The Woman? (Spoilers)

[RoJoHen]

Under the theory that Donna is actually The Doctor's mother, I just want to say that I love the idea of Wilf being his grandpa!

And it might explain, in some wibbley wobbley, timey whimey way, why they have been drawn together.

Lamest piece of fanon ever. Even worse than epileptic trees.

Just trying to have a little fun here. Try taking the show a little less seriously.

 

[Starkers]

Personally I think both Wilf and Donna are demeaned as characters if they're Timelords. I prefer that they're both just regular humans acting in a special way. In fact I was pretty annoyed when the Donna is special trope was relealed to be that she was only spelcial because of the Doctor. I wanted her to be special because she was her!

 

[Sci]

Under the theory that Donna is actually The Doctor's mother, I just want to say that I love the idea of Wilf being his grandpa!

And it might explain, in some wibbley wobbley, timey whimey way, why they have been drawn together.

Lamest piece of fanon ever. Even worse than epileptic trees.

Just trying to have a little fun here. Try taking the show a little less seriously.

You're the one who objects to the idea of having a Star Trek/Doctor Who crossover for fun.

 

[DWF]

I have another reason for rejecting the idea that she's the Doctor's mother:

It hurts the mystery of just who the Doctor is if we see that he has parents and grandparents. It makes him a little too familiar.

(Also, it conflicts with the Doctor's comment in "The Empty Child" that he knows what it's like to be abandoned and left out in the cold as a child if his parents were alive and well and members of the High Council.)

He could've been left out in the cold for one day or even a few hours, but I did tell you some time ago that he wasn't some abandoned child. Of course the Doctor said a few things in that story that didn't quite make sense as well, including his age.

 

[Sci]

I have another reason for rejecting the idea that she's the Doctor's mother:

It hurts the mystery of just who the Doctor is if we see that he has parents and grandparents. It makes him a little too familiar.

(Also, it conflicts with the Doctor's comment in "The Empty Child" that he knows what it's like to be abandoned and left out in the cold as a child if his parents were alive and well and members of the High Council.)

He could've been left out in the cold for one day or even a few hours, but I did tell you some time ago that he wasn't some abandoned child.

And I don't buy that. The Doctor was explicitly saying that he knows what it's like to be an abandoned child.

Of course the Doctor said a few things in that story that didn't quite make sense as well, including his age.

True enough. But if that's the case, then we get to pick and choose what we want for the Doctor's biography, and I pick the bits where he's abandoned as a child.

 

[David cgc]

Or, say, orphaned, since he had a mother from a mortal species. Eh? Eh?

 

[Sci]

Or, say, orphaned, since he had a mother from a mortal species. Eh? Eh?

If he were half-Human, his brain would have burnt up from going to Time Lord school a la Donna. Eh? Eh?

 

[Starkers]

In the shot of the Doctor when Wilf asks him who The Woman was, the Doctor's eyes are in three places. At the beginning of this specific shot, he is looking at Wilf as Wilf asks the question. Then his eyes move to the middle-ish, to right where Sylvia is standing next to Wilf. THEN his eyes move past Sylvia's position and focus outward into the distance, wherein we then see the shot of Donna, with Sylvia to the right out of focus.

Upon watching this very closely, I'm quite conclusive in my thoughts that when asked about the identity of the woman, the Doctor quite definitely looked at Sylvia THEN Donna, NOT straight from Wilf to Donna (as people have said in support of the "granddaughter/Susan" theory; I, too, was one who said it).

So.... yeah. I'll go with the "word of god" and say that it's the Doctor's mother.

Well I finally got around to rewatching EoT2 tonight and by jove I think you might be right, his first port of call after Wilf asks is to look at Sylvia, then Donna. Shame as Susan makes more sense given he Wilf and Jack all were grandfathers.

 

[RoJoHen]

I think they're trying to come from the perspective of nuWho fans rather than digging into classic Who lore. Giving the Doctor a mother is easier for the wider fanbase to relate to. People (like me) who have only watched nuWho would have no idea who Susan is.

 

[Tom]

Except he just said it off-the-cuff to some stranger at the New Years Party

Not surprised, most guys tell taller tales then that at parties to get laid! LOL

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Personally I think both Wilf and Donna are demeaned as characters if they're Timelords. I prefer that they're both just regular humans acting in a special way. In fact I was pretty annoyed when the Donna is special trope was relealed to be that she was only spelcial because of the Doctor. I wanted her to be special because she was her!

Agreed on all counts, but I can live with the latter. I would have been pissed if Donna or Wilf turned out to be Time Lords.

 

[David cgc]

Or, say, orphaned, since he had a mother from a mortal species. Eh? Eh?

If he were half-Human, his brain would have burnt up from going to Time Lord school a la Donna. Eh? Eh?

Not at all. Donna was half human, half Time-Lord. The Doctor is half human, half gallifreyan, all Time-Lord.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Forgot to say earlier: Even though Davies has said officially that he intended The Woman to be The Doctor's mother, I'm going to still believe it's Susan until it's stated on screen otherwise.

 

[Australis]

Just popping back in briefly.

When I saw this face:

I thought of this face:

I hope you can see why. The resemblance to me is very strong. Whether intentional or not is another tale (and apparently not, according to RTD). Still, that's my reasoning.

 

[Neroon]

I did the same as Joy and reviewed "The End of Time, pt 2" with special focus on "The Woman". One thing in particular stuck out for me. When The Doctor is confronting Rassilon, and trying to discern what to do... he looks right at this woman. She gives him a furtive glance with her eyes toward the Master's machine. During that exchange between her and the Docotr, you can hear the gentle strains of what I've come to call "Donna's Theme". It's a very wistful, sad bit played in a minor key with a little bit of vocalizing. The only time I have ever heard that piece played is when Donna is in a scene or the focus is clearly upon her. "Turn Left" is a perfect example. That to me indicates there is some strange connection between "the Woman" and Donna. Is that enough to say she's Donna in a diffrent timeframe? That she's potentially the Doctor's mother? No, it isn't, or else this discussion would be over. But I am convinced that she is in some deep, veiled way connected to Donna.

 

[Kibbin]

A lot of people keep using that donna's theme bit as an example and while I'm not saying you are definatly wrong it looses some of its impact to me to know that they reused the music from daleks in manhattan to do an alien bar, thus I am inclined to believe that they were just reusing that sad bit for a sad moment too.

 

[Neroon]

But where else was that theme used? I'm not saying that it was definitely never used elsewhere, just that I cannot remember where that would be.

 

[Lindley]

THE WOMAN!

 

[Neroon]

Guess I know what I'm doing this evening - replying series 4 and trying to find another scene where that theme might have been used other than in one with Donna. And if it was used in a Donna scene outside of "Turn Left". All that may be moot, given that the editing process may well mix up themes and characters, something like Kibbin is suggesting.

 

[Kibbin]

I'm not saying that theme was used elsewhere, I don't know. But as far as I know the dance music fom daleks in manhattan wasnt used elsewhere either but they chucked this in so why not the donna theme, especially if its a rather unnocited nice sad tune.