Work advice needed

[FPAlpha]

So a big change is in the works in my work life right now. Some basic information before:

I work for a logistics company which handles the logistics for a big german corporation and business is booming right now (maybe a bit too much boom as were almost stretched to the max with the volume that needs to be shipped and were no small company either).
Since last November i'be been attending evening school with the goal to expand my knowledge and in about 1,5 years i'll be done and have an additional degree.. long term goal is to advance professionally meaning a better position and pay.

Currently i do ok financially at my position though i could make more if i worked for a manufacturing company (one of the worlds biggest chemical companies has their HQ and main manufacturing centre in the neighboring town and they pay very well) and i've come to think if the time has come to make a change.. hopefully to the better.

I've talked with my bosses today about my future in the company and the talks went very well.. i've received praise and a commitment by them to keep me in the company as a) another colleague will leave soon and if left the department will be severely understaffed and b) because they are very pleased with me and like the quality of my work.

They've offered me a different position without nightshifts (something i "complained" about a little as one of the downsides currently.. i'm mid 30s and i don't take a nightshift as well as in my 20s), regular day work hours and the real possibility of further advancement since they have long term plans of expanding their facilities and offices in the region (but that's still quite a while off.. my estimate is at least 2 years before the new warehouse is built).

I've told them i'd think about it during my vacation which begins today and lasts for 2,5 weeks and give them my answer when i return.

My options are thus.. i have enough qualifications and work experience to find a new job somewhere closer to my place (i have a gas bill of around 200 Euro/270$ a month just to drive to/from work) which either pays the same or a good deal above to what i'm getting now and it probably won't take long as Germany's economy is in a pretty good state right now but i can't know for sure. At my current company i'll have a secure position with the prospects of advancing and maybe a payraise if i accept the offer (i don't know how much since we didn't talk actual numbers because i didn't accept yet).

What would you do or recommend in my place?

 

[iguana_tonante]

(i don't know how much since we didn't talk actual numbers because i didn't accept yet).

Have the numbers, then decide.

Beside that: do what makes you happy. A pay raise or a career advancement is meaningless if you hate your job or you work in a horrible atmosphere. What you must ask yourself is: do I like my job? Do I like my colleagues? My boss? Or are they insufferable fucks I'd rather see dead and dumped in a sewer? Work is such a large part of our life and takes the biggest slice of our day. Having fun (or at least, working in a pleasant place) is much more important than having a few bucks more in the bank but nursing a gastritis. (This given you don't need the rise to pay for mortgage or any extraordinary circumstances, but I got the feeling it's not the case here).

All in my opinion, obviously. YMMV.

 

[Captain Ice]

Without having the offer/salary information in hand, at the moment it would be hard for you to make an informed decision.

That being said, there are other factors to think about.

1. Do you like where you are working right now? Do you like your colleagues?

2. If you leave, where would you go? What do you actually know about the other companies in the area and what it is like to work for them?

3. If you change companies, how likely are you to get the shifts that you want (ie days)?

4. Are any of the companies involved likely to work with your school schedule?


Another thought.....if the only thing you really dislike about your current company is your commute, what is keeping you from moving somewhere closer to their location?

 

[FPAlpha]

The work climate is quite ok.. of course there's times when everybody is on edge a bit and there's the usual amount of sympathy/gossip/talking behind someone's back but i've encountered far worse and we do have fun and laugh with each other.. i'd rate it a good climate and like most of my colleagues.

A small perk of changing my position internally would be to get away from the bitch of hell as i like to call her.. a female colleague of mine who's moody as hell, sometimes crosses the line and has been talked to many times by our superiors and by the whole team. If she weren't this experienced and capable at her job she'd be long gone.

The thing is, and i've thought about it quite a bit, that i know it's not all roses in other companies too. They might pay quite a bit more but who knows how the team i'll be working in is as good as the one i'm having right now? Will it be worth sucking it up for a 30-50% higher wage (and that's not a typo.. i've got enough reports and sure information that this may be the range of service provider for a big company vs actually working for the big company).

Now since i don't know my actual new pay yet it's the one deciding factor.. i've done some preliminary number crunching and i believe that losing out on the nightshift bonus is well within the range of a pay raise (at least i think so) but it remains to be seen if the company feels like that too. The actual talk, should i consider taking up the offer, could be interesting because i've never actually been negotiation a salary from a rather strong point on my side.. i was either unemployed at the time at which you're likely to take the first decent job just to get off unemployment pay or i was too inexperienced to make big demands.

I just don't know.. it's a secure position with a normal, maybe mediocre pay (which i can get by quite ok but a bit more never hurt) with the potential to get ahead in a few years vs an unproven new place (which i didn't even apply to yet much less have gotten into) with a substantially higher pay and (i assume) even better possibilities to get ahead given the bigger size of the company.

It will most likely depend on what my company is willing to offer.. it could be between insulting to expected but i already set myself a limit, i.e. they'll have to at least compensate for the lost nightshift bonuses if they want to keep me. I don#t want to lose out financially in the long run and it'll be interesting to see how that topic will be approached.

One other thing since i'm at it.. how does one go about talking hard numbers? I know what i'd like to get but i also know that no company wants to pay more than they need to so there's always this gulf between the parties.. i don't know if i should just blurt out my number when they ask me first what they'd need to pay to keep me. I know they want me and i know they're a bit boxed in because me leaving so soon after my colleague does essentially puts them into a very difficult position because they can't find someone this fast to replace both of our experiences and knowledge or train up a new person within 1-2 months to our standard (and this is with vacation season starting up not too far away). I've no desire for power plays or boxing them in and squeezing them till they cry uncle so how can i divert or manage it so they reveal their offer first? Any experience in that?

 

[Captain Ice]

I can see where you are coming from.

One thing you might consider is going ahead and applying for the job with the other company. Just because you've applied for the position doesn't mean that you have to accept the position if offered. Think of it as cultivating your opportunities.

 

[Captain_Nick]

That's a fair point. If they don't offer you a job, there is no dilemma

 

[Holdfast]

You need more data before you can decide, esp. the numbers.

One other thing since i'm at it.. how does one go about talking hard numbers? I know what i'd like to get but i also know that no company wants to pay more than they need to so there's always this gulf between the parties..

How to approach the discussion depends most on your firm's culture. That should override any advice. Having said that...

As a general rule, once there's a clear outline of the role you'll be moving into, you should be able to research what someone of equivalent experience in the industry gets in that role. Research it, and have evidence to support this. If it's a role within the same company, given you work there already and have received good appraisals, you should be able to place a low-risk premium on your price as the employer knows exactly what they are getting by promoting/moving you instead of getting someone new, and they need to spend less time/money training someone new. 10-15% (maybe 20 if you're feeling aggressive) extra beyond the accepted price for someone in that role with the same experience isn't a bad starting point for negotiations, though expect that you'll end up at about a 5-10% premium, unless you bring an exceptionally high value skill set to the table.

Again, this is all generic advice. The exact industry, role, and company all make a BIG difference to your negotiating stance.

 

[bigdaddy]

You can always look for a new job at a new company after you take the new job at the current company.

I have a job paying over $11 doing retail BS. I saw that job not going anywhere after they passed on me, without a fucking interview, for a job in my field of study that 15 people in the building said I should have. A job that the woman who was stepping down said I should have had. I started looking for new work right away, and got one. It's 200 miles away, I'll be living with a roommate for a first time (they have housing onsite) and have a bunch of housemates in a very expensive part of the state, making only $10 an hour. However it's in my field of study and 10 minutes from the beach. I'm scared of on my mind, but if you aren't scared at times you aren't trying. The worst thing that can happen to me is I fail and fall flat on my face. I'm young enough to be at a place I don't care if that happens.

You only have one life, live it, take the chance.

 

[FPAlpha]

Nothing personal but i'd rather not be an ass, take their offer whatever it may be and secretly look for a better one.. they've been honest to me, i'm honest to them and it's currently fair on both sides and there are no hard feelings on either side.

The only thing currently on my mind is that right now i'm on vacation and can't apply to new companies.. i'd like to apply as soon as i get back and have an updated resume and only when i know if there's a chance at the other company to get in and see what they're offering can i make a choice what happens next.

I just don't want to string them along and make them think they are second choice or a fall back option because that would put a dent in my time there.

Maybe i'm too nice in the work environment but that's how i roll.. be honest and fair to me and you'll get the same.

 

[MacLeod]

I'm reminded of the saying "The Grass is always greener on the other side" yes the other job might seem better, but is it. If you take it you might start to thing that your should have stayed in your current job.