I just got finish watching the newest Star Trek movie, again, and I noticed that during the scene when Scotty is first indroduced it was mentioned he was put on that specific outpost because he lost Admiral Archer's prized beagel when he tried to transport it from one planet to onther. The question is, is this the same Archer from the telivision series Enterprise, or is it too far into the future?
Newest movie and enterprise relation
- Thread starter asa3013
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Yes, Scotty is talking about Jonathan Archer of Enterprise.
Chick_McGeester
Lieutenant
If it is its got to be one old dog...
Maybe Porthos had puppies? Or maybe Archer just got a new dog of the same breed. Hey, the quote doesn't indicate it was even alive, so maybe he had Porthos stuffed. Or maybe it's a clone of Porthos. The possibilities are endless!
It was Archer's beagle, but nobody said it was Porthos. Perhaps Archer just has an affinity for beagles, and only buys pets *from* that breed?
The thing to remember about McCoy reaching 137 years by "Encounter At Farpoint" is that he was surprised that he hadn't died yet. It doesn't mean that every Human being can live that long, IMO...
But it seems that the "Admiral Archer" reference is meant to be a reference to Jonathan Archer, who must have been pushing 147-150 by the time of Star Trek XI...
But it seems that the "Admiral Archer" reference is meant to be a reference to Jonathan Archer, who must have been pushing 147-150 by the time of Star Trek XI...
And I'd expect that someone from the TOS era would have a longer lifespan than Archer from 100 years or so beforehand.
But according to memory-alpha, it's confirmed by the writers that it is the same Archer.
I wouldn't.
I do think the average life-span for Humans by the time of TOS is around 110-120 or so--which is definitely more than what it currently is now--but I think 150 is pushing it a bit by the time of the 23rd-Century. Medical science or not, that is still damned ancient for a Human, even in McCoy's opinion. Additionally, Humans were croaking of old age just around 100 in various episodes of TOS.
Which counts as much as anything said off-screen...
Which part? The fact it's on memory alpha, or the fact the writers confirmed it without it being explicitly stated in the movie? If the writers say that's what they intended, then I count it as official. Maybe it was just a subtle nod to Enterprise fans (both of them), although it seems more likely it was meant to be the same Archer, perhaps to create a very loose continuity within the Trek history.
Memory Alpha's a good source, but even it isn't above using conjecture and off-screen resources here and there. And what the writers say offscreen don't mean anything if it isn't said so onscreen. Did anything in the movie confirm it was Admiral Jonathan Archer? If not, then it could very well have been Archer's son (or grandson) who followed in Jonathan's footsteps (and would probably be an admiral with a beagle by 2258 too). Either way, it wouldn't change the "Admiral Archer" reference from being a nod towards ENT all the same.
Now, as I said in my earlier post, I think it's likely that it's Jonathan Archer, but I'm not going to accept it just as a foregone conclusion, since I do think there's at least one other possibility.
It's probably not canon, but it's worth noting...
From Memory Alpha:
From Memory Alpha:
Which would place his death thirteen years prior to the launch of the Abramsverse Enterprise in 2258.
I think the point is, he was alive to see the launch.
I thought the thread was about whether or not Jonathan Archer was alive around the events of Star Trek 2009?
Well, officially their private opinions, of course.
If Archer arranged for Scotty to be basically marooned on Delta Vega, then died in 2245 and Scotty was still on Delta Vega in 2258, that might explain why he was so hungry.
There were (I believe) references to a planet Archer in TNG, prior to the creation of the Archer character, so there is a significance to the name in the Star Trek universe, Archer isn't that unusual a name and might refer to any number of people in Earth's or the Federation's history.
I like the idea that the beagle in question might have been stuffed. Perhaps it was Porthos after all. He was on permanent display in the Starfleet headquarters main lobby as part of the "Enterprise exhibit," and Scotty stole him one night to use in his experiment on trans-planetary beaming.
The stuffed animal, viewed with affection by all of Starfleet as the organization official mascot, was destroyed or otherwise lost, resulting in other admirals (other than the deceased Archer) in exiling Scotty.
I thought the thread was about whether or not Jonathan Archer was alive around the events of Star Trek 2009?
We could compromise and say "Sure" in the absense of a death certificate/scene.
I thought the thread was about whether or not Jonathan Archer was alive around the events of Star Trek 2009?
We could compromise and say "Sure" in the absense of a death certificate/scene.
I don't think he would be alive at 148. YMMV.
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