Really?
If someone knows where it is on the DVD's I'd love to know.
I have the DVD's, never bothered to watch all the extras.
I know, it's a shame not to get my moneys worth out of them.
Another Voyager 1st-time watch thread
- Thread starter Shatnertage
- Start date
If someone knows where it is on the DVD's I'd love to know.
I have the DVD's, never bothered to watch all the extras.
I know, it's a shame not to get my moneys worth out of them.
Really?
If someone knows where it is on the DVD's I'd love to know.
I have the DVD's, never bothered to watch all the extras.
I know, it's a shame not to get my moneys worth out of them.
Well, it's a big maybe. I can't quite remember. I know it's explained somewhere (they thought they killed the baby off) but maybe that was an interview or something.
The last disc of each season has a bunch of labeled extras along with a load of "secret" extras. I would assume it's on the last disc of Season 6, but again, I honestly don't know if this is due to faulty memory or if this exists.
My favorite extras are the one with Braga apologizing for "Threshold," the "Endgame" storyboards, and the original Bujold footage.
Ugh. It's...
"Spirit Folk"
This is an awful episode. It's not that funny, without even that much to laugh at, let alone with. And naturally, the first thing my daughter wanted to know is, "Where's the baby? Seven had a baby."
"Umm, she went home."
"Why?"
"Because her mommy and daddy missed her."
"Why?"
"Because they wanted to see her. And now she's with them."
"Why?"
And every time we saw Voyager or Seven, the cycle started again. Thanks again, Voyager writers. In addition to the mental image of the fetus covered with implants shivering in pain, now I have this to deal with.
The problem with the episode all boils down to the scene with Turkey Platter, Harry, and Maggie O'Halloran.
I'm going to be a bit indelicate here, but there's no polite way to say it. Sorry if I offend anyone.
As I'm watching Tom gleefully stalking Harry on his holodate, I turn to my wife.
"So basically Tom is cock-blocking Harry Kim--with a hologram. And we've got to watch it."
She agreed it was lame, and wondered why Tom would rather be spending his time with Harry than with his girlfriend.
Really, even the humor in the episode feels forced. Compare it to an episode like TNG "Sub Rosa," which at least has a saving awareness of its own ridiculousness. This is just crap.
Guest actor--the guy from Office Space? Who also played Batai and was in the ENT Augment trilogy? He's the only one I recognized.
Afterwards, I spent about five minutes and thought of the episode I'd rather see.
It'd be a sequel to "Tsunkatse," with Voyager helping the Tsunkatse Hirogen (TH) find his son.
Basically, they meet up with the ship mentioned at the end of the episode. It's captained (budget and schedule permitting) by the Hirogen played by Tony Todd, who doesn't want anything to do with TH, because, by complying with his captors for 19 years, he's become prey. He mentioned a group of renegade Hirogen who don't hunt that might take him in, then huffs off.
TH is devastated; for 19 years, he's been killing just so he can see his son again. Now he fears he will never see him. He has a heart-to-heart with Tuvok about family.
Seven and Harry TECH the TECH and find that the renegade pacifist Hirogen planet is about 2 weeks away, in the right direction, So they take TH there. He shares another character moment with Janeway and resigns himself to never seeing his son again.
They get to the planet, and find out that, surprise, surprise, TH's son is the leader of the renegade Hirogen. He was rescued by a trader who raised him as his son, schooling him in the values of nonviolence and cooperation. Then when he was about 18, the trader and his family were hunted and killed by a group of Hirogen. They kept TH's son as a "trophy," but through the force of his personality he "converted" them to his path.
Now, there's a revitalization movement forming around TH's son. Chakotay helpfully explains this concept that any intro to cultural anthropology student remembers, dropping in a reference to Wovoka and the Ghost Dance. If we want to really push the envelope, we could also mention Jesus or Buddha, but we'll probably draw the line with Tuvok talking about Surak, echoing Kirk's line about "one man with a vision" from "Mirror, Mirror."
Turns out TH's son isn't happy to see TH--he accuses him of being stained with the blood of innocents, and casts him out. Distraught, TH talks to Tuvok. Because he needs to TECH the TECH, TH's son has to work with Seven, who tells him a little bit about his father.
There's a climactic moment when a hunting party of mean Hirogen attack, and TH puts his life in danger to save his son. The son sees that he's a good man, despite his past, and embraces him.
Chakotay theorizes that, with TH's resolve and his son's spirit, the renegade sect might become the Hirogen orthodoxy. We may have just seen the birth of a revolution in the Delta Quadrant--it's possible that a Hirogen presence committed to peace, cooperation, and mutual advancement may alter the balance of power in the Delta Quadrant.
For that, you'd need three guest actors, a Hirogen ship, and a generic planet refugee camp set. It would flesh out the Hirogen--Voyager's best new species, IMO--and tell a decent story.
I don't usually do the fan fic thing, but that's what I would have filmed instead of "Spirit Folk."
"Spirit Folk"
This is an awful episode. It's not that funny, without even that much to laugh at, let alone with. And naturally, the first thing my daughter wanted to know is, "Where's the baby? Seven had a baby."
"Umm, she went home."
"Why?"
"Because her mommy and daddy missed her."
"Why?"
"Because they wanted to see her. And now she's with them."
"Why?"
And every time we saw Voyager or Seven, the cycle started again. Thanks again, Voyager writers. In addition to the mental image of the fetus covered with implants shivering in pain, now I have this to deal with.
The problem with the episode all boils down to the scene with Turkey Platter, Harry, and Maggie O'Halloran.
I'm going to be a bit indelicate here, but there's no polite way to say it. Sorry if I offend anyone.
As I'm watching Tom gleefully stalking Harry on his holodate, I turn to my wife.
"So basically Tom is cock-blocking Harry Kim--with a hologram. And we've got to watch it."
She agreed it was lame, and wondered why Tom would rather be spending his time with Harry than with his girlfriend.
Really, even the humor in the episode feels forced. Compare it to an episode like TNG "Sub Rosa," which at least has a saving awareness of its own ridiculousness. This is just crap.
Guest actor--the guy from Office Space? Who also played Batai and was in the ENT Augment trilogy? He's the only one I recognized.
Afterwards, I spent about five minutes and thought of the episode I'd rather see.
It'd be a sequel to "Tsunkatse," with Voyager helping the Tsunkatse Hirogen (TH) find his son.
Basically, they meet up with the ship mentioned at the end of the episode. It's captained (budget and schedule permitting) by the Hirogen played by Tony Todd, who doesn't want anything to do with TH, because, by complying with his captors for 19 years, he's become prey. He mentioned a group of renegade Hirogen who don't hunt that might take him in, then huffs off.
TH is devastated; for 19 years, he's been killing just so he can see his son again. Now he fears he will never see him. He has a heart-to-heart with Tuvok about family.
Seven and Harry TECH the TECH and find that the renegade pacifist Hirogen planet is about 2 weeks away, in the right direction, So they take TH there. He shares another character moment with Janeway and resigns himself to never seeing his son again.
They get to the planet, and find out that, surprise, surprise, TH's son is the leader of the renegade Hirogen. He was rescued by a trader who raised him as his son, schooling him in the values of nonviolence and cooperation. Then when he was about 18, the trader and his family were hunted and killed by a group of Hirogen. They kept TH's son as a "trophy," but through the force of his personality he "converted" them to his path.
Now, there's a revitalization movement forming around TH's son. Chakotay helpfully explains this concept that any intro to cultural anthropology student remembers, dropping in a reference to Wovoka and the Ghost Dance. If we want to really push the envelope, we could also mention Jesus or Buddha, but we'll probably draw the line with Tuvok talking about Surak, echoing Kirk's line about "one man with a vision" from "Mirror, Mirror."
Turns out TH's son isn't happy to see TH--he accuses him of being stained with the blood of innocents, and casts him out. Distraught, TH talks to Tuvok. Because he needs to TECH the TECH, TH's son has to work with Seven, who tells him a little bit about his father.
There's a climactic moment when a hunting party of mean Hirogen attack, and TH puts his life in danger to save his son. The son sees that he's a good man, despite his past, and embraces him.
Chakotay theorizes that, with TH's resolve and his son's spirit, the renegade sect might become the Hirogen orthodoxy. We may have just seen the birth of a revolution in the Delta Quadrant--it's possible that a Hirogen presence committed to peace, cooperation, and mutual advancement may alter the balance of power in the Delta Quadrant.
For that, you'd need three guest actors, a Hirogen ship, and a generic planet refugee camp set. It would flesh out the Hirogen--Voyager's best new species, IMO--and tell a decent story.
I don't usually do the fan fic thing, but that's what I would have filmed instead of "Spirit Folk."
OH no! I am sorry to hear about your subunit's confusion over the baby. Bless her heart.
Yep, you got the guest star.
Um. Really don't have anything at all nice to say about this ep. I'd totally watch your Hirogen episode, though!
Checking the episode list, I see that you're watching "Ashes to Ashes" next, which means it's probably a good idea for me to recuse myself from this thread for a little while. Don't worry! It's not a clunker like "Spirit Folk". It just has a certain little tiny insignificant thing that happens that drives me into fits of complete unreasonable . . . never mind. We can talk about it later.
Yep, you got the guest star.
Um. Really don't have anything at all nice to say about this ep. I'd totally watch your Hirogen episode, though!
Checking the episode list, I see that you're watching "Ashes to Ashes" next, which means it's probably a good idea for me to recuse myself from this thread for a little while. Don't worry! It's not a clunker like "Spirit Folk". It just has a certain little tiny insignificant thing that happens that drives me into fits of complete unreasonable . . . never mind. We can talk about it later.
Damn, why weren't you working on VOY? As for Spirit Folk, have made my feelings known elsewhere...
OK--now I have to see if I can guess which one that is.
^ Well, I will admit that it isn't the most significant scene in the ep. 
I'm back after an action-packed weekend seeing friends and getting stuff done. So I see I missed much discussion!
To me "Tsunkatse" is fantastic. I LOVE the Hirogen Seven is up against here. I didn't see it coming that he'd be her opponent in the final fight. Having read your follow-up episode idea, shatnertage, I have to say I've really enjoy watching that. Funny you said you're not into fanfic, because while reading your idea I was thinking, "Hmm, he should write that into a fic!" The Hirogen are interesting DQ aliens; I'm glad we get to see them again.
I don't have much to say about "Collective." Borg babies? Eh.
"Spirit Folk" is just - GAH! Awful, terrible, no good, please let me forget this ever happened. WHY they thought we needed to revisit Fair Haven of all possible episodes to flesh out in another episode, I'll never know. Nothing new or interesting is presented here.
"Ashes to Ashes" got a decent rating from me and the hubby. See what you think.
To me "Tsunkatse" is fantastic. I LOVE the Hirogen Seven is up against here. I didn't see it coming that he'd be her opponent in the final fight. Having read your follow-up episode idea, shatnertage, I have to say I've really enjoy watching that. Funny you said you're not into fanfic, because while reading your idea I was thinking, "Hmm, he should write that into a fic!" The Hirogen are interesting DQ aliens; I'm glad we get to see them again.
I don't have much to say about "Collective." Borg babies? Eh.
"Spirit Folk" is just - GAH! Awful, terrible, no good, please let me forget this ever happened. WHY they thought we needed to revisit Fair Haven of all possible episodes to flesh out in another episode, I'll never know. Nothing new or interesting is presented here.
"Ashes to Ashes" got a decent rating from me and the hubby. See what you think.
^ I think TAS would be pretty cool that way, too.
Allllllll the briiiiiiiiight coloooooooors!
Allllllll the briiiiiiiiight coloooooooors!
I saw this episode...it feels like it was a lifetime ago. So it must be...
"Ashes to Ashes"
Watching this one after having seen the previous 6 seasons, a few things jump out at me. The writers completely ignored a few facts that have been established in the series:
1. Harry Kim, and no one else, has ever mentioned Lindsay Ballard.
2. Harry Kim had a girlfriend at the Academy. We even met her.
3. To my knowledge, Janeway's never sent two ensigns alone on an away mission like she supposedly did.
4. No one has ever mentioned an away mission on which Kim was the only survivor, and lost the love of his life. It would definitely merit an aside, at the very least.
Besides all that, it's a pretty good story with a neat science fiction concept and a philosophical conundrum: Is the person who comes back Lindsay Ballard or is she Kobali?
So I liked the episode and found it intriguing, but it doesn't really fit with the rest of Voyager.
Is the scene that T.D. Possum finds objectionable the pot roast scene? I know that people have mentioned pot roast before. Seems kind of odd that a replicator would be capable of burning a pot roast. And why would you make a whole pot roast for two people, anyway? Is she going to feed Chakotay the leftovers or something? And what's the deal with the PB&J paraphernalia ready to go on her table? She's got peanut butter, jelly, and a loaf of sliced white bread, just sitting there. Couldn't she just replicate something else that she knows is good, like chicken paprikash, or send down to the mess hall for take-out?
And there was a B-story, too, that had a few moments. For now, I still kind the Borg kids creepy, but I loved the Okudagram that Seven showed Chakotay that had "FUN" flashing on it. And she seemed to make progress with the kids, so I guess that's good. Does NaomiWildman feel left out? She really looked up to Seven, and now Seven's got a new project. Poor kid.
Discussion of the pot roast will commence.
"Ashes to Ashes"
Watching this one after having seen the previous 6 seasons, a few things jump out at me. The writers completely ignored a few facts that have been established in the series:
1. Harry Kim, and no one else, has ever mentioned Lindsay Ballard.
2. Harry Kim had a girlfriend at the Academy. We even met her.
3. To my knowledge, Janeway's never sent two ensigns alone on an away mission like she supposedly did.
4. No one has ever mentioned an away mission on which Kim was the only survivor, and lost the love of his life. It would definitely merit an aside, at the very least.
Besides all that, it's a pretty good story with a neat science fiction concept and a philosophical conundrum: Is the person who comes back Lindsay Ballard or is she Kobali?
So I liked the episode and found it intriguing, but it doesn't really fit with the rest of Voyager.
Is the scene that T.D. Possum finds objectionable the pot roast scene? I know that people have mentioned pot roast before. Seems kind of odd that a replicator would be capable of burning a pot roast. And why would you make a whole pot roast for two people, anyway? Is she going to feed Chakotay the leftovers or something? And what's the deal with the PB&J paraphernalia ready to go on her table? She's got peanut butter, jelly, and a loaf of sliced white bread, just sitting there. Couldn't she just replicate something else that she knows is good, like chicken paprikash, or send down to the mess hall for take-out?
And there was a B-story, too, that had a few moments. For now, I still kind the Borg kids creepy, but I loved the Okudagram that Seven showed Chakotay that had "FUN" flashing on it. And she seemed to make progress with the kids, so I guess that's good. Does NaomiWildman feel left out? She really looked up to Seven, and now Seven's got a new project. Poor kid.
Discussion of the pot roast will commence.
That's not all they ignored!
They also neglected to explain:
5. How Ballard even managed to locate Voyager, much less catch up with them, after they had moved on without her for three years.
6. How these aliens managed to find enough dead bodies to maintain their population at a stable level.
But! BUT!
Yes! Yes! A thousand times yes!
I can overlook all that other stuff. Some of it is a bit esoteric. Some of it is sort of necessary fudging so the plot can develop.
But the replicator issues I cannot forgive! It. Just. Drives. Me. Insane. Any fool who has ever seen one episode of Star Trek in which a replicator was used and spent TEN SECONDS thinking about it could easily tell you this is not right.
I . . . losing . . . ability . . . speak . . . coherently . . . look . . . Froot made . . . thingy for me:
I was wondering if that picture was going to pop up again.
Ashes to Ashes is one of my least favorite's.
I just hate it. Always have, always will.
IMO it was worse than Threshold, Non Sequitur, Elogium, etc.
Ashes to Ashes is one of my least favorite's.
I just hate it. Always have, always will.
IMO it was worse than Threshold, Non Sequitur, Elogium, etc.
Yeah, Voyager had moved at least 25,000 ly since season 3--there's no way she'd be able to catch them.
I now know what the "jelly fridge" is all about.
Maybe it's plasma jelly that doesn't require refrigeration but tastes delicious.
And if someone invited me over for dinner and tried to serve me PR&J, captain or not, I'd say, "Hey, whaddya say I use my replicator rations and make us some chicken parm. Or, "Captain, don't you worry about dinner. I'll grab something from the mess hall and be right back."
Basically this episode turned Janeway into a deadbeat dad who gets stuck with the kids and has to make dinner, then realizes that cooking is a lot harder than it looks from the living room.
Still liked the basic idea, but like I said it was executed pretty poorly.
I now know what the "jelly fridge" is all about.
Maybe it's plasma jelly that doesn't require refrigeration but tastes delicious.
And if someone invited me over for dinner and tried to serve me PR&J, captain or not, I'd say, "Hey, whaddya say I use my replicator rations and make us some chicken parm. Or, "Captain, don't you worry about dinner. I'll grab something from the mess hall and be right back."
Basically this episode turned Janeway into a deadbeat dad who gets stuck with the kids and has to make dinner, then realizes that cooking is a lot harder than it looks from the living room.
Still liked the basic idea, but like I said it was executed pretty poorly.
Of this, the Possum approves.
Also, it's almost superfluous to say, but...
"DNA doesn't work like that."
I could forgive them for getting cellular biology wrong, but being clueless about how dinner's made?
"DNA doesn't work like that."
I could forgive them for getting cellular biology wrong, but being clueless about how dinner's made?
^ 
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