Oxford Comma?

[Alidar Jarok]

(although, got to say, peanut butter and jelly is a combination I cannot fathom )

Until about two years ago, I couldn't fathom that anyone would not know of peanut butter and jelly. To me, it's the epitome of a pair that always goes together (I mean, I use jam instead of jelly, but still). Then my brother found out that no one he met in Japan had ever had the combination. All his Japanese friends tried it and agreed they tasted good together, but they probably wouldn't combine them just because they're not used to it.

 

[iguana_tonante]

I've never had peanut butter. Actually, I don't think I never saw it. Store here just don't have the stuff. I suppose I could find in some places if I look really hard, but I've never felt compelled to do so.

If you want to add something to your marmalade sandwich, you use good ol' butter.

 

[Count Zero]

Yeah, globally, peanut butter isn't very well known. To most people, it's just that weird American food item, even where it is available. I don't think it'll ever be as popular as donuts, muffins and bagels.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

Some American girls in my Italian class when I spent a month at the Universita per Stranieri in Siena bought our Professor Peanut Butter. It was the first time she ever had it. She seemed surprised with its taste.

 

[Count Zero]

One of my friends spent a year at an American university and after she came back she had a party and offered us some chocolate thingies filled with peanut butter (I forgot the name). It tasted weird and we all looked at her funny. So, maybe it's an acquired taste.

 

[RoJoHen]

One of my friends spent a year at an American university and after she came back she had a party and offered us some chocolate thingies filled with peanut butter (I forgot the name). It tasted weird and we all looked at her funny. So, maybe it's an acquired taste.

Reeses Peanut Butter Cups?

I have a giant bag in my desk at work.

Peanut Butter + Chocolate = WIN.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

I do not use it because I was taught in elementary school that you didn't need before an "and". It looks awkward to me and I always assume it's poor writing.

 

[DrCorby]

I wasn't aware it had a name, but yes, I put a comma before the final "and" when listing things. It just flows more naturally that way.

Exactly!! I've had teachers and professors try to convince me otherwise for years (decades), but using the "Oxford comma" just makes lists clearer. No matter what the current vogue is. And no one will convince me otherwise!

Now, can we talk about correct placement of quotation marks?

 

[Holdfast]

oxford comma? wtf is this shit?

peter, paul and mary went to America and beat the crap outta the stupid people who can't write English properly.

that was ten years ago and they're only a quarter of the way through the list.

I believe it's called the Oxford comma because Oxford University Press mandates its use. They're a pretty English institution.

You're quite right that it's much more common in American English rather than British English though. I just looked it up in Strunk & White, and unsurprisingly for a style guide written in America, they recommend its use.

However, Oxford University itself doesn't (at least, they didn't at the time I did my dissertation; I remember looking it up at the time). They did suggest its usage where it resolves ambiguity (like the peanut butter and jam example upthread), although they also suggest restructuring the sentence if possible to avoid the ambiguity in the first place.

I use it in such circumstances. Or occasionally for dramatic effect.

 

[RoJoHen]

I wasn't aware it had a name, but yes, I put a comma before the final "and" when listing things. It just flows more naturally that way.

Exactly!! I've had teachers and professors try to convince me otherwise for years (decades), but using the "Oxford comma" just makes lists clearer. No matter what the current vogue is. And no one will convince me otherwise!

Now, can we talk about correct placement of quotation marks?

Quotation marks bug me. I know the proper way to use them, but sometimes they just look wrong, usually when question marks are involved.

 

[DrCorby]

I wasn't aware it had a name, but yes, I put a comma before the final "and" when listing things. It just flows more naturally that way.

Exactly!! I've had teachers and professors try to convince me otherwise for years (decades), but using the "Oxford comma" just makes lists clearer. No matter what the current vogue is. And no one will convince me otherwise!

Now, can we talk about correct placement of quotation marks?

Quotation marks bug me. I know the proper way to use them, but sometimes they just look wrong, usually when question marks are involved.

That's the sort of example I was thinking of. Just because a sentence or phrase ends after a quoted phrase doesn't mean the punctuation mark should be thrown inside if it's not part of the original quote.

 

[RoJoHen]

I completely agree.

 

[trampledamage]

Exactly!! I've had teachers and professors try to convince me otherwise for years (decades), but using the "Oxford comma" just makes lists clearer. No matter what the current vogue is. And no one will convince me otherwise!

Now, can we talk about correct placement of quotation marks?

Quotation marks bug me. I know the proper way to use them, but sometimes they just look wrong, usually when question marks are involved.

That's the sort of example I was thinking of. Just because a sentence or phrase ends after a quoted phrase doesn't mean the punctuation mark should be thrown inside if it's not part of the original quote.

Where to stick your punctuation when you have quotation marks is also something that is different from the UK and the US. Can't remember the rules right now (I suck at grammar - I was never taught it at school) but I know they are different.

 

[Myasishchev]

(although, got to say, peanut butter and jelly is a combination I cannot fathom )

Baby George Washington Carver is crying.

Anyway, the Oxford comma is wasteful and increases ink costs along with the entropy of the universe. Don't use it.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

Quotation marks bug me. I know the proper way to use them, but sometimes they just look wrong, usually when question marks are involved.

That's the sort of example I was thinking of. Just because a sentence or phrase ends after a quoted phrase doesn't mean the punctuation mark should be thrown inside if it's not part of the original quote.

Where to stick your punctuation when you have quotation marks is also something that is different from the UK and the US. Can't remember the rules right now (I suck at grammar - I was never taught it at school) but I know they are different.

IIRC,
UK rule: Stick punctuation outside the quotation. Also, use only single quotation marks.

I don't usually listen to 'the man'.

US rule: Pretty much the exact opposite.

I don't usually listen to "the man."

For commas:
'I don't usually listen to the man', said Bob.
"I don't usually listen to the man," said Bob.

However (and I can't speak for the UK), the rule with question marks is different.

IIRC, the rule for question marks is to put it outside the quotation if the original quote was not a question.

Examples:
Bob asked, "are you going to the store?"
How long are you going to say "that's what she said"?

 

[J.T.B.]

I was taught to use it early on, but in college I wrote for and edited a newspaper and the AP style book discouraged it for a simple series, and I've never gone back to using it. The "and" separates the elements of the series just like the commas, so another comma is superfluous. I don't really find that people pause at the "and" when speaking except for dramatic effect, for instance a flag would generally be spoken of as "red whiteanblue." To my ear, anyway.

However, when more conjunctions are involved within the series, another comma is useful (and OK with AP, at least it was 20 years ago). So:

The menu has pancakes, ham and eggs, and biscuits and gravy.​

would be cool with me.

Who gives a fuck about an Oxford comma? I've seen those English dramas too, they're cruel.

Of all songs named after punctuation, that's one of the best.

--Justin

 

[Alidar Jarok]

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

oxford comma? wtf is this shit?

peter, paul and mary went to America and beat the crap outta the stupid people who can't write English properly.

Nobody seems to pay attention to this fact: American and British spelling and grammar rules were firmly standardized in both countries AFTER we won the Revolutionary War. Therefore British rules hold NO sway over the US. None. There is absolutely zero historical reason why either country can claim any sort of linguistic superiority. We speak two different dialects that have been separated for so long that it is absolutely and totally pointless to attempt it.

 

[HoneyBLilly]

There's another way to write "Peter, Mary, and Paul went to the store?"

Where was I that day in school. I've always done it the Oxford way.

 

[ITL]

I can't remember being taught about the Oxford Comma at all. But I do remember a teacher drawing attention to my overuse of commas, once upon a time. He thought it was funny as I was the only kid in the class that remembered to use them at all...

Oh - and peanut butter? Popular over here. I love the stuff.