2011 SotL Calendar

[deg3D]

But the moon and sun rising south of Florida could have been avoided by simply turning the map upside down, no?

Unless there's supposed to be a subtle message in Florida pointing at the deflector dish of the Enterprise...

I was speaking more about the multiple moons and such in the Kelvin shot, which occurred to me as well, but I just “went with it” for the sake of enjoying Tobias' (IMO) beautiful composition.

As to the other shot and Florida; TBT, it didn't even occur to me, as I was too busy enjoying the shot for what it was as a whole (yes, the emotional impact on me, check Spocko), as opposed to picking it apart to the point of losing that said joy.

Plus, as an artist myself, I have looked at and to Tobias' work for years for inspiration and learning, as examples of and for improving my own work, as opposed to trying to arm-chair-artist it as being something less-than in any way for whatever perceived reason.

IMO, when folks do that to the caliber of Tobias' work, I say; OK, that's fine, I'll give ya that as your call. Now do me a favor, and show me what you have done and how's it's done right, so I can learn from you.

deg

 

[BolianAuthor]

I just gotta say again... the more I look at Andy's vertical Warbird, and gasp at it's greatness, the more I wish we had or would see it on the big screen... especially IMAX . The thing looks like it's probably as tall as Spacedock .

And I LOVE the inclusion of a painted red bird on the top of the D'Dreidex!

 

[deg3D]

I just gotta say again... the more I look at Andy's vertical Warbird, and gasp at it's greatness, the more I wish we had or would see it on the big screen... especially IMAX . The thing looks like it's probably as tall as Spacedock .

And I LOVE the inclusion of a painted red bird on the top of the D'Dreidex!

Couldn't agree more, BA, and I haven't even had the joy of holding it up before me, as I have not gotten my comp copies from the publisher yet. All I've seen was Doug's small preview of it on the Drex Files. Can't wait to see it in the calendar itself. Maybe I'll build it some day...

deg

 

[BolianAuthor]

Maybe I'll build it some day...

deg

Oh, God... don't tease us like that...

 

[ST-One]

Man I hate it when "bad astronomy" takes me out of the initial good feelings I have about somebody's work. While I can't deny the possibility of two large moons orbiting inside a ring system around some distant Earth-like planet, the super-sized Moon and Sun rising south of Florida* really ruin the bottom image for me.
Now I know someone will say "artistic license" but there is an attempt here to convince you that the ships are in space so, at least IMO, the space parts should be spot-on accurate to help sell the illusion.

*(Tampa Bay and the Keys are clearly visible)

Well...

[/Khan] This IS Sol Three!!
Sol Two exploded six month after we were marooned here. The shock of the explosion shifted the orbit of this planet...[/Khan]

 

[BK613]

Man I hate it when "bad astronomy" takes me out of the initial good feelings I have about somebody's work. While I can't deny the possibility of two large moons orbiting inside a ring system around some distant Earth-like planet, the super-sized Moon and Sun rising south of Florida* really ruin the bottom image for me.
Now I know someone will say "artistic license" but there is an attempt here to convince you that the ships are in space so, at least IMO, the space parts should be spot-on accurate to help sell the illusion.

*(Tampa Bay and the Keys are clearly visible)

Real-life isn't sexy (enough).

Then you're not looking in the right places

Film and TV (thus VFX) are all about creating emotional impact, by tweaking reality.

Well my BS meter was certainly impacted Which is a shame, because the quality of TR's work is such that he doesn't need to rearrange the contents of the Solar System to pull off any kind of "emotional impact."

And all that may be complete BS to one that is of a purely reality-based sensibility

Well that's an odd assumption on your part: my minor objection to TR's cut-and-paste, comic book astronomy has somehow grown into a full-blown sensibility. Wow!

(I used to be that type before I learned and grew),

I am happy for you and I hope you never stop learning and growing. Me, I've been doing some kind of art (drawing, painting, photography and some 3d work) for as long as I can remember, made sure I picked up a minor in fine arts as I went through college and I am still learning new things about the discipline and myself. And after a lifetime of physical media (for the most part), I am now learning to use a Wacom tablet.

All is not lost though. If one wants 100% reality, one can always bin all the made-up stuff and stick with the NASA Channel or the like. I love that channel myself.

I love that stuff too but "reality tweaking" should never be an acceptable excuse for careless, thoughtless or lazy execution. IMO. YMMV


caveat: Given how testy peeps have seemed lately, none of this should be taken as confrontational. I am not trying to "win" here at all.

 

[deg3D]

...none of this should be taken as confrontational. I am not trying to "win" here at all.

Ditto.

Have to watch ass-u-me, as we all know what that ends up doing.

deg

 

[tobiasrichter]

Ok, lemme chime in here for a sec...

Maybe the position of the sun should be higher - but then it would have been out of the frame. So yes, this was an artistic decision. I wanted to have Florida inside as a short hint to where it all started (Kennedy space center) and the ocean behind it. Otherwise there would be the american land mass behind it and no reflections - earth would have looked not as nice. The earth is a real 3D model. Same goes for the moon. You see - all artistic decisions. Some maybe not 100% astronomical correct - but I easily take that burden to make a more beautiful image.

Hope you neverthelesse can enjoy the pics...

 

[Santaman]

I'm not an artist but to hell with reality in real space all colours of spacecrafts, planets and even the sun would be different then what we're used to and so on, everything really realistic probably would look "wrong" to us atmosphere dwellers so damn that reality and just make pretty pictures!

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Otherwise there would be the american land mass behind it and no reflections - earth would have looked not as nice. The earth is a real 3D model. Same goes for the moon. You see - all artistic decisions. Some maybe not 100% astronomical correct - but I easily take that burden to make a more beautiful image.

Reflections from the oceans and cloud patterns are both the most beautiful and persuasive aspects of 3D modeling a planet like Earth, IMAO, and attention to them is important. Your image in the calendar is wonderful.

 

[sojourner]

I wanted to have Florida inside as a short hint to where it all started (Kennedy space center) and the ocean behind it.

Couldn't this still have been achieved by rotating the planet 90 degrees to show the ship crossing over Florida from east to west?

 

[BK613]

Ok, lemme chime in here for a sec...

Maybe the position of the sun should be higher - but then it would have been out of the frame. So yes, this was an artistic decision. I wanted to have Florida inside as a short hint to where it all started (Kennedy space center) and the ocean behind it. Otherwise there would be the american land mass behind it and no reflections - earth would have looked not as nice. The earth is a real 3D model. Same goes for the moon. You see - all artistic decisions. Some maybe not 100% astronomical correct - but I easily take that burden to make a more beautiful image.

Hope you neverthelesse can enjoy the pics...

First of all, thanks for coming by to discuss this and to share your thought processes. Let me assure you that I do fully understand the idea of artistic choice (or intent or license.)
I remain, however, unconvinced by your reasoning:

I see no reason why the Atlantic Ocean wouldn't have served you better, with a real dawn over the Cape as opposed to that rises-in-the-south sets-in-the-north image you created.

As for the over-sized Moon, well, am I to be faulted because I've already been through my "Schim" Schimmel phase and consider such compositions clichéd?
---------------------
Edit; I see sojourner has also raised the east-west thing...

 

[tobiasrichter]

This did not work as well, as the starbase is much further away from the Earth and Florida and the rest of America would have been hidden partially by the Enterprise - thus not as easily recognizable. Believe me, I have tried for a couple of hours to find the best composition.

 

[Kaiser]

Any better pics or a full version of the page in the calender with all the fan designed TMP era ships?

or anyone know if the artist has a site ?

 

[Clawhammer]

Oh lets all bring the nitpick baskets, we are going to have a nice nitpick!

I can handle the artistic license that was taken here, and I'm very autistic if it comes to these things. Only respect for Tobias, his work is a great inspiration to me and a whole lot of others. One day I will be on his level, but not today!!! Where are Gowron's eyeballs if you need them.

 

[JarodRussell]

Makes me wonder if that giant space station was hovering above the United States, what did Nero do with it?

 

[BK613]

This did not work as well, as the starbase is much further away from the Earth and Florida and the rest of America would have been hidden partially by the Enterprise - thus not as easily recognizable. Believe me, I have tried for a couple of hours to find the best composition.

Well, I'll just walk away from this then. I think it can be done, but without the professional setup to test what I see in my mind's eye (and with the full acknowledgment that what resides there doesn't always work) I can't really show it so I'll let it be.

It's all good though: it is an alternate reality so maybe the north pole really is "just outside of Moscow."

(I do thank you for taking the time to discuss it today. My disagreement with your decisions here should in no way infer a general dismissal of your work as a whole or as you as an artist. I can appreciate the amazing detailing of your models, the terrific lighting and rendering skills, and the skillful compositing to put all the elements together so they read as one scene AND still disagree on this one point. I certainly hope you (and everyone else) can understand that.)

 

[deg3D]

Any better pics or a full version of the page in the calender with all the fan designed TMP era ships?

or anyone know if the artist has a site ?

Sent you a PM with links, bud.

deg

 

[JarodRussell]

Any better pics or a full version of the page in the calender with all the fan designed TMP era ships?

or anyone know if the artist has a site ?

Sent you a PM with links, bud.

deg

Can I get that PM, too? Pleeeeeeaaaazzzzz.

 

[deg3D]

Any better pics or a full version of the page in the calender with all the fan designed TMP era ships?

or anyone know if the artist has a site ?

Sent you a PM with links, bud.

deg

Can I get that PM, too? Pleeeeeeaaaazzzzz.

Sure, sent, bud.

deg