Why was it necesarry to prove Data's sentience?

[Use of Time]

Why was it necesarry to prove Data's sentience in Measure of A Man? I mean why did they choose that time of all time's to challenge that concept.

He was obviously sentient enough to go to Starfleet Acadamy and to serve in Starfleet.

He was the second officer on the Federation flagship and now all of a sudden they wanted to prove to the Federation he is sentient? Wasn't it a little bit late to be debating that? He had already been serving for years as an officer and in charge of actual humans.

All due respect to CDR Maddox, but Starfleet should've said "You can ask him to help you but I doubt he's going to go for it."

This was a great episode but the baseline premise was flawed to me.

 

[Christopher]

^Why was it necessary, decades after Emancipation, for African-Americans to keep fighting for the right to eat at lunch counters and ride in the front of buses? Why is it necessary, after discrimination against gays in the military was outlawed, to keep fighting for gay marriage rights on the state level? Prejudice doesn't evaporate with the first court ruling. It's always an ongoing struggle to change minds.

 

[Use of Time]

^Why was it necessary, decades after Emancipation, for African-Americans to keep fighting for the right to eat at lunch counters and ride in the front of buses? Why is it necessary, after discrimination against gays in the military was outlawed, to keep fighting for gay marriage rights on the state level? Prejudice doesn't evaporate with the first court ruling. It's always an ongoing struggle to change minds.

No, I'm not saying that I don't understand why he was defended. I'm more curious as to why Starfleet themselves did a 180 on Data at the drop of a hat. They had no problem letting him attend their Academy and progress through the ranks to the point where he was senior to over a thousand people on the Enterprise. Why would they so flippantly yank away those rights and privilages.

 

[Timo]

Just to set a few details straight, the court was not particularly interested in Data's sentience and never decided upon a verdict in that respect. The question to be settled was whether Data was property or a free individual, and the judge freely admitted that she could declare an inanimate object a free individual if she so pleased (and possibly declare a live and sentient human property of Starfleet), but only if there were pressing reasons.

Clearly, Starfleet doesn't particularly care whom it enlists - sapients, nonsapients, toasters - as long as they pass the tests and perform well enough. A toaster can command thousands of people if it does it well. Armies have traditionally employed worse things.

The thing that sent Data to a court was the question of whether he is allowed to resign from Starfleet or not. Supposedly, the point of the law was that Data was both property and incapable of resigning, which is an interesting combination, because one would expect there to exist ample precedent over whether somebody who has enlisted can resign. But perhaps that was a poor formulation, and Maddox and Louvois simply meant that resigning would not help Data because he was property?

What the court ultimately ruled was that Data has the right to choose whether to undergo Maddox' procedure. Nothing was established about sentience one way or another. Judge Louvois in her closing speech did say she felt Data was a machine, and was not property of Starfleet, but I doubt those things were actually included in the judgement as such. Although if the courts had to decide upon whether Data was a machine, or property, this would be precedent if not a verdict.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Use of Time]

Just to set a few details straight, the court was not particularly interested in Data's sentience and never decided upon a verdict in that respect. The question to be settled was whether Data was property or a free individual, and the judge freely admitted that she could declare an inanimate object a free individual if she so pleased (and possibly declare a live and sentient human property of Starfleet), but only if there were pressing reasons.

Clearly, Starfleet doesn't particularly care whom it enlists - sapients, nonsapients, toasters - as long as they pass the tests and perform well enough. A toaster can command thousands of people if it does it well. Armies have traditionally employed worse things.

The thing that sent Data to a court was the question of whether he is allowed to resign from Starfleet or not. Supposedly, the point of the law was that Data was both property and incapable of resigning, which is an interesting combination, because one would expect there to exist ample precedent over whether somebody who has enlisted can resign. But perhaps that was a poor formulation, and Maddox and Louvois simply meant that resigning would not help Data because he was property?

What the court ultimately ruled was that Data has the right to choose whether to undergo Maddox' procedure. Nothing was established about sentience one way or another. Judge Louvois in her closing speech did say she felt Data was a machine, and was not property of Starfleet, but I doubt those things were actually included in the judgement as such. Although if the courts had to decide upon whether Data was a machine, or property, this would be precedent if not a verdict.

Timo Saloniemi

Timo you exhaust me sometimes but in a good way. Here we go.

Your 1st paragraph. I know the details of the case but you cannot deny that the lynchpin in Data's defense was to impress upon the court his individuality and ability to choose as a "sentient" being. His right to choose was largely dependent on Picard's ability to prove Data's sentience. In effect the case had nothing to with sentience and everything to do with sentience.

2nd paragraph. Come on man there is nothing remotely "clear" about what Starfleet allows into the academy. In fact they make it seem very difficult to even get into. What worse things have commanded Armies in the past? I have only served under living, breathing humans in my short lifespan. You'd have to be a little bit more than a fully functional toaster with arms and legs to get through the academy.

3rd paragraph. The whole property thing and the whole "you can't resign!" approach is baffling. We see Beverly resign instantaneously in "Sub Rosa" and apparantly the only person that had to approve that was CAPT Picard. In fact we often see people dramatically take off their pips and comm badge and say "I'm out." Why is Data held to another standard. Why would his contract upon commission be different than any other officer?

4th paragraph. Agree with everything you said here. I doubt Louvois had the power to establish precedence in the courts with something of that magnitude. Her decision to keep the trial focused soley on Data's ability to choose was probably what kept that hearing at her level. Is there a Starfleet Supreme Court? I feel that they would probably have to be the ones to tackle the bigger sentience issue. That would be some stressful case law to establish.

 

[BillJ]

Data is a toaster with a great interface. And we're already being commanded by technology.

A "Data" aboard every starship would've been invaluble to Starfleet.

 

[Pavonis]

... We see Beverly resign instantaneously in "Sub Rosa" and apparantly the only person that had to approve that was CAPT Picard. In fact we often see people dramatically take off their pips and comm badge and say "I'm out." Why is Data held to another standard. Why would his contract upon commission be different than any other officer?

Crusher may have intended to resign, but I doubt the paperwork was filed, which is why she just as easily picks back up where she left off - as far as Starfleet Command is concerned, she never resigned. Same with Worf when he left to serve in the KDF - I bet Picard never filed the proper paperwork for his resignation, and just granted him a leave of absence.

But both Worf and Crusher are biological. Data's a walking computer, and if I recall the episode correctly, everyone agreed that the ship's computer can't resign, even if it says it wants to. So if the computer can't walk away, why should Data be able to do so? Just because Soong installed legs on him? That's hardly fair!

 

[Timo]

In effect the case had nothing to with sentience and everything to do with sentience.

Indeed. Picard vehemently argues for Data's sentience, which convinces Louvois that Maddox shouldn't be allowed to proceed with the dangerous operation against Data's will - but Louvois also cleverly maneuvers around recognizing Data's sentience. Perhaps because this might be a necessary step in allowing Data to dodge the vivisection, but not a sufficient one? Declaring outright that Data has the right to refuse is far safer for Data!

everyone agreed that the ship's computer can't resign, even if it says it wants to.

The major issue here is that the computer never enlisted, either. Surely Data's enrolling in the Academy involved some paperwork which may not have included "Sign here to verify your sentience" (because such an issue would not routinely arise) - but would certainly have included paragraph upon paragraph of conditions under which anybody enrolling would be entitled to resign. That's what should give Data fairly automatic legal backing for resigning, regardless of whether he's a man, a machine, or a piece of stationery.

But as said, perhaps Data did have the right to resign, as long as he was a person - but Louvois proceeded from the assumption that he was property, in which case he could not resign because he had not legally enrolled in the first place and the entire aspect was moot.

Come on man there is nothing remotely "clear" about what Starfleet allows into the academy. In fact they make it seem very difficult to even get into.

That's indeed it - Wesley has a hell of a time trying to get in, but Nog just waltzes in, and we see all sorts of lowlife in both Kirk and Picard's crews even when the skippers themselves are supposedly survivors in a fierce competition against devilishly strict tests and criteria. And never mind that many of their fellow skippers are real rotten apples, too.

But Starfleet definitely allows things to command men. Never mind that some of the things look like men; it should take court precedent to establish whether a Vulcan has a soul, say (Louvois seemed to think that this would matter to some). And M-5 would certainly have failed in that respect when originally evaluated (that is, when nobody knew it had Daystrom's soul), yet it was explicitly qualified to command landing parties and other starship crew.

Her decision to keep the trial focused soley on Data's ability to choose was probably what kept that hearing at her level.

She could have shoved it all up a level or two, most probably - but her interests lay in defusing the situation, not in solving it as such. Maddox wasn't a villain, Data wasn't a saint, and Picard was a loose cannon if left to shout from atop a moral soapbox. These three people should have been in speaking terms from the very start; it was very clever of Louvois to force Riker to play against Picard here, as this made it painfully clear to everybody that there were no victories to be won here, only bloody defeats to be suffered.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Christopher]

No, I'm not saying that I don't understand why he was defended. I'm more curious as to why Starfleet themselves did a 180 on Data at the drop of a hat. They had no problem letting him attend their Academy and progress through the ranks to the point where he was senior to over a thousand people on the Enterprise. Why would they so flippantly yank away those rights and privilages.

How is it the drop of a hat? Data was admitted into Starfleet Academy in 2341; Maddox's transfer order and the resultant hearing happened in 2365. That's nearly a quarter-century. The people who approved Data's Academy admission could've retired by then.

Also, even at a single point in time, Starfleet is a large organization with lots of different people in it, and they don't always see things the same way. Picard and his crew accepted Data, but we saw in the pilot that it took Riker some time to get used to the idea of an android as a person, and we saw later that a lot of Starfleet officers who weren't familiar with Data (like his first officer during his brief command tenure in "Redemption, Part 2") had a lot of trouble accepting him as a person rather than a mechanism. Picard and his crew seemed to be the exception to the rule when it came to how Data was treated.

And if you think about it, it's significant that Data had been in Starfleet for two decades as of the TNG pilot but was still nearly clueless about human interaction, figurative speech, and so forth. It always seemed to me that Data must not have had a lot of actual interaction with people during those twenty years. In my novel The Buried Age, I established that he'd generally been shunted aside into busywork in isolated postings by people who didn't know what to do with him or didn't want to deal with him, until Picard met him and encouraged him to assert his own wishes more.

So yes, Data was a senior officer on Picard's ship, but that doesn't mean everyone in Starfleet would understand or approve of Picard's decision to put him in that position of authority. Someone high up might've felt that Maddox's request to study Data was a perfect opportunity to undo that decision -- or else would've simply misunderstood what Data was and figured he was just a fancy piece of equipment.

 

[Use of Time]

... We see Beverly resign instantaneously in "Sub Rosa" and apparantly the only person that had to approve that was CAPT Picard. In fact we often see people dramatically take off their pips and comm badge and say "I'm out." Why is Data held to another standard. Why would his contract upon commission be different than any other officer?

Crusher may have intended to resign, but I doubt the paperwork was filed, which is why she just as easily picks back up where she left off - as far as Starfleet Command is concerned, she never resigned. Same with Worf when he left to serve in the KDF - I bet Picard never filed the proper paperwork for his resignation, and just granted him a leave of absence.

But both Worf and Crusher are biological. Data's a walking computer, and if I recall the episode correctly, everyone agreed that the ship's computer can't resign, even if it says it wants to. So if the computer can't walk away, why should Data be able to do so? Just because Soong installed legs on him? That's hardly fair!

Whether or not the paperwork was filed is immaterial. Picard didn't ever give any indication that officers couldn't up and quit in a given circumstance. He resisted Beverly but ultimately let her go.

Your second point has a glaring difference. Data is a Starfleet officer, the computer is a piece of starfleet equipment. The computer was most likely created by the Federation. Data was a being that sought out the academy and asked to join Starfleet.

 

[Use of Time]

No, I'm not saying that I don't understand why he was defended. I'm more curious as to why Starfleet themselves did a 180 on Data at the drop of a hat. They had no problem letting him attend their Academy and progress through the ranks to the point where he was senior to over a thousand people on the Enterprise. Why would they so flippantly yank away those rights and privilages.

How is it the drop of a hat? Data was admitted into Starfleet Academy in 2341; Maddox's transfer order and the resultant hearing happened in 2365. That's nearly a quarter-century. The people who approved Data's Academy admission could've retired by then.

Also, even at a single point in time, Starfleet is a large organization with lots of different people in it, and they don't always see things the same way. Picard and his crew accepted Data, but we saw in the pilot that it took Riker some time to get used to the idea of an android as a person, and we saw later that a lot of Starfleet officers who weren't familiar with Data (like his first officer during his brief command tenure in "Redemption, Part 2") had a lot of trouble accepting him as a person rather than a mechanism. Picard and his crew seemed to be the exception to the rule when it came to how Data was treated.

And if you think about it, it's significant that Data had been in Starfleet for two decades as of the TNG pilot but was still nearly clueless about human interaction, figurative speech, and so forth. It always seemed to me that Data must not have had a lot of actual interaction with people during those twenty years. In my novel The Buried Age, I established that he'd generally been shunted aside into busywork in isolated postings by people who didn't know what to do with him or didn't want to deal with him, until Picard met him and encouraged him to assert his own wishes more.

That first paragraph is somewhat odd to me. Why would policy all of a sudden regress in a twenty year window? Is Data's commissioning paperwork somehow void simply because those who accepted it have moved on into retirement? Wouldn't it be kind of contractual? It's like saying "Data, you did great at the academy and your service record is exemplory (as was indicated in the "Measure Of A Man") but you know what, that commission you received is invalid and you are a toaster." Yeah, I would call that having privelages as an officer revoked at the drop of a hat, wouldn't you?

It was more than the Enterprise crew that accepted him. Somebody thought he was good enough to get into the Academy right? He was somehow posted to the Federation flagship which is the most sought after assignment in the fleet. He wouldn't get that assignment because he was doing obscure work on some off the wall outpost would he?

You'll have to forgive me. I haven't read any of your work yet but I'll be looking forward to finding a copy of The Buried Age as it sounds pretty interesting. I'm all about finding out more of Data's backstory.

 

[Pavonis]

Data's a piece of equipment, too. He just dresses better than the computer.

The trial was clearly necessary, since Command thought Data should have to submit to Maddox's mercy, while Data didn't want to risk Maddox screwing around with his positronic brain.

Maddox figured his examination was no different than a Chief Medical Officer forcing another Starfleet officer to submit to medical tests, even if that officer didn't want to, for fear of dying.

Timo's got the point right, I think. Even if Data resigned as an officer, was he still subject to Starfleet as a piece of property? That was the issue to resolve, really. All Louvois said was that Data didn't have to submit to Maddox's testing, so he didn't have to resign to avoid it. It didn't really resolve whether Data was property of Starfleet, though Louvois thought he wasn't.

I wonder how they would've gone about forcing Data to submit to Maddox, if the ruling had gone against Picard and Data. Data would've just run away anyway, and how would they stop him? A phaser on stun? Data would have to trust you to get close enough to use his off switch, and at that point, he'd trust no one (well, maybe Picard).

 

[Timo]

I believe Data would be susceptible to blackmail. Maddox or Louvois could threaten Picard's career, with or without Picard being in on the "plot", and Data might well weigh the risks to his own well-being lower than the risks to Picard's at that point.

However, in order to get things to the point of coercion, Maddox would probably have to declare Data crucial to national security or something like that, as the matter would become embarrassingly public otherwise. And if he were successful in that, he could probably have Picard vivisected just as easily as Data...

(Indeed, it's something of a mystery Picard wasn't cut open more thoroughly after "Best of Both Worlds", come to think of it. Crusher gave him clear papers, but was wrong - he still had that subspace receiver inside him, as seen in ST:FC. That could have been anticipated, and Picard would have been Exhibit A in a long term study of some sort.)

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Use of Time]

Data's a piece of equipment, too. He just dresses better than the computer.

The trial was clearly necessary, since Command thought Data should have to submit to Maddox's mercy, while Data didn't want to risk Maddox screwing around with his positronic brain.

Maddox figured his examination was no different than a Chief Medical Officer forcing another Starfleet officer to submit to medical tests, even if that officer didn't want to, for fear of dying.

Timo's got the point right, I think. Even if Data resigned as an officer, was he still subject to Starfleet as a piece of property? That was the issue to resolve, really. All Louvois said was that Data didn't have to submit to Maddox's testing, so he didn't have to resign to avoid it. It didn't really resolve whether Data was property of Starfleet, though Louvois thought he wasn't.

I wonder how they would've gone about forcing Data to submit to Maddox, if the ruling had gone against Picard and Data. Data would've just run away anyway, and how would they stop him? A phaser on stun? Data would have to trust you to get close enough to use his off switch, and at that point, he'd trust no one (well, maybe Picard).

Data was an indvidual that showed up on the academy front step with an application in hand. Starfleet had nothing to do with his existance. He came to them and wanted to join as an officer not as property, and was accepted as such.

They accepted his application and he enrolls and eventually graduates the adademy. He is then offered a commission which we have no reason to assume is any different than any other officers. To me the minute Data accepts the commission Starfleet gave him, they lose the ability to call him a piece of equipment.

Data serves Starfleet for twenty years just like any other officer would and achieves a highly sought after position on the Federation flagship where he continues to excel. (Again he has numerous citations in his service record as indicated in "The Measure Of A Man")

Some R&D Admiral grants permission to CDR Maddox to go round up Data and he somehow has the authority to take away the basic liberties of life? I call bullshit to the tenth degree. If this is the same Starfleet that let him in, promoted and decorated him then you will have a hell of a time telling me that this is the same Starfleet that would undue all of that to make him a gineau pig. Could you imagine the media circus? I get that Data's acceptance might have been contraversial from the onset but to be frank, that ship had sailed the minute he put on the ENS pip. A decision to make a Data a test dummy for future androids would not be a unilateral decision made by a small group of Starfleet Command. I think that would take a pretty big round table of discussions by many of the Admiralty. You might convince me that a few of them would consent but there is no way that I believe Starfleet Command as a whole supported that decision.

Also, I don't think a case of this magnitude would be decided on some remote station with few JAG personnel and "one terrified little Ensign" with Data's own shipmates serving as Prosecutor and Defense. Are you kidding me.

 

[Timo]

Some R&D Admiral grants permission to CDR Maddox to go round up Data and he somehow has the authority to take away the basic liberties of life?

That's actually pretty close to a medical specialist given the authority to force the carrier of an interesting (but not necessarily directly dangerous) disease to undergo examination even if he has to be tied down and sedated first, as the action may save lives further down the line. A possibly even closer analogy for this situation would be an employee being forced to undergo examination after he has been exposed to a foreign agent (be it a chemical or a man in dark glasses).

It comes down to the "patient" having a limited ability to see the big picture, which is what militaries are all about: the employees don't get to make decisions, as their employer happens to be in the business of endangering lives, so it follows that the employees' lives are endangered on a regular basis, and the only thing they can do about it is stop being employees. They waive a lot of human(oid) rights when signing on dotted line at the drafting office. They have to, because if they didn't agree to being cattle, they would be worthless to the organization which, as said, is in the business of getting its employees killed every now and then.

A decision to make a Data a test dummy for future androids would not be a unilateral decision made by a small group of Starfleet Command.

I'm not at all convinced of that. Remember how Picard had a showpiece Klingon on his bridge? A loose cannon of dubious loyalties was given a prominent position on apparently very light grounds - Picard's personal judgement seemed to play the key role. The same with Data getting aboard the E-D and being allowed to do real work; that seemed to be at least as big a step as his original enrolling, and again done on a whim.

It's not as if Starfleet in the 24th century would be so homogeneous that every little aberration from the Aryan norm of employment would warrant careful study. I could see plenty of people ready to tear Picard and other trusting experimentalists to pieces the moment their experiments backfire, but these same people would have a keen interest in allowing the experiments to get going in the first place...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Use of Time]

Some R&D Admiral grants permission to CDR Maddox to go round up Data and he somehow has the authority to take away the basic liberties of life?

That's actually pretty close to a medical specialist given the authority to force the carrier of an interesting (but not necessarily directly dangerous) disease to undergo examination even if he has to be tied down and sedated first, as the action may save lives further down the line. A possibly even closer analogy for this situation would be an employee being forced to undergo examination after he has been exposed to a foreign agent (be it a chemical or a man in dark glasses).

It comes down to the "patient" having a limited ability to see the big picture, which is what militaries are all about: the employees don't get to make decisions, as their employer happens to be in the business of endangering lives, so it follows that the employees' lives are endangered on a regular basis, and the only thing they can do about it is stop being employees. They waive a lot of human(oid) rights when signing on dotted line at the drafting office. They have to, because if they didn't agree to being cattle, they would be worthless to the organization which, as said, is in the business of getting its employees killed every now and then.

A decision to make a Data a test dummy for future androids would not be a unilateral decision made by a small group of Starfleet Command.

I'm not at all convinced of that. Remember how Picard had a showpiece Klingon on his bridge? A loose cannon of dubious loyalties was given a prominent position on apparently very light grounds - Picard's personal judgement seemed to play the key role. The same with Data getting aboard the E-D and being allowed to do real work; that seemed to be at least as big a step as his original enrolling, and again done on a whim.

It's not as if Starfleet in the 24th century would be so homogeneous that every little aberration from the Aryan norm of employment would warrant careful study. I could see plenty of people ready to tear Picard and other trusting experimentalists to pieces the moment their experiments backfire, but these same people would have a keen interest in allowing the experiments to get going in the first place...

Timo Saloniemi

How is that analogy anywhere close to Data? He didn't have a disease. It was only an issue because CDR Maddox tried to recreate an android but wasn't smart enough. Not exactly an "Outbreak" situation.

Your second points are lost on me completely. I am talking about the decision to make Data a walking blueprint to support CDR Maddox's inability to create an android of his own. This would be a decision that would be hotly discussed amongst the highest levels of Starfleet in my opinion as it says a lot about how Starfleet treats it's officers and member races of the Federation. The PR nightmare of this decision would be monumental. This woud not be some Admiral Department Head that gets to make a unilateral decision as large as this one in a vacuum.

 

[Timo]

How is that analogy anywhere close to Data? He didn't have a disease. It was only an issue because CDR Maddox tried to recreate an android but wasn't smart enough. Not exactly an "Outbreak" situation.

No need for the disease to be a direct risk to the employee or his environs. It would suffice that getting the employee examined for his rare qualities would save future lives.

This would be a decision that would be hotly discussed amongst the highest levels of Starfleet in my opinion as it says a lot about how Starfleet treats it's officers and member races of the Federation.

Only if Data is somehow a unique case. And since Starfleet is such an extremely diverse place, we'd need quite a bit of evidence in order to believe that trials like this have not happened before, and won't happen again. It would be incredibly racist to think that a decision applying to Data here would carry any significance in a case relating to, say, an Ocampa or holographic or vampire or archangel employee of Starfleet.

The PR nightmare of this decision would be monumental.

It would be downright mundane compared with decisions that actually affect species. Data is a species of one (and his "brother" would be the first one to agree), and wouldn't be missed much if legally defined as a toaster and recycled.

Why do people think that everything seen happening in Star Trek is happening for the very first time? Kirk's folks weren't the first to use transporters - that's not the explanation for McCoy's phobia. Spock wasn't the first alien in Starfleet - that's not the explanation for his complexes and troubles.

A story about Data being a big precedent could have been written. It wasn't. Rather, we got a story where a sensible judge got a bunch of sensible people to agree on a molehill that threatened to become a mountain.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Pavonis]

Data wasn't going to be tested to destruction, anymore than a patient is treated to death. Data just didn't trust Maddox to take him apart and put him back together again without "killing" him. There's no evidence that Maddox was incompetent, just inexperienced. Data might not have been in any danger from him at all.

And I doubt that Soong developed his androids entirely independently. He would've had all the androids that Kirk encountered as examples of the engineering and programming needed. Maddox just wanted a live sample, something Soong probably lacked but overcame. Maddox could probably overcome that problem, too! Eventually.

Also, don't forget that Data didn't just show up at the Academy. He was found by Starfleet officers. And we all know that the rule is finder's keeper's. Therefore, Data belongs to Starfleet!

 

[Use of Time]

No need for the disease to be a direct risk to the employee or his environs. It would suffice that getting the employee examined for his rare qualities would save future lives.

Except this wasn't a patient being asked to submit to save lives. He was asked to risk his life to an admittedly inadequate cyberneticist for the sole purpose of satiating his curiousity. Data even volonteered to assist him if he got closer but Maddox was more impatient.

Only if Data is somehow a unique case. And since Starfleet is such an extremely diverse place, we'd need quite a bit of evidence in order to believe that trials like this have not happened before, and won't happen again. It would be incredibly racist to think that a decision applying to Data here would carry any significance in a case relating to, say, an Ocampa or holographic or vampire or archangel employee of Starfleet.

I doubt grabbing people in this instance was all that common of a practice for Starfleet. Why would any non human want to join this organization if they were constantly engaging in trials to determine human(oid) rights?

It would be downright mundane compared with decisions that actually affect species. Data is a species of one (and his "brother" would be the first one to agree), and wouldn't be missed much if legally defined as a toaster and recycled.

Really. Look at something as simple as this Chik-Fil-A fiasco. You don't think Data's case would warrant a reaction from the populace or Starfleet's member worlds? The Enterprise crew sure didn't react as if this was a mundane situation. The number of people in a race should not quantify their worth. Data being the sole member of his race should warrant protection from things like this. How in the world would him being one of a kind not make him even more valuable?

Why do people think that everything seen happening in Star Trek is happening for the very first time? Kirk's folks weren't the first to use transporters - that's not the explanation for McCoy's phobia. Spock wasn't the first alien in Starfleet - that's not the explanation for his complexes and troubles.

Again, I'm going with the crew reaction here. Granted they were emotionally vested but this certainly didn't look like something that was anywhere near normal practice.

P.S. I'm obviously still struggling with the breaking up of the quotes. Sorry.

 

[Christopher]

That first paragraph is somewhat odd to me. Why would policy all of a sudden regress in a twenty year window?

Because the people making the policy changed. You see this in real life all around us. Over the past three decades, Republicans have systematically rolled back all the economic regulations that were instituted into US law after the Great Depression -- arguably leading to the situation that nearly caused another depression. In state legislatures, there are officeholders trying to roll back women's rights and gay rights to an earlier state of affairs. Just because one generation of lawmakers institutes a change, that doesn't mean the change is absolutely fixed for all time to come.

Is Data's commissioning paperwork somehow void simply because those who accepted it have moved on into retirement? Wouldn't it be kind of contractual? It's like saying "Data, you did great at the academy and your service record is exemplory (as was indicated in the "Measure Of A Man") but you know what, that commission you received is invalid and you are a toaster." Yeah, I would call that having privelages as an officer revoked at the drop of a hat, wouldn't you?

But that's not what happened (and I need to correct my own erroneous assumptions after reviewing the episode transcript). Data was given orders that transferred him to a new posting. Like any other officer, he was required to obey those orders -- but he also had the same right as any other officer to refuse by resigning his commission. Commander Maddox filed a motion that that should be changed, that he should be forbidden to resign on the grounds that he was Starfleet property. Louvois then found an obscure 21st-century legal precedent saying that Data was indeed property. Picard then challenged that ruling and Louvois held a hearing.

So I was wrong -- the policy didn't change. It's not that Data's rights and privileges were unceremoniously revoked. The default position was that he did have those rights, but Maddox found a loophole in the laws that let him attempt to get around that, a loophole that hadn't yet been closed because it was based on an antiquated, forgotten law that somehow was still on the books (though how a 21st-century Earth precedent is part of Federation law is beyond me).