Titanic - 100th Anniversary of The Disaster

[Candlelight]

Big festival on tomorrow in Cobh county cork Ireland tomorrow for the anniversary.

Cobh is the last port it sailed out of, My wife and her mother are going to cobh for the day, no interest myself( I live in cork ireland in case ye are wondering)

I have friends in Limerick. Would love to come visit your country.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

I must be the only one to whom this whole thing feels rather morbid.

 

[Amaris]

I must be the only one to whom this whole thing feels rather morbid.

It was a landmark event in history. Just as when we study the Civil War here in the U.S., we learn the lessons from these tragedies, and the details that surround them are fascinating to study. Those people are long since dead, even the survivors have now all passed on. There is nothing morbid about it, really. It has become our history, and it is wise to study that history.

 

[scotpens]

I'm also usually humored by various "what if" stories on how it could've been possible for everyone to survive . . . The "best" idea I recall seeing is tying all of the life-boats together in a ring and in the center of the ring placing as many deck chairs, tables, and other floatable material in the center and further connecting everything together. The "idea" being those who couldn't fit in the boats would be able to survive on the pile of material in the center of the ring.

In the highly unlikely event of there being enough time and enough passengers and crew with the presence of mind to carry out such a plan, it’s just possible it could have worked, considering the sea was dead calm and practically as smooth as glass.

Then there's ideas on what would have happened if the ship simply hit the berg head-on. Yeah it was going 20-25 knots at the time and would've knocked everyone onboard around, caused some injuries, but the ship's structure likely would've fared better and it may have made it to New York.

Had Titanic hit the iceberg head-on, her bow would have been crushed and mangled, much like what happened to the Swedish liner Stockholm when it collided with the Andrea Doria in 1956.

Passengers unfortunate enough to be belowdecks in that section would have been killed or badly injured. But, with the rest of her watertight compartments unbreached, the ship would have remained afloat and could probably have continued the voyage under her own power (at greatly reduced speed, of course).

Sure you could save 1500 lives but how many more could've been lost in the future? Titanic ended the romantic notion of ocean travel; had it not occured then even bigger ships might've been built, and more lives lost.

Bigger ships were built, but under the much tighter safety regulations you mentioned. And the romance of transatlantic ocean travel didn’t really end until the advent of the jet age. When the number of travelers crossing the Atlantic by air exceeded the number crossing by ship (around 1960, I believe), the shipping lines began concentrating on cruises rather than serving the North Atlantic route.

 

[MacLeod]

How the ship broke-up and foundered has always been a fascinating topic to me too because there's so many theories out there and for decades after the disaster it was accepted Titanic went down in one piece that is, of course, until the wreck was found in two pieces, separated by half-a-mile, with the stern facing away from the direction of travel and in much, much, worse shape.

Then when you look at the bow's condition it's "remarkably" good but then you notice that the part the broke off that the decks are compressed and I don't think I've seen much to explain why this is. The recent Cameron special re-examining the sinking thinks it was due to a down burst of water-pressure compressing the decks but I've seen theories that when the ship split the bow actually rose a bit or the stern was trying to stay a float more and the decks were compressed at or above sea-level as essentially the stern crumpled them as it struggled to stay afloat.

How the ship broke-up and finally sank (including making the descent to the sea-floor) is just a fascinating series of questions that can never be answered.

I'm also usually humored by various "what if" stories on how it could've been possible for everyone to survive. Most of these scenarios often involving most if not all of the people on the ship to work through social and class barriers, accept that the ship was sinking (something people didn't think was really going to happen in the first place) and to make a plan and to execute it. The "best" idea I recall seeing is tying all of the life-boats together in a ring and in the center of the ring placing as many deck chairs, tables, and other float-able material in the center and further connecting everything together. The "idea" being those who couldn't fit in the boats would be able to survive on the pile of material in the center of the ring.

The Cameron special threw out there the idea that Titanic should've tried steaming towards the nearby Carpathia -closing the gap between the ships. (Though many of the experts weren't sure if this would have been a wise thing to do.) Then there's ideas on what would have happened if the ship simply hit the berg head-on. Yeah it was going 20-25 knots at the time and would've knocked everyone onboard around, caused some injuries, but the ship's structure likely would've faired better and it may have made it to New York.

It was the California which was nearby not the Carpathia which was something 4 hours away. As for sailing towards it given hindsight it would have been an idea. But that's a 100 years later knowing which ship was there rather than some lights which could be seen from Titanic.

What could have been changed easily enough was actually filling the lifeboats to capicity. Wouldn't have saved everyone but several hundred could have easily been saved

 

[Candlelight]

How the ship broke-up and foundered has always been a fascinating topic to me too because there's so many theories out there and for decades after the disaster it was accepted Titanic went down in one piece that is, of course, until the wreck was found in two pieces, separated by half-a-mile, with the stern facing away from the direction of travel and in much, much, worse shape.

Then when you look at the bow's condition it's "remarkably" good but then you notice that the part the broke off that the decks are compressed and I don't think I've seen much to explain why this is. The recent Cameron special re-examining the sinking thinks it was due to a down burst of water-pressure compressing the decks but I've seen theories that when the ship split the bow actually rose a bit or the stern was trying to stay a float more and the decks were compressed at or above sea-level as essentially the stern crumpled them as it struggled to stay afloat.

How the ship broke-up and finally sank (including making the descent to the sea-floor) is just a fascinating series of questions that can never be answered.

Well, after 2am the bow was now extremely heavy, having mostly filled with water. The stern rising out of the water was largely filled with air rushing from the flooded areas, which added to it's buoyancy. The natural weak spot near the engines, not to mention the 1000-odd people crowded on the stern, contributed to the ship breaking in two.

The collapse of the aft deck plates on the bow section was probably due to the impact on the bottom of the ocean. I don't doubt though that the tearing of the hull must've caused some significant damage.

The fact the ship broke in half had always been disputed well before Ballard found the ship in 1985. Archibald Gracie was adamant that the ship went down in one piece, while other survivor accounts indicated the ship broke in half. I guess the movies at the time helped shape the public opinion that the ship went down intact (I think the first movie to show the ship breaking up wasn't until 1996 iirc).

 

[Warped9]

This thread is an interesting read in itself.

I can't recall exactly when I became fascinated with the Titanic although I'm not really a buff or collector of Titanic memorabilia.

I dimly remember seeing television reruns of A Night To Remember, The Unsinkable Molly Brown and the Time Tunnel episode way, way back in the '60s and early '70s. I also recall a collection of encyclopedias at home that featured the disaster along with some eerie (to my youthful mind) images. Sometime in the mid '70s I signed out the book A Night To Remember from my high school library and thats when my fascination really gelled I think.

Since then I've seen quite a few versions of the tragedy on film, on television and read several books. At the time I was quite interested in Clive Cussler's novel which I thought was b.s. even as I enjoyed the story. The film adaptation was mediocre except for the footage of the actual raising---quite a spectacle even if it's all b.s.

But through it all it's an amazing story and I'm always hungry to hear new tidbits of information come to light. I was absolutely enthralled when Robert Ballard found the wreck in 1985 and I ate up every piece of news that came to light. I remember being on a bus on the way to work and seeing the first news on the cover of a newspaper someone else was reading. I got my own copy of the paper as soon as I got off the bus. Some years later I went to a special Titanic exhibit at the Royal Ontario Museum in Toronto where they had this huge and magnificent model of the ship surrounding by fascinating photos and images. There was also this stirring illustration depicting how deep the wreck lay compared with the height of the CN Tower.

To this day I still like the 1958 film A Night To Remember as well as appreciate James Cameron's 1997 film as recounting the story from different perspectives even if they both take liberties with historical fact. I doubt there will ever be a film or creative work that will rely strictly on the facts simply because so many facts remain unknown and people can't resist putting their own stamp on things.

Whenever the subject comes up I can't help but reflect on what it must have been like for some to look out into the dark from the tilting deck and shiver in the cold air knowing you would soon feel that freezing water enveloping you. To know that you had just been cut off from all your tomorrows...

 

[RandyS]

I must be the only one to whom this whole thing feels rather morbid.

It was a landmark event in history. Just as when we study the Civil War here in the U.S., we learn the lessons from these tragedies, and the details that surround them are fascinating to study. Those people are long since dead, even the survivors have now all passed on. There is nothing morbid about it, really. It has become our history, and it is wise to study that history.

Exactly. "those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it", and all that.

And anyway, if we worried about the dead, and let that control us, the very concept of history would not exist.

Besides, I love history, and the Titanic story, like our Civil and Revolutionary wars, is an endlessly fascinating story.

 

[beamMe]

Then there's ideas on what would have happened if the ship simply hit the berg head-on. Yeah it was going 20-25 knots at the time and would've knocked everyone onboard around, caused some injuries, but the ship's structure likely would've fared better and it may have made it to New York.

Had Titanic hit the iceberg head-on, her bow would have been crushed and mangled, much like what happened to the Swedish liner Stockholm when it collided with the Andrea Doria in 1956.

Passengers unfortunate enough to be belowdecks in that section would have been killed or badly injured. But, with the rest of her watertight compartments unbreached, the ship would have remained afloat and could probably have continued the voyage under her own power (at greatly reduced speed, of course).

It would also have killed all the members of the crew who had their cabins in that part of the ship.

 

[Trekker4747]

All these times I have are adjusted from "Titanic Time" (the time on the ship as determined by sun/celestial navigation) to modern day time, including DST. Times are Eastern Daylight Time.

April 14, 1912:
11:07 PM - Titanic's lookouts spot the iceberg, the order is given to "port 'round" the iceberg but it still hits and the ship begins to take on water.

11:52 PM -After a ship inspection by officers and the ship's architect it's determined the ship will sink, orders are given to start evacuation.

April 15, 1912
12:12 AM - The first signal rocket is launched along with the first lifeboat (#7) there are 28 people, the boat can support 65.

12:22 AM - Lifeboats #5 and #6 (41 and 28, respectively in 65-person capacity boats.)

12:27 AM - Lifeboat #3 (40/65)

12:37 AM - Lifeboat #8 (35/65)

12:39 AM - Lifeboat #1 (12/40)

12:47 AM - Lifeboats #9 (56/65),#10 (55/65). Last distress rocket launched.

12:51 AM - Lifeboats #11 (70/65), #12 (43/65), #14 (60/65)

12:57 AM - Lifeboats #13 (65/65), #15 (70/65)

01:02 AM - Lifeboat #16 (56/65)

01:07 AM - Collapsible Lifeboat C launches. 40 of possible 47 on board.

01:12 AM - Lifeboat #2 (25/40)

01:22 AM - Lifeboat #4 (40/65)

01:32 AM - Collapsible D (44/47). Water is at the bridge.

01:37 AM - Last distress signal is sent, essentially saying it's every man for himself.

01:44 AM - Collapsibles A and B float off the ship. A's sides aren't properly raised and is swamped. 30 people would attempt to survive on it and 12 would make it. B floats off the ship upside-down, dozens of people would climb on it and attempt to stay there until dawn when rescue arrived, 28 would survive.

01:45 AM - Titanic's lights flicker and finally go off for good just before the #1 funnel breaks off. The ship's stern continues to rise before the stress on the keel is too much and the ship breaks in two.

April 15, 1912 - 1:46 AM EDT (Adjusted/estimated from "Titanic Time" in 1912.) Titanic has sunk and is making its way to the ocean floor where she will not be discovered until September 1, 1985. 1,557 men, women, and children would succumb to exposure due to the frigid waters of the North Atlantic within minutes. The 705 people in the boats (or rescued from the water/overturned boats) would be picked up by the Carpathia and arrive in New York City three days later.

 

[Candlelight]

All these times I have are adjusted from "Titanic Time" (the time on the ship as determined by sun/celestial navigation) to modern day time, including DST. Times are Eastern Daylight Time.

April 14, 1912:
11:07 PM - Titanic's lookout spot the iceberg, the order is given to "port 'round" the iceberg but it still hits and the ship begins to take on water.

11:52 PM -After a ship inspection by officers and the ship's architect it's determined the ship will sink, orders are given to start evacuation.

April 15, 1912
12:12 AM - The first signal rocket is launched along with the first lifeboat #7. There are 28 people, the boat can support 65.

12:22 AM - Lifeboats #5 and #6 (41 and 28, respectively in 65-person capacity boats.)

12:27 AM - Lifeboat #3 (40/65)

12:37 AM - Lifeboat #8 (35/65)

12:39 AM - Lifeboat #1 (12/40)

12:47 AM - Lifeboats #9 (56, 65),#10 (55/65). Last distress rocket launched.

12:51 AM - Lifeboats #11 (70/65), #12 (43/65), #14 (60/65)

12:57 AM - Lifeboats #13 (65/65), #15 (70/65)

01:02 AM - Lifeboat #16 (56/65)

01:07 AM - Collapsible Lifeboat C launches. 40 of possible 47 on board/

01:12 AM - Lifeboat #2 (25/40)

01:22 AM - Lifeboat #4 (40/65)

01:32 AM - Collapsible D (44/47). Water is at the bridge.

01:37 AM - Last distress signal is sent, essentially saying it's every man for himself.

01:44 AM - Collapsibles A and B float off the ship. A's sides aren't properly raises and is swamped 30 people would attempt to survive on it and 12 would make it. B floats off the ship upside-down, dozens of people would climb on it and attempt to stay there until dawn when rescue arrived, 28 would survive.

01:45 AM - Titanic's lights flicker and finally go off for good just before the #1 funnel breaks off. The ship's stern continues to rise before the stress on the keel is too much and the ship breaks in two.

April 15, 1912 - 1:46 AM EDT (Adjusted/estimated from "Titanic Time" in 1912.) Titanic has sunk and is making its way to the ocean floor where she will not be discovered until July 1, 1985. 1,557 men, women, and children would succumb to exposure due to the frigid waters of the North Atlantic within minutes. The 705 people in the boats (or rescued from the water/overturned boats) would be picked up by the Carpathia and arrive in New York City three days later.

If Eastern Daylight Time is New York then you're off by an hour; Titanic Time was 93 minutes ahead, which puts the sinking at 12.47am.

If it's not, ignore this post.

Wikipedia says 122 minutes. Grrr.

 

[Candlelight]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/6745180/Kiwis-re-enact-last-supper

A century after the Titanic met with disaster Kiwis have gathered to re-enact the ship's last supper.
The elaborate last meal served to the ship's first class passengers on April 14, 1912, was recreated for 90 guests in an eight-course dinner.
The commemorative event was held at Wellington's James Cook Hotel Grand Chancellor last night.
The meal began with oysters before guests dined on consommé olga and cream of barley soup, poached salmon darnes, chicken lyonnaise, seared duck, roasted quail, waldorf puddings and peaches in chartreuse jelly.
Speakers included Caroline Aliaga-Kelly, whose grandfather perished aboard the Titanic while her grandmother survived.

The two people in the photo are friends of mine; the guy I currently work with (and who found the info on Captain Smith playing cricket, which I posted a couple of days ago).

 

[Trekker4747]

All these times I have are adjusted from "Titanic Time" (the time on the ship as determined by sun/celestial navigation) to modern day time, including DST. Times are Eastern Daylight Time.

April 14, 1912:
11:07 PM - Titanic's lookout spot the iceberg, the order is given to "port 'round" the iceberg but it still hits and the ship begins to take on water.

11:52 PM -After a ship inspection by officers and the ship's architect it's determined the ship will sink, orders are given to start evacuation.

April 15, 1912
12:12 AM - The first signal rocket is launched along with the first lifeboat #7. There are 28 people, the boat can support 65.

12:22 AM - Lifeboats #5 and #6 (41 and 28, respectively in 65-person capacity boats.)

12:27 AM - Lifeboat #3 (40/65)

12:37 AM - Lifeboat #8 (35/65)

12:39 AM - Lifeboat #1 (12/40)

12:47 AM - Lifeboats #9 (56, 65),#10 (55/65). Last distress rocket launched.

12:51 AM - Lifeboats #11 (70/65), #12 (43/65), #14 (60/65)

12:57 AM - Lifeboats #13 (65/65), #15 (70/65)

01:02 AM - Lifeboat #16 (56/65)

01:07 AM - Collapsible Lifeboat C launches. 40 of possible 47 on board/

01:12 AM - Lifeboat #2 (25/40)

01:22 AM - Lifeboat #4 (40/65)

01:32 AM - Collapsible D (44/47). Water is at the bridge.

01:37 AM - Last distress signal is sent, essentially saying it's every man for himself.

01:44 AM - Collapsibles A and B float off the ship. A's sides aren't properly raises and is swamped 30 people would attempt to survive on it and 12 would make it. B floats off the ship upside-down, dozens of people would climb on it and attempt to stay there until dawn when rescue arrived, 28 would survive.

01:45 AM - Titanic's lights flicker and finally go off for good just before the #1 funnel breaks off. The ship's stern continues to rise before the stress on the keel is too much and the ship breaks in two.

April 15, 1912 - 1:46 AM EDT (Adjusted/estimated from "Titanic Time" in 1912.) Titanic has sunk and is making its way to the ocean floor where she will not be discovered until July 1, 1985. 1,557 men, women, and children would succumb to exposure due to the frigid waters of the North Atlantic within minutes. The 705 people in the boats (or rescued from the water/overturned boats) would be picked up by the Carpathia and arrive in New York City three days later.

If Eastern Daylight Time is New York then you're off by an hour; Titanic Time was 93 minutes ahead, which puts the sinking at 12.47am.

If it's not, ignore this post.

Wikipedia says 122 minutes. Grrr.

What I read that it's 33min between "Titanic Time" and Eastern Time when you include Daylight Saving Time (which wasn't practiced in 1912) or it can be 50-minutes using a different crewman's timekeeping of events. (Lightoller's version has things 33 minutes ahead of Eastern Daylight Time.)

 

[Candlelight]

All these times I have are adjusted from "Titanic Time" (the time on the ship as determined by sun/celestial navigation) to modern day time, including DST. Times are Eastern Daylight Time.

April 14, 1912:
11:07 PM - Titanic's lookout spot the iceberg, the order is given to "port 'round" the iceberg but it still hits and the ship begins to take on water.

11:52 PM -After a ship inspection by officers and the ship's architect it's determined the ship will sink, orders are given to start evacuation.

April 15, 1912
12:12 AM - The first signal rocket is launched along with the first lifeboat #7. There are 28 people, the boat can support 65.

12:22 AM - Lifeboats #5 and #6 (41 and 28, respectively in 65-person capacity boats.)

12:27 AM - Lifeboat #3 (40/65)

12:37 AM - Lifeboat #8 (35/65)

12:39 AM - Lifeboat #1 (12/40)

12:47 AM - Lifeboats #9 (56, 65),#10 (55/65). Last distress rocket launched.

12:51 AM - Lifeboats #11 (70/65), #12 (43/65), #14 (60/65)

12:57 AM - Lifeboats #13 (65/65), #15 (70/65)

01:02 AM - Lifeboat #16 (56/65)

01:07 AM - Collapsible Lifeboat C launches. 40 of possible 47 on board/

01:12 AM - Lifeboat #2 (25/40)

01:22 AM - Lifeboat #4 (40/65)

01:32 AM - Collapsible D (44/47). Water is at the bridge.

01:37 AM - Last distress signal is sent, essentially saying it's every man for himself.

01:44 AM - Collapsibles A and B float off the ship. A's sides aren't properly raises and is swamped 30 people would attempt to survive on it and 12 would make it. B floats off the ship upside-down, dozens of people would climb on it and attempt to stay there until dawn when rescue arrived, 28 would survive.

01:45 AM - Titanic's lights flicker and finally go off for good just before the #1 funnel breaks off. The ship's stern continues to rise before the stress on the keel is too much and the ship breaks in two.

April 15, 1912 - 1:46 AM EDT (Adjusted/estimated from "Titanic Time" in 1912.) Titanic has sunk and is making its way to the ocean floor where she will not be discovered until July 1, 1985. 1,557 men, women, and children would succumb to exposure due to the frigid waters of the North Atlantic within minutes. The 705 people in the boats (or rescued from the water/overturned boats) would be picked up by the Carpathia and arrive in New York City three days later.

If Eastern Daylight Time is New York then you're off by an hour; Titanic Time was 93 minutes ahead, which puts the sinking at 12.47am.

If it's not, ignore this post.

Wikipedia says 122 minutes. Grrr.

What I read that it's 33min between "Titanic Time" and Eastern Time when you include Daylight Saving Time (which wasn't practiced in 1912) or it can be 50-minutes using a different crewman's timekeeping of events. (Lightoller's version has things 33 minutes ahead of Eastern Daylight Time.)

I just base it on (the Carpathia's) Captain Rostron's message to Haddock:

"... Titanic foundered at 2.20, 5.47 G.M.T. ..."

0547 GMT is 0047 New York.

 

[Trekker4747]

Yes, 5:47 GMT/12:47 EST.

But today the precise time there's an hour difference. If we practiced Daylight Saving time in 1912 then Titanic would've sank at 6:47 GMT, or 1:47 Eastern Daylight Time.

Since we practice Daylight Saving Time today then you need to adjust your time stamps to compensate. What happened at 11:00 then happens at 12:00 now because of DST. (Remember, 12:00 Daylight Time is "really" 11:00 Standard Time.)

 

[Candlelight]

Yes, 5:47 GMT/12:47 EST.

But today the precise time there's an hour difference. If we practiced Daylight Saving time in 1912 then Titanic would've sank at 6:47 GMT, or 1:47 Eastern Daylight Time.

Since we practice Daylight Saving Time today then you need to adjust your time stamps to compensate. What happened at 11:00 then happens at 12:00 now because of DST. (Remember, 12:00 Daylight Time is "really" 11:00 Standard Time.)

I figured out what you were on about AFTER I went for my walk...

That's frustrating cos "GMT" doesn't change for daylight saving (it becomes GMT +1).

I'll have to work it out again. For NZ it's either at 1547 (I've missed it), 1647 or 1747. Remember we're opposite Daylight Saving to you guys.

 

[Candlelight]

Well, the anniversary has come and gone. I looked back through some old photos of mine and found one from 1992 of me opening a Christmas present which contained a very large book on the Titanic. It was released for the 80th anniversary, and I remember thinking the 100th anniversary is so far away in 2012 and I would be 33 years old by then...

 

[MacLeod]

Yes, 5:47 GMT/12:47 EST.

But today the precise time there's an hour difference. If we practiced Daylight Saving time in 1912 then Titanic would've sank at 6:47 GMT, or 1:47 Eastern Daylight Time.

Since we practice Daylight Saving Time today then you need to adjust your time stamps to compensate. What happened at 11:00 then happens at 12:00 now because of DST. (Remember, 12:00 Daylight Time is "really" 11:00 Standard Time.)

I figured out what you were on about AFTER I went for my walk...

That's frustrating cos "GMT" doesn't change for daylight saving (it becomes GMT +1).

I'll have to work it out again. For NZ it's either at 1547 (I've missed it), 1647 or 1747. Remember we're opposite Daylight Saving to you guys.

No it doesn't GMT doesn't change at all, it is a constant time. in the UK during the summer BST (British Summer Time) is used which is one hour ahead of GMT. So at the time of writing this it is 10:36 BST (09:36 GMT)

 

[JRS]

The 100th anniversary of the sinking of the Titanic is being remembered at events across the world, including in the ship's birthplace Belfast.
A memorial service was held at the North Atlantic wreck site on cruise ship MS Balmoral, which is retracing the Titanic's route.
A minute's silence was held and wreaths cast into the sea at the moment it sank to honour the more than 1,500 deaths.
And a plaque featuring the names of those who died was unveiled in Belfast.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-17715345

I think the plague in Belfast was a very nice idea and a quite proper memorial to those who died.

Here is an interesting bit of a story to watch:

The families of a crewman and a countess who formed an unlikely friendship in one of Titanic's lifeboats have met for the first time 100 years after the ship sank.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-17680697

That watch is pretty unique item..as is the story that goes with it.
I am sure there are still some interesting stories to tell about the Titanic.

One of my teachers from basic school told me once, that she met a Finnish survivor from the Titanic, who happened to live in the same building at the time.
I cant confirm the story naturally, but it was interesting enough to hear.

 

[Trekker4747]

I'm not sure the plague is a good memorial for anything but I digress.