Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and discuss

[superdeluxe]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

Ryan and Ryan talk about Game of thrones with special Guest Alyssa Rosenberg:

http://web.me.com/mcgeeryan/The_Pod_Squad/Talking_TV_with_Ryan_and_Ryan/rss.xml

I wish they would have spent more time talking about the show instead of the what is written in the books, though. I'm not a fan of this Alyssa, based in this.

There are other podcasts that focus more on the tv show.

 

[PsychoPere]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

[...] the whole business of making Renly gay and thus bringing a whole new character arc has made him and his bunch a lot deeper and more sympathetic).

Renly was already gay in the books.

This is true, but I'd argue it wasn't fleshed out as well, due to Renly not having any POV chapters.

That is indeed a good point. It does seem to matter much more here than it did in the books, since we only ever heard about it from third parties in the books.

 

[Hyperspace05]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

Ryan and Ryan talk about Game of thrones with special Guest Alyssa Rosenberg:

http://web.me.com/mcgeeryan/The_Pod_Squad/Talking_TV_with_Ryan_and_Ryan/rss.xml

I wish they would have spent more time talking about the show instead of the what is written in the books, though. I'm not a fan of this Alyssa, based in this.

There are other podcasts that focus more on the tv show.

I know, and I subscribe to most of them already. But I want a TV show review from TV show reviewers. Mo & Alyssa's book knowledge does not impress me either, so I would prefer them spending more time discussing the show, not talk about themes of the book which may or may not be adapted in a satisfying manner. The themes of the show is what matters when discussing the show.

 

[Lonemagpie]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

[...] the whole business of making Renly gay and thus bringing a whole new character arc has made him and his bunch a lot deeper and more sympathetic).

Renly was already gay in the books.

It was implied - perhaps I should have said "overtly gay" but I'd been coming in from a discussion about Willow in BTVS...

There's a big difference between Renly in the book simply being more often in the company of Loras, and mentioning that all he needs Margaery for is to put a baby in her at some point before he can carry on the rest of his life, and him being shown snogging Loras with Margaery saying "yeah, you can pretend I'm my brother..." etc. The latter actually gives him (and her!) a character

 

[Aeolusdallas]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

[...] the whole business of making Renly gay and thus bringing a whole new character arc has made him and his bunch a lot deeper and more sympathetic).

Renly was already gay in the books.

It was implied - perhaps I should have said "overtly" but I'd been coming in from a discussion about Willow in BTVS...

There's a big difference between Renly in the book simply being more often in the company of Loras, and mentioning that all he needs Margaery for is to put a baby in her at some point before he can carry on the rest of his life, and him being shown snogging Loras with Margaery saying "yeah, you can pretend I'm my brother..." etc. The latter actually gives him (and her!) a character

Well it's more ov ert on the show but it's not just implied in the books. It's stated by several characters at several times. Just obliquely.
Jamie, Tyrion, Littlefinger and Loras himself all mention it.

 

[Lonemagpie]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

[

Well it's more ov ert on the show but it's not just implied in the books. It's stated by several characters at several times. Just obliquely.

Yes... obliquely = implied

 

[Aeolusdallas]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

[

Well it's more ov ert on the show but it's not just implied in the books. It's stated by several characters at several times. Just obliquely.

Yes... obliquely = implied

No not implied, just stated in a subtle way. They are not the same thing.

 

[Hyperspace05]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

Here's a good link with the collected evidence from the book about Renly/Loras: (caution, SPOILERS for the books)
http://www.angelfire.com/ma4/mlarchives/faq/lorasrenly.html

It is pretty darn obvious. But since neither Renly nor Loras are POV characters, it is natural that we don't see detail.

 

[Out Of My Vulcan Mind]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

Bryan Cogman, who wrote this episode, did a long interview with Streamin' Garage:

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XCNLs8_cHw&feature=player_embedded[/yt]

 

[Lonemagpie]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

Maybe I should just stop preferring this version of Renly and turn to the homophobic side and complain about it all, if it's going to be this much hassle to like it...

 

[Aeolusdallas]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

Maybe I should just stop preferring this version of Renly and turn to the homophobic side and complain about it all, if it's going to be this much hassle to like it...

I think everyone here who has posted likes this version of Renly better. We just don't understand why you keep saying "implied". When it's not implied just subtle.

 

[Venardhi]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

I for one don't like this version better. Renly was confident and glib in addition to being full of himself and, most importantly, someone you could believe that men would turn to purely on the strength of his personality. This Renly, ignoring all the stuff that happens in private even, feels as much like a boy playing king as Joffrey does.

Brienne also seems to have lost her awkwardness, naivete and insecurity, but hopefully that is just for the introduction and they'll peel away her shell in a later episode.

 

[Hyperspace05]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

Well I think the Renly characterization has been problematic from the start - in season 1. His season 2 persona is far better and "more kingly".

But that is separate from the opinion on whether or not one approves of how the Renly/Loras relationship is portrayed. I happen to like it. A far better scene this episode compared to the shaving/BJ scene last season.

Is it a subtle relationship like the book? No - But that subtlety only exists because neither Renly nor Loras are POV character. Can you imagine the explicit descriptions GRRM would have used if either of them were POVs? He is far from a prude when it comes to POV sexual relationships. ('fat pink masts', 'aching loins', and other choice words)

 

[Klaus]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

can't really argue w/that...

 

[InklingStar]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

Renly's position in the game of thrones is fascinating. He is not a warrior like Robert, nor is the crown his by right like Stannis. Yet he outclasses both with the trappings of power, as discussed in the conversation between Varys and Tyrion. He marries the daughter of one of the most powerful houses in the realm, leads the largest army in the realm, and walks around as if he really is the king. He wears his crown, presides over his tournaments, and pretty much looks the part. There is no question in the minds of his people that he is and should be king on the Iron Throne.

 

[137th Gebirg]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

^^^ Hence Varys' earlier riddle about the perception of power in men's eyes. Not only does Renly know the answer to the riddle, he's putting it into practical motion.

 

[superdeluxe]

Re: Game of Thrones 2.3 - "What Is Dead May Never Die" - Rate and disc

Ratings are in for Game of THrones:

http://www.variety.com/article/VR1118052931?refCatId=14

Spring tends to sap the ratings strength of just about every show, but some -- including HBO's "Game of Thrones" -- are holding up better than most.

After kicking off its second season with a series-best 3.8 million viewers, the lavish fantasy epic proceeded to deliver about the same number of viewers with each of its three subsequent episodes, according to Nielsen estimates.

This in itself is impressive, as daylight-saving time, school breaks and other spring distractions conspire to drag down the ratings for even TV's biggest hits at this time of year. Also, most shows tend to see ratings declines following their premieres, no matter what time of year.

But for the week of April 9-15, "Game of Thrones" also achieved another impressive feat as it stood as cable's top-rated scripted primetime program for the week in both total viewers and adults 18-49 (see chart, left), topping the likes of FX's "Justified" and AMC's "Mad Men." This despite the fact that HBO is available in roughly 30 million homes, compared with basic-cable biggies like USA and TNT that are available in 100 million or more homes.

HBO isn't necessarily in the ratings game -- the pay cabler cares more about supplying its subscribers with satisfying programming than how a program draws on any single night -- but it can use the initial telecast of any show to garner interest. And "Throne's" average audience for the Sunday 9 p.m. airings this spring (3.8 million) is up about 50% from a year ago (2.3 million).

Looking only at HBO homes, "Thrones" is averaging an 8.3 rating, meaning roughly one in 12 subscriber households is watching the premiere telecast. This is about what TV's most-watched Sunday series, "60 Minutes," was averaging this month.

Of course, nearly everybody who watches the CBS newsmag does so on Sunday night, while HBO gives fans of "Thrones" numerous chances to watch the show every week. If you count the dozen replays on HBO (including two immediately following the initial Sunday telecast) and the network's on-demand service, the show's gross audience surpasses 11 million, compared with 9.3 million for its rookie season, HBO says.