Jon Stewart rips Obama a new one on debt deal

[DarthTom]

I really don't know what this had to do with my post?

It's related to the stimulus package, government spending generally and how we get ourselves out of this mess.

It's Obama admitting that government spending per se isn't going to get us out of this mess. [even though he initially seemed to think they might by throwing money to infrastructure projects]

I'm not saying either that all government is bad nor did Friedman [I think at least] imply that it was. Rather, the implication that throwing money at a problem isn't going to solve it and using a metaphor he described why it wouldn't.

 

[DarthTom]

They had good leverage: they were willing to destroy the economy of the entire world. That unfortunately lets you push pretty hard.

Since Obama isn't crazy, he has nothing of equal pressure to work with against the tea party.

I'm waiting personally for the Tea Party folks to show some degree of consistency on this when it comes to defense spending.

There is a government department that could use some 'pairing down.' Aside from our current obligations to the folks in boots, billions of dollars are being spent to build planes, bombs, missiles, drones etc that we also cannot afford any longer and If they have any backbone and intellectual integrity they'll also eagerly cut those programs back too.

 

[BillJ]

I'm waiting personally for the Tea Party folks to show some degree of consistency on this when it comes to defense spending.

There is a government department that could use some 'pairing down.' Aside from our current obligations to the folks in boots, billions of dollars are being spent to build planes, bombs, missiles, drones etc that we also cannot afford any longer and If they have any backbone and intellectual integrity they'll also eagerly cut those programs back too.

Depends. If the Republicans capture the Senate or the Presidency in 2012, defense cuts will quickly and quietly be removed from the equation.

 

[JohnChod]

I typically stay out of the political discussions here because, like most people who hold office, voice their opinions vociferously and, most likely, vote, the denizens of this forum are either far too left-leaning or right-leaning. Anyone with a smattering of sense would understand that principles of both the left and the right are necessary to the continuance of a civilized society. A society that assists those that are truly in need and also allows business the opportunity to grow and provide jobs and goods to the citizens of the nation. The trick is to moderate both and avoid the establishment of a national welfare state while preventing business from running roughshod over the workers and simply pocketing the biggest profit possible.

How anyone can possibly look back in history and continue to heap blame on a particular party or even a particular president while ignoring the sins of the party or individual they support is unconscionable. It is, however, the cause of where we are today and, I fear, the cause of where we will be tomorrow. Too many of us only care to select our so-called leadership based on blindly supporting the extremes of the political ideology we embrace or maximizing the "What's in it for me?" attitude.

What we really need is a truly centrist third major party in this country. Trouble is, all the money and most of those with any interest in the politics of this nation are on the ends of a see-saw. The silent majority in the middle just seem to hope that everything will work itself out.

 

[DarthTom]

How anyone can possibly look back in history and continue to heap blame on a particular party or even a particular president while ignoring the sins of the party or individual they support is unconscionable. It is, however, the cause of where we are today and, I fear, the cause of where we will be tomorrow. Too many of us only care to select our so-called leadership based on blindly supporting the extremes of the political ideology we embrace or maximizing the "What's in it for me?" attitude.

Without addressing the rest of your post, Gallup does it every single day of the week throughout a President's term. Obama is now at 48% disapproval, which makes that an all time low for him.

The congress is even worse.

 

[Robert Maxwell]

Anyone who thinks Democrats represent any kind of extreme viewpoint is delusional. They are largely center-right moderates with a handful of genuine leftists.

Extremism is far more dominant in the Republican Party, represented most recently by the Tea Party caucus.

 

[Davros]

And he's still going to support Obama over any of the nutcases on the other side.

As would any rational person.

 

[Robert D. Robot]

A few weeks ago I spoke with a friend from high school who works doing high-pressure-concrete injection (I think I got the term correct) who has been busy with his crew working beneath the street level in Philly, NYC, Trenton, etc. patching up (but rarely upgrading to something new) the crumbling infrastructure (water supply lines, utility tunnels, sewers, etc.). What he told me supports what I have heard in reports and news segments (when they DO appear on TV and radio). The country's infrastructure (roads & bridges, too) is falling apart faster than we are keeping up with it. It is being ignored, yet this something (like a tell-tale numbness in your left arm) that is going to eventually lead to disasters. Money should go here and it would create jobs. We (well, at least too many of use) are such a short sighted species!

 

[Robert D. Robot]

Another thing about Tea Party-ers sticking steadfastly to their goals- How many people start a new job and learn that things are a bit more complicated than they had naively thought previously and they then must give in to learning and must come up with a modified strategy that will allow them (within the framework of the "Big Picture"and with what they have learned in their new job) to accomplish something close to their goals. I think most everybody does this.

I am a bit doubtful, however, that this is how Tea Party Representatives that were sent to DC work. I am not so sure that "learning" is a thing they like to do.

 

[Davros]

Anyone who thinks Democrats represent any kind of extreme viewpoint is delusional. They are largely center-right moderates with a handful of genuine leftists.

Extremism is far more dominant in the Republican Party, represented most recently by the Tea Party caucus.

QFT

 

[DrCorby]

Anyone who thinks Democrats represent any kind of extreme viewpoint is delusional. They are largely center-right moderates with a handful of genuine leftists.

Extremism is far more dominant in the Republican Party, represented most recently by the Tea Party caucus.

Erm... no. While there certainly are some center-right Democrats, mostly from conservative Southern districts, the bulk of the Democratic party is center-left, at least.

And while I agree that the Tea Party group has moved the power base of the Republican party pretty far to the right (and I'm very dismayed by that), there are also still some die-hard lefty Democrats remaining who'd love to impose confiscatory taxation similar to many European social welfare republics. There are definitely extreme loonies on both ends of the spectrum.

 

[Robert Maxwell]

Anyone who thinks Democrats represent any kind of extreme viewpoint is delusional. They are largely center-right moderates with a handful of genuine leftists.

Extremism is far more dominant in the Republican Party, represented most recently by the Tea Party caucus.

Erm... no. While there certainly are some center-right Democrats, mostly from conservative Southern districts, the bulk of the Democratic party is center-left, at least.

And while I agree that the Tea Party group has moved the power base of the Republican party pretty far to the right (and I'm very dismayed by that), there are also still some die-hard lefty Democrats remaining who'd love to impose confiscatory taxation similar to many European social welfare republics. There are definitely extreme loonies on both ends of the spectrum.

Big difference there: those lefty Democrats you talk about are small in number and have very little influence. Contrast that with the Tea Party Republicans who virtually held the entire party hostage this past week, and who in fact made the debt ceiling issue into a "crisis" to begin with. If they were a marginalized fringe that never would've happened. They are powerful and they even cowed John McCain when he tried to stand up to them.

If you don't see the difference then you've got bigger problems on your hands.

 

[DrCorby]

Anyone who thinks Democrats represent any kind of extreme viewpoint is delusional. They are largely center-right moderates with a handful of genuine leftists.

Extremism is far more dominant in the Republican Party, represented most recently by the Tea Party caucus.

Erm... no. While there certainly are some center-right Democrats, mostly from conservative Southern districts, the bulk of the Democratic party is center-left, at least.

And while I agree that the Tea Party group has moved the power base of the Republican party pretty far to the right (and I'm very dismayed by that), there are also still some die-hard lefty Democrats remaining who'd love to impose confiscatory taxation similar to many European social welfare republics. There are definitely extreme loonies on both ends of the spectrum.

Big difference there: those lefty Democrats you talk about are small in number and have very little influence. Contrast that with the Tea Party Republicans who virtually held the entire party hostage this past week, and who in fact made the debt ceiling issue into a "crisis" to begin with. If they were a marginalized fringe that never would've happened. They are powerful and they even cowed John McCain when he tried to stand up to them.

If you don't see the difference then you've got bigger problems on your hands.

Yes, I agree that the Tea Party has become inordinately powerful in the last couple of years, especially compared to their actual numbers in the general population. And I certainly agree that the debt ceiling "crisis" was ginned up by them. I just wanted to point out that the lefty Democrats are not dominant in their party at the moment, but as we've seen, political fortunes can certainly change...

 

[Davros]

Erm... no. While there certainly are some center-right Democrats, mostly from conservative Southern districts, the bulk of the Democratic party is center-left, at least.

Nonsense.

And while I agree that the Tea Party group has moved the power base of the Republican party pretty far to the right (and I'm very dismayed by that), there are also still some die-hard lefty Democrats remaining who'd love to impose confiscatory taxation similar to many European social welfare republics. There are definitely extreme loonies on both ends of the spectrum.

"confiscatory taxation"?!!? The Democrats couldn't even get a 3% increase on the top 2%.

 

[Robert D. Robot]

^ I agree with Davros. Especially a head-scratcher when you consider that top tax rates here were over 50% from 1917 to 1982 (except for a few years before, during and just after the Stock Market Crash in 1929). That top rate was actually 88-91% during the good economies of the 1950s into the early 1960s. And now there's whining about the top rate going from 36% back up to the 39% rate of the Clinton Years? I say the top 2% can live with the 3% increase without even feeling it. It's their turn to join in and help out.

Especially when even 50% of Republicans polled says they would support that sort of a targeted tax increase.

 

[nightwind1]

One, make your points without the language. Two, lets hear the FACTS behind your blaming the Republicans for this mess. You accuse but with lack of evidence. Give us the unedited facts and let the readers decide.

One, you're NOT a Moderator, so you don't get to tell someone how to post.
Two, we are in such debt because of 8 years of two wars and many other factors. Shrub turned a trillion-plus surplus into the biggest deficit in history.

 

[iguana_tonante]

Erm... no. While there certainly are some center-right Democrats, mostly from conservative Southern districts, the bulk of the Democratic party is center-left, at least.

On the considerably slanted US political landscape, maybe. But in general terms? Not really. The US has two parties, one on the moderate right, and the other on the extreme right.

there are also still some die-hard lefty Democrats remaining who'd love to impose confiscatory taxation similar to many European social welfare republics. There are definitely extreme loonies on both ends of the spectrum.

So Europe is the land of extreme lefty social welfare loonies? Lulz.

 

[Deckerd]

So Europe is the land of extreme lefty social welfare loonies? Lulz.

Speak for yourself; we've had a conservative government for 30 years.

 

[iguana_tonante]

But Comrade Premier Anton Blair was an extreme lefty social welfare loonie! Look at all the extreme lefty social welfare loonie stuff he did!

 

[Deckerd]

Like whispering in Dubya's ear "I'll follow you into hell, darling"?