Yes, because animals are not people capable of engaging in a marriage contract. Really? is that the best you can do? But since you mentioned it, where's your protest against West Virginia's weird sex laws. It is legal for a male to have sex with an animal as long as it does not exceed 40 lbs. there. Insert random WVA joke here.
Chick-fil-A digging themselves a hole
- Thread starter Ar-Pharazon
- Start date
Yes, because animals are not people capable of engaging in a marriage contract. Really? is that the best you can do? But since you mentioned it, where's your protest against West Virginia's weird sex laws. It is legal for a male to have sex with an animal as long as it does not exceed 40 lbs. there. Insert random WVA joke here.
It seems to me that Chik-Fil-A is being persecuted for the beliefs and practices of the CEO that don't seem to line up with the liberal minded conciousness of the day.
Belief in traditional marriage and familial structure is the right of any red blooded American. Just as it's the right for any red blooded American to believe otherwise.
The company does not exclude gays from their restaurants, nor do they advocate such in their hiring practices.
They just make some darn fine chicken.
We as potential customers can choose not to eat there, just as the company can choose to open up a store in Chicago, Boston or wherever they heck they want. (as long as the franchisee's choose fund the installation that is)
It is the CEO's, and the companys' and franchise owners, belief to close on Sundays to respect the Sabbath and "keep it holy". What's wrong with that?
I commend them for putting their money where their mouth is. (They are closing on what would be a huge sales day for them.) That's what used to be called "integrity".
I don't see anyone else doing that. I'm sure there are lots of folks who see their closing on Sunday's as a bad business model, but they've thrived and are a strong company.
Chik-Fil-A hasn't shot a single person, nor have they bombed anyone. The company doesn't have a single airplane brought down to it's credit.
They simply stand on the beliefs of their 2000+ year old religion. A religion that has endured much more than the fussing of Chicago, Boston, message board and muppet representatives.
I do predict that there will be a strong response to Chik-Fil-A's stand in the weeks to come. Both from those who scream for the company's heads and from those of us who are headed there for lunch today!
And for several dinners and lunches in the future.
Eat Mor Chikin!!
Amen.
Besides, I find it sad that those who scream "boycott" and "intolerance" because folks don't believe as they do jump all over those who are just excercizing their rights to their own beliefs.
People scream "boycott" and "intolerance" because that company gives their money to hate groups who actively fight against gay rights.
Nobody gives a flying fig what the CEO of the company THINKS. They care what he does with his profits when they are used to oppress others. They care that his business denies employment to some for no good reason. See the difference?
You do realize that the problem isn't that they believe something different than us, right? It's that they've discriminatory hiring practices and are using their money to fight against my rights.
The problem isn't what they believe, it's that their attempting to force me to conform to their beliefs.
You can see the difference, right?
Eta: Ninja'd by booba.
1. That's irony for you. Apparently, these "Christians" are okay with supporting businesses that contribute to obesity (heart disease, stroke, hypertension as well), and violate the 9th Commandment with impunity. That's an interesting moral hierarchy. Where in the Bible can we find it? (Answer: Nowhere - the same Bible they use to teach that homosexual behavior is an abomination also calls lying an abomination and lists gluttony as one of the things God hates).
2. We have two accounts of Sodom and Gommorrah that I think, rather than separating and claiming to be contradictory ,make more sense when taken globally.
a. They are condemned for gross immorality. They are also condemned for inhospitality, for being rich and failing to help the poor and stranger.
I'll add here that when these Christians point to S&G for an example of God judging a nation/city for homosexuality, the text doesn't ever say that. The text in Genesis in which God condemns them doesn't name homosexuality,and the attempted rape of the messengers is simply an example of the immorality of the city, not the sin that God condemned. That was a rather long list, and, in Genesis it begins several chapters before the end of those cities.The city was ultimately condemned because there were no good people to be found. Lot and his family were the whole remnant, and of those only him and his 2 daughters survive, and then those two get him drunk, have sex with him, and father two children who go on to father nations that oppose Israel later. It could be successfully argued that the reason the cities are condemned for immorality is that Lot lost the Gospel and didn't do his duty - and since Southern Baptist churches are actually having discussions about what the gospel is right now - well, one could argue that those who want to say God will judge us all for homosexuality would do well to look in the mirror, for in the New Testament, if they'd pay attention to the eschatological narratives, the judgment of a nation and ultimately the world is ultimately contingent on the state of the covenant community - not the wickedness of "the world" however defined - which directly speaks to the statement Cathy made on the radio.
And right now, to cap it all off, we have people on the Right, many larding (literally and figuratively) the pews of conservative churches, who bitch and moan about taxes and helping poor people, while passing petitions to ban gay marriage and not lifting a finger to minister to the poor or needy or even share the Gospel personally with a homosexual. Some of them where I live call helping the poor "liberal social gospel" stuff and flat out ignore it. That would be precisely the sort of thing that Ezekiel has in mind when he talks about the sins of Sodom as he points his finger at Israel's guilt.
I'll add this too. The early church, the church of the first and second centuries - the ones that these folks often idolize so much, flourished under the foot of Rome, often under persecution. They fell apart and later Rome itself fell after church and state became intertwined. It never seems to occur to any of them that the revival for which they so earnestly pray may well happen if they got their collective butts out of politics and using it to do what they have failed to do via their pulpits, does it? The greatest revival they point to in history wasn't even the Reformation, or the First Great Awakening, certainly not the Finneyism of the Second - it was that first two centuries - under Nero and others. Think about that long and hard,. especially as they field a MORMON - a polytheist - for the presidency. Since when did polytheism become a Christian value? This is proof enough that they've lost the Gospel themselves, but, no, they will plow right on and not give it a second thought. That's because they don't believe the Gospel; they believe in moralism.
Here's the way I see it ... The U.S. is a free country. People have a right to free speech or eat whatever the fuck they want. BUT on the other hand, I can't see any valid reasons for condemning homosexuality or opposing gay marriage. Take away religion and you've got nothing.
The Reverend Gryff
The Reverend Gryff
Just so people are aware that this issue transcends the single issue of gay rights.
Here are the groups that Chick-Fil-A donates money to, and their agendas, which as you can see far exceed just opposing gay rights and extend into many, many different regressive areas:
Focus on the Family
The group supports the teaching of what it considers to be traditional family values. It advocates school sponsored prayer and supports corporal punishment. It strongly opposes LGBT rights, abortion, pornography, legalized gambling, and pre-marital and extramarital sexual activity.
Family Research Council
It advocates against LGBT rights, abortion, divorce, embryonic stem-cell research, the theory that global warming is the result of human activity, and pornography.
FRC is listed as a Hate Group by the Southern Poverty Law Center. The Family Research Council's Senior Researcher for Policy Studies Peter Sprigg was criticized when he, in his official capacity as a fellow of the FRC, stated that gay behavior should be outlawed and that "criminal sanctions against homosexual behavior" should be enforced.
Eagle Forum
Led by noted anti-feminist Phyllis Schlafly, the Eagle Forum is notorious for it's opposition to equal rights for women and it's advocacy for the role of women in society as "full-time homemakers." Eagle Forum is also part of the anti-vaccination movement.
These groups just aren't anti-gay, some of them are anti-woman's rights, anti-vaccine, anti-science, pro-Creationism, and pro-Christian Dominionism. They fight not just against gay rights, but against legalized gambling, pornography, stem cell research, even divorce.
Here are the groups that Chick-Fil-A donates money to, and their agendas, which as you can see far exceed just opposing gay rights and extend into many, many different regressive areas:
Focus on the Family
The group supports the teaching of what it considers to be traditional family values. It advocates school sponsored prayer and supports corporal punishment. It strongly opposes LGBT rights, abortion, pornography, legalized gambling, and pre-marital and extramarital sexual activity.
Family Research Council
It advocates against LGBT rights, abortion, divorce, embryonic stem-cell research, the theory that global warming is the result of human activity, and pornography.
FRC is listed as a Hate Group by the Southern Poverty Law Center. The Family Research Council's Senior Researcher for Policy Studies Peter Sprigg was criticized when he, in his official capacity as a fellow of the FRC, stated that gay behavior should be outlawed and that "criminal sanctions against homosexual behavior" should be enforced.
Eagle Forum
Led by noted anti-feminist Phyllis Schlafly, the Eagle Forum is notorious for it's opposition to equal rights for women and it's advocacy for the role of women in society as "full-time homemakers." Eagle Forum is also part of the anti-vaccination movement.
These groups just aren't anti-gay, some of them are anti-woman's rights, anti-vaccine, anti-science, pro-Creationism, and pro-Christian Dominionism. They fight not just against gay rights, but against legalized gambling, pornography, stem cell research, even divorce.
Knight Templar
Commodore
Except that you can't just "take away religion".
I believe strongly in "freedom of association".
In that vein, people should be able to hire or not hired whomever they want regardless of the reasons.
Sell, rent or provide services or deny those services to whomever they want regardless of the reasons.
For starters.
This. Some of the comments here have been sickening, "fast food before gays 'cause I gotta eat!". Are you fucking kidding me?
I want to comment on the debate of "is it a choice" cause I think a lot of people misunderstand what Christians mean when we say it's a choice.
I do not deny that you can be born with homosexual tendencies. I do fully believe you can be born with homosexual tendencies, just as you can be born with heterosexual tendencies. So flat out, I understand people are born certain ways, with certain tendencies. In that vein, it is not a choice.
What I mean by choice, is if the individual chooses to follow that path and commit the acts associated with the tendencies. For example, it is a choice to kiss someone of the same sex, it is a choice to have sex with someone of the same sex, it is a choice to marry someone of the same sex. All of these things are choices we make, I don't see how that can be disputed.
Therefore, while you may feel homosexual tendencies, all the actions you perform are choices you clearly make. Just as you can make the choice to kiss someone of the same sex, have sex with them, or get married, you can also make the opposite choice. You can chose not to kiss someone of the same sex, and chose not to have sex with them, and chose not to marry them. All of your actions are choices you make. Most people are in control of their actions and purposeful make choices.
How you live your life is all about choice, and you can chose to follow that path, or you can chose not to.
That is what we mean by choice.
NebulaClassGuy
Lieutenant Commander
I'm utterly amazed this thread hasn't been closed yet, but while it's still open, I'll address something that's actually on topic, regarding the calls to ban Chick-fil-A from opening stores in a given city. I found the two items below:
http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/186426/aclu-sides-with-chick-fil-a-on-proposed-restaurant-openings/
http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/186426/aclu-sides-with-chick-fil-a-on-proposed-restaurant-openings/
Obviously it isn't, otherwise you wouldn't have a problem with giving them the right to abide by their own choice.
Really?
Knight Templar
Commodore
I agree with Brent.
And people who deny that people can "choose" or "not to choose" to perform homosexual acts, they forget "situational homosexuality" (prisons, and other times where people of the same sex are isolated) which obviously involved people "choosing".
And people who deny that people can "choose" or "not to choose" to perform homosexual acts, they forget "situational homosexuality" (prisons, and other times where people of the same sex are isolated) which obviously involved people "choosing".
I can still have a problem with them making that choice, and they can still make that choice. I have no power to stop anyone from making those choices. I have the freedom to speak out on it, and this being America I NEVER want to lose that freedom to speak out, I love our freedom of speech. God will deal with it all in the end, everyone will have to explain their lives to him, me included. He deemed it a sin, and I follow Gods will above my own.
So it's okay to be gay as long as you never act on it? Well, I hope homosexuals enjoy being lonely their entire lives.
Good for them, thumbs up, glad to see them trying to stand up for what's right
Really?
Yeah, I don't remember Brent being this big a bigot.
Good for them, thumbs up, glad to see them trying to stand up for what's right
Really?
Yeah, I don't remember Brent being this big a bigot.
Apply a name, a label to me if you must, I know it makes you all feel better. I'm not afraid to be called names for these beliefs, heck, Jesus was nailed to the cross because of the things he said. If he can bare that for our sins, I can certainly bare being labeled a bigot.
