Tomorrow when I wake up, I am going to prove that anything is better than Terra Nova when I try, and I stress TRY, to watch the complete run of Dinotopia.
'Terra Nova' Renewal Could Depend On Mid-Season Flop
- Thread starter Snick27
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How could Zoe have been an unplanned child in a future where third children are illegal, people know the rules, and contraception is not only well-established but probably more advanced than today by necessity, and probably mandatory. One would imagine that a woman would be required by law to have her tubes tied after her second child or some such totalitarian tactic.
Of course the writing on the rest of the show didn't have much thought put into it either, so why should we expect the setup to be well-thought-out.
Of course the writing on the rest of the show didn't have much thought put into it either, so why should we expect the setup to be well-thought-out.
So people who want an extra kid should, what, not have an extra kid until they campaign to repeal laws that their advocacy likely wouldn't effect?
And can we therefore assume that any law you do not publically and activately work to appeal is a law you basically support?
So it makes more sense that they decided to purposely flout the law so they could then live in fear of being discovered the rest of their lives?
In any case, the fact they decided to have another kid hardly makes them horrible, immoral people. Yeah they probably deserve to be fined (much as people are in China), but they shouldn't be regarded as "criminals".
^^ Well, that's my problem with the parents: They are unapologetic criminals. In an overpopulated, resource-depleted world where a limit has been placed on reproduction, they chose to have an additional child. It wasn't an accident and there were no other extenuating circumstances; they just went to the "baby underground" because they decided the rules only apply to lesser people. Then, when they were caught, the father assaulted a cop (even though there were apparently no consequences to having an extra baby, since the mother got to keep her) and was sent to jail. So what did they do? They broke him out of jail and arranged for him to illegally use time travel to escape. It's amusing that these are considered role-model parents on a family drama.
Its my understanding that they took the little girl away...
^^ Well, that's my problem with the parents: They are unapologetic criminals. In an overpopulated, resource-depleted world where a limit has been placed on reproduction, they chose to have an additional child. It wasn't an accident and there were no other extenuating circumstances; they just went to the "baby underground" because they decided the rules only apply to lesser people. Then, when they were caught, the father assaulted a cop (even though there were apparently no consequences to having an extra baby, since the mother got to keep her) and was sent to jail. So what did they do? They broke him out of jail and arranged for him to illegally use time travel to escape. It's amusing that these are considered role-model parents on a family drama.
Its my understanding that they took the little girl away...
No. Despite it being illegal to have a third child, the only real penalty is a fine. Since the Shannons are implied to be well off, this isn't really much of a punishment. Jim was arrested and convicted for beating the cop who inspected their home.
However, because she was an illegal third child, Zoe was not permitted to join the rest of the family through the portal to Terra Nova, which is why Jim and Elizabeth had to smuggle her through the portal in the pilot.
They were going to raise that kid in a cupboard because they were too cheap to pay a fine, which more equates to a fee if you really think about the lack of ancillary punitive measures?
A "fee" they must have paid or the child would have been taken away/destroyed.
For the energy involved to send some one back, say it cost a billion dollars, you know like sending some into orbit, where every pound equals x amount of dollars.
Does that mean that Hope plaza spent an extra two billion dollars sending the additional shannons back? Or did Hope Plaza run out of juice when the the last two people thought it was their turn to go being in time? Hopefully they "didn't run out of Juice" half way through a person.
Taylor should have shot both of them the minute he found out that they were stowaways, you know if he wasn't at war with the future who was trying to destroy him, and suddenly they wee the only two people he could trust.
A "fee" they must have paid or the child would have been taken away/destroyed.
For the energy involved to send some one back, say it cost a billion dollars, you know like sending some into orbit, where every pound equals x amount of dollars.
Does that mean that Hope plaza spent an extra two billion dollars sending the additional shannons back? Or did Hope Plaza run out of juice when the the last two people thought it was their turn to go being in time? Hopefully they "didn't run out of Juice" half way through a person.
Taylor should have shot both of them the minute he found out that they were stowaways, you know if he wasn't at war with the future who was trying to destroy him, and suddenly they wee the only two people he could trust.
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^^ Exactly. Which also raises the question of why the storm troopers trashed the place and why the father went nuts if there were no significant consequences. Another example of the poorly thought through backstory.
Yeah, this all occurred to me as well. As well as the question of what they were going to do when the kid got older and needed to go to school and get a job. And what if she ever needed medical care beyond what her mother was qualified to deliver? And what did they do about immunizations and so forth? Steal the medicine?
Yes, or be willing to accept the consequences of their actions. The consequences in this case are a little muddy, since the storm troopers came in and trashed the place, mommy and daddy went into a panic, daddy attacked the storm troopers to defend his illegal little from-- from a fine, apparently. Also, as I said, the mother subsequently broke him out of jail and conspired to smuggle both he and illegal kid through the time portal. So they established quite a pattern of these privileged middle-class snobs who believe they are above the law. Of course, the real answer is that the show was poorly written-- but, taking it at face value, this is what you get.
Yeah, I actively work to repeal laws that I don't support. And if it effected me in such a fundamental way (i.e. I wanted so badly to do what was prohibited), I would definitely work to repeal it. But in the context of Terra Nova, the law is justified-- or at least understandable-- given the circumstances. Which makes it look like the Shannons don't oppose the law-- they just think they're above it.
Or they're idiots.
JIm slipped one past the goalie, and then the miussus couldn't stomach an abortion, or didn't notice she was pregnant till the baby fell out while she was pooping?
They fucked up and then later on pretended it was a lofty moral political choice so that the public won't know they're basically dung flinging monkeys.
JIm slipped one past the goalie, and then the miussus couldn't stomach an abortion, or didn't notice she was pregnant till the baby fell out while she was pooping?
They fucked up and then later on pretended it was a lofty moral political choice so that the public won't know they're basically dung flinging monkeys.
The source of the fine comment, I recall, was the angry teenage son. The parents' actions'd make more sense if the son (Josh?) is wrong (not shocking) or if the parents didn't know about the fine punishment when they were hiding Zoe (I could see that; there could be lots of propaganda about, but then it actually turns out that money is enough, not that it's broadcasted, of course.)
In any case, the whole Zoe thing could use further clarification, to be sure.
In any case, the whole Zoe thing could use further clarification, to be sure.
Obviously people should be prepared for reprisals when committing something illegal, but that's not the same as suggesting they shouldn't do it simply because it is illegal (regardless of the ethics of said law).
And on average how many of them get repealed, and what does that 'work' consist of?
Because - a hunch here - I don't think writing their congressman or voting for the other guy come November is having much of an impact in this future world. Laws aren't always repealable, but they're often something that can be resisted, shall we say, otherwise.
To put it another way stormtroopers probably trash the place because they can. Terrorizing suspects whether or not they're innocent and whether or not they're accused of a misdemeanour with small penalties? Part of the job description, get with the program, etc. As far as writing goes, the behaviour of the police pretty quickly establishes that this isn't a terribly equitable system.
Would you call them stormtrooper if they were looking for explosives of guns?
That's just what cops look like in the future.
Shannon was a cop.
Super hypocrite.
He probably took lots of kids off other people and melted them down for food cubes.
That's just what cops look like in the future.
Shannon was a cop.
Super hypocrite.
He probably took lots of kids off other people and melted them down for food cubes.
Actually, Jim's speciality was narcotics. Since the cops who inspected the home in the pilot were referred to as "Population Enforcement" they likely a different division of the police, possibly even a different agency.
You don't think sex is a drug?
That's more like it. The characters take after the writers.
That's exactly it. We can sit here and strain ourselves trying to make sense of it all, but that's because the writers didn't do their jobs with the world building.
But the whole point of Terra Nova is that the future is a disaster because of overpopulation.
On overage pretty good, and I do the usual: Spread the good word, write letters, vote. Not that this has anything to do with the bad writing on Terra Nova.
Right, but they weren't protesting. They weren't carrying signs or wearing tee shirts or joining a political group. They simply broke a law in secret for their own gratification-- a law designed to help with the problem that is destroying their world. And the consequences of their criminal activity would not only affect them, but their baby-- whether or not they got caught. If we take what the writers wrote at face value, these are selfish, stupid people.
This is true. The writers did various things to help us know that the future sucks-- unfortunately, they're not very good writers and the things they showed us were contradictory and inconsistent. On another show or in another story, this could have been a nuanced moral conflict-- a society that is oppressive for a good reason, or that brought about it's own oppression-- a good theme for a Dangerous Visions kind of tale. But in this case it's clearly just a poorly thought out justification to get the main characters into dinosaur land.
I got the impression the future was a disaster because of industrial ravaging of the Earth's ecosystem, which is why people lived in those domes. Presumably there'd be more room if that hadn't happened, but one disgresses.
A society with restrictions on how many children you can have also being a society where you're unable to change those laws isn't bad writing, it's China.
You can blame the writers for a lot of things, but this would be like saying Terra Nova has bad writing because the father has teenage children, as opposed to blaming it for how it handles the teenagers and their relationship to their father.
This is the conclusion you'd get if you feel it's right and moral for the state to restrict births and the desire to raise a child in opposition to that is negative, yes.
You have to wonder if the Catholics (and others) have finally approved abortion and condoms by 2149?
Church vs. State.
Church vs. State.
A more relevant question, does religion still exist in 2149? I've seen no indication it does.
When things get bad, people look for something to hold onto and have Faith in, so, I gotta believe there is some kind of Religion, maybe it looks nothing like the Religions we know today, but, I'd say there's some kind of Religion still flourishing
All I'm saying is we've seen no real proof there is religion. Terra Nova itself doesn't even have a religious community or any kind of church/place of worship.
Of course the real world reason is simply to be ploitically correct and not look like they're favouring any particular religion. After all, people watch those show to see dinosaurs, not to stir up debates about politics and religion.
Of course the real world reason is simply to be ploitically correct and not look like they're favouring any particular religion. After all, people watch those show to see dinosaurs, not to stir up debates about politics and religion.