those guys obviously being in prison more times than once they are already in the system and should be easy enough to track down, once caught you know they are going to point the finger at Walt and possibly Todd.
Walt is going to have to get rid of the white supremacist guys, that will not sit too well with Todd so he will possibly have to get rid of Todd as well.

They can only point the finger if they have a name. Which they most likely don't.

Lastly, Lydia.
Why keep meeting her in the coffee house?
I get that she wanted a public place for the name exchange meet but why make it easier to get caught or raise suspicion by meeting weekly in such a small public place with regular patrons, employees and in store cameras?
Why use a woman’s handbag that anyone could easily see in?
No one would eventually find it strange that this woman walks in with the bag and Walt walks out with it? And if no one did why risk possibly videotaping that exchange?
Walt is a smart guy, why not use identical briefcases and meet in a park or mall if Lydia still doesn’t trust him enough to meet out in the desert or something?

I dunno, I kind of like the coffee house. Maybe it's the kind of place where nobody pays attention.

All I’m saying is with Walt seemingly wanting to tie up loose ends he seems like he is creating a lot more.

Nah. They're only loose ends if people can identify him. I think he's progressed to the point where he knows better.

 

[Shurik]

I would suspect they deliberately mislead viewers on what chemicals do what to thwart the "let's try that at home" crowd, except anyone fucking around with HF is probably just going to wind up dead.

Everyone doing what Jessie tried to do with Emilio's body, would end up dead in about couple of minutes from inhaling the fumes.

I worked with HF a few times when I worked in microelectronics lab - we used it for some etching process. Approximately half of my lab safety training was dedicated to explaining that HF is a really really dangerous chemical and what to do if you accidentally spill even a tiny bit of on yourself. It goes for the calcium in the bones, so I guess large quantities of it would destroy the bones in the human body, turning the rest into a goo.

HF is something everyone should try to avoid if possible.

 

[Robert Maxwell]

I would suspect they deliberately mislead viewers on what chemicals do what to thwart the "let's try that at home" crowd, except anyone fucking around with HF is probably just going to wind up dead.

Everyone doing what Jessie tried to do with Emilio's body, would end up dead in about couple of minutes from inhaling the fumes.

I worked with HF a few times when I worked in microelectronics lab - we used it for some etching process. Approximately half of my lab safety training was dedicated to explaining that HF is a really really dangerous chemical and what to do if you accidentally spill even a tiny bit of on yourself. It goes for the calcium in the bones, so I guess large quantities of it would destroy the bones in the human body, turning the rest into a goo.

HF is something everyone should try to avoid if possible.

Yeah, that's what I meant. I've never been around the stuff, and after reading more about it I never want to be.

 

[PKerr]

So there are a few things that I’m wondering about when it comes to Walt and crew and leaving loose ends.

First, how does the chemical process work for getting rid of “evidence”.
Does the process of getting rid of the bodies completely dissolve them or does it leave a vat of goo?
The reason I ask is they start a new barrel each time they want to get rid of someone, if it completely gets rid of them why start a new barrel every time?
Wouldn’t the large volume of purchasing that particular chemical raise some eyebrows somewhere?

They use hydrofluoric acid, which has numerous legitimate applications, so wouldn't be hard to come by if you sound like you're an industrial user of it (which Madrigal would be.)

That said, hydrofluoric acid is not capable of dissolving bodies. It is extremely dangerous and deadly if mishandled, but other than causing a lot of tissue damage, it doesn't do a lot to dead bodies--it certainly wouldn't liquefy them. To destroy a body, you'd need to oxidize it, using a base like sulfuric acid. HF is evil, evil stuff, but it doesn't do what the show indicates. I would suspect they deliberately mislead viewers on what chemicals do what to thwart the "let's try that at home" crowd, except anyone fucking around with HF is probably just going to wind up dead.

If it doesn’t how and where do they get rid of the goo?
If they are dumping down a drain wouldn’t the chemical that dissolves people and motorcycle parts also eventually dissolve the drain pipes as well?

They were sending the barrels off in Madrigal trucks, probably to a hazmat disposal facility.



You're assuming the white supremacist guys even know who Walt is. If a guy shows you a fat wad of money and will pay you for offing some guys already in the joint, do you really want or need to know his name? Nope, just show me the Bennies.



They can only point the finger if they have a name. Which they most likely don't.

Lastly, Lydia.
Why keep meeting her in the coffee house?
I get that she wanted a public place for the name exchange meet but why make it easier to get caught or raise suspicion by meeting weekly in such a small public place with regular patrons, employees and in store cameras?
Why use a woman’s handbag that anyone could easily see in?
No one would eventually find it strange that this woman walks in with the bag and Walt walks out with it? And if no one did why risk possibly videotaping that exchange?
Walt is a smart guy, why not use identical briefcases and meet in a park or mall if Lydia still doesn’t trust him enough to meet out in the desert or something?

I dunno, I kind of like the coffee house. Maybe it's the kind of place where nobody pays attention.

All I’m saying is with Walt seemingly wanting to tie up loose ends he seems like he is creating a lot more.

Nah. They're only loose ends if people can identify him. I think he's progressed to the point where he knows better.

Are we to believe that Todd wouldn't tell uncle white supremacist guy Walt's name and some sort of Brief history about him before they met?

Are we to believe that Walt wouldn't tell uncle white supremacist guy his name and some sort of Brief history about himself and why he wants 10 people murdered in prison?

How would they know it wasn't some sort of undercover agent/cop setting them up?
One would think criminals would be a tad bit careful as to not end up in prison again.

One would think Walt wouldn't hire stoopid criminals to engineer 10 murders in two min.

 

[Jonas Grumby]

Second, I know Walt and crew (actually more Walt than anyone else) felt the need to get rid of the 10 guys in prison and it needed to be done quickly but the way it was done in a two minute timeframe screamed conspiracy.

Nevertheless, I think that's the way it had to be done. If you were Hank, and you got word that one or two of your imprisoned potential leads in the Heisenberg case had just been murdered, what would you immediately have done with the rest?