Spock's Blood...

[Gil T.Azell]

How could his blood be green?
Wouldn't he get red blood from his mother?

( If this has been asked before sorry I've never seen it posted.)

 

[Zeppster]

Cross breed with aliens and find out. He just happened to get more alien based blood with human elements.

 

[BenRoethig]

I have no idea how cross-species genetics would work (in real life it probably wouldn't). My guess is that either the gene for copper-based Hemocyanin is dominate to iron-based hemoglobin or it was a 50/50 crapshoot.

 

[Jeri]

Vulcan genes are dominant. It's like with human genes for brown vs. blue eyes. That's the way I rationalize it.

 

[Christopher]

I think the crux of the question, and it's a valid one, is: given that a mother and the baby in her womb literally share the same blood during gestation, how could a human woman with red, iron-based blood carry an alien fetus with green, copper-based blood? Wouldn't that kill them both? It doesn't really make sense when you analyze it. Of course, the whole concept of aliens and humans being interfertile -- or aliens being humanoid at all -- is entirely fanciful.

Not to mention that there are some crustaceans that have copper-based blood, and it's actually blue, not green.

 

[Jeri]

Here we go again. As I said recently in yet another blood topic in General Discussion, I want to see all-new octupus photos in this thread!

 

[GSchnitzer]

How could his blood be green?
Wouldn't he get red blood from his mother?

( If this has been asked before sorry I've never seen it posted.)

D.C. Fontana had some clarification about this in her script for "Journey to Babel:"

Scene 73 INT. EXAMINATION ROOM - CLOSE - SPOCK

He lies on an examination table, bare chested. With his look, CAMERA PANS to the device on his arm. From this device CAMERA FOLLOWS transparent tube carrying his green blood to a wall computer.

CAMERA PANS to a second computer, follows the tube from it to the Jefferies Seperator. HOLD on the green Spock blood entering the seperator, and orange portion dropping down to a bottled labeled 'Waste Factor', CAMERA NOW FOLLOWS another tube which carries blood of a brighter green hue to a device on Sarek's arm. Sarek is anesthetized.

When ultimately realized, the shot looked like this:

In looking at the Jefferies Seperator unit, you can see the ochre-green blood from Spock, the orange "waste factors" in the little collection bottle, and the emerald green blood going into Sarek.

So, Spock's blood is green (with a little bit of orange in it), but a pure Vulcan's blood is even greener.

 

[Christopher]

^That's a fascinating detail. Thanks!

Still doesn't explain how Amanda survived pregnancy, though.

 

[Captain Robert April]

Find thee the album "Inside Star Trek" and listen to the little chat between Ambassador Sarek and Gene Roddenberry. Spock didn't spend all of his time inside Amanda.

 

[Myasishchev]

How could his blood be green?
Wouldn't he get red blood from his mother?

( If this has been asked before sorry I've never seen it posted.)

It's all absurdity.

 

[Mysterion]

Still doesn't explain how Amanda survived pregnancy, though.

There has to have been no small amount of medical and/or scientific intervention involved.

Did Amanda actually carry Spock, or was he gestated in some sort of "artificial womb"? I know we see a live birth in the latest film as well as the flashback in STV, so perhaps Spock was brought to near term in the artificial womb, and then placed in Amanda's womb for the actual birth - choose your own ethical/traditional/medical reason(s) for this to happen.

 

[Alexander]

I think the crux of the question, and it's a valid one, is: given that a mother and the baby in her womb literally share the same blood during gestation, how could a human woman with red, iron-based blood carry an alien fetus with green, copper-based blood? Wouldn't that kill them both? It doesn't really make sense when you analyze it. Of course, the whole concept of aliens and humans being interfertile -- or aliens being humanoid at all -- is entirely fanciful.

Not to mention that there are some crustaceans that have copper-based blood, and it's actually blue, not green.

I've always thought that humans and Vulans are not supposed to be able to procreate at all, and that the process of a human carrying a part Vulcan fetus required extensive outside intervention. Not a natural process at all.

 

[GSchnitzer]

Still doesn't explain how Amanda survived pregnancy, though.

There has to have been no small amount of medical and/or scientific intervention involved.

Did Amanda actually carry Spock, or was he gestated in some sort of "artificial womb"? I know we see a live birth in the latest film as well as the flashback in STV, so perhaps Spock was brought to near term in the artificial womb, and then placed in Amanda's womb for the actual birth - choose your own ethical/traditional/medical reason(s) for this to happen.

Here's the relevant content from the Star Trek Lives phonograph album:

http://sarek-story.blankespoor.org/08-Sarek's%20Son%20Spock.mp3

Roddenberry asks Ambassador Sarek about Spock--the first Human-Vulcan hybrid. Sarek replies:

"No, not the first. But the first to survive. As you must know, an Earth-Vulcan conception will abort during the end of the first month. The fetus is unable to continue life once it begins to develop its primary organs. The fetus Spock was removed from Amanda's body at this time--first such experiment ever attempted. His tiny form resided in a test tube for the following two Earth months, while our physicians performed delicate chemical engineering, introducing over a hundred subtle changes that we hoped would sustain life. At the end of this time, the fetus was returned to Amanda's womb. At the ninth Earth month, the tiny form was again removed from Amanda, prematurely by Vulcan standards, and spent the following four months Vulcan term pregnancy in a specially designed incubator. The infant Spock proved surprisingly resilient--there seems to be something about the Earth-Vulcan mixture, which created in that.. tiny body.. a fierce determination to survive."

"And, as Spock grew into childhood, Ambassador--"

"Yes, yes. There must have been times when his inner mind wondered, if the fight to survive had been worthwhile. You see, while all Vulcans, including our children, live by the code of IDIC, and believe that diversity is to be admired, and treasured, it must be understood that the display of emotion is considered on our planet to be grossly offensive. No, more than that. Shockingly indecent. I can only explain that our attitude is rooted in Vulcan history, involving events of such bloody violence that it's left our race forever scarred, and sensitive to displays of emotion. Whether or not this Vulcan attitude can be defended, the fact is, it exists."

Of course, this is from--what? 1974?--long before we saw a flashback of Amanda in a cave giving birth to Spock.

Also, I'm sure that there are all kinds of technological advances in the 23rd century--perhaps including semi-permeable fields. I remember that Clarke's Third Law is "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." So the source of our incredulity that a human woman could give birth to a half human-half Vulcan child is due more to our limitations, rather than the actual impossibility of the technology.

 

[Captain Robert April]

The whole of that "interview" points towards that whole flashback scene in TFF being nothing but a steaming load, not just Spock being birthed in a cave, but Sarek snarling "So human", like he'd just stepped into something foul.

Have I mentioned that I really don't care for that movie?

 

[Neutral Zone]

I'm actually surprised that Sarek was allowed to have a human wife, it would not be logical cross species, especially seeing as humans are so illogical and tend to act on impluse.

 

[Mysterion]

Thanks GSchnitzer, I'd totally forgotten the Star Trek Lives LP and the Sarek interview thereon. Must be where the concept got stuck in my head from.

 

[T'Bonz]

The whole of that "interview" points towards that whole flashback scene in TFF being nothing but a steaming load, not just Spock being birthed in a cave, but Sarek snarling "So human", like he'd just stepped into something foul.

Have I mentioned that I really don't care for that movie?

Me too. It was poorly done.

First of all, a hybrid child, born in a CAVE? I'd have expected a birth in a facility with all of the amenities in case of problems.

Secondly "So human"? WTF? Sarek willingly married a human, and he's smart enough to know that the child would be half-human, and would have at least some human traits.

The writer of this scene needed a swift kick with a pointy-toed boot.

 

[KobayashiMaru13]

"No, not the first. But the first to survive. As you must know, an Earth-Vulcan conception will abort during the end of the first month. The fetus is unable to continue life once it begins to develop its primary organs. The fetus Spock was removed from Amanda's body at this time--first such experiment ever attempted. His tiny form resided in a test tube for the following two Earth months, while our physicians performed delicate chemical engineering, introducing over a hundred subtle changes that we hoped would sustain life. At the end of this time, the fetus was returned to Amanda's womb. At the ninth Earth month, the tiny form was again removed from Amanda, prematurely by Vulcan standards, and spent the following four months Vulcan term pregnancy in a specially designed incubator. The infant Spock proved surprisingly resilient--there seems to be something about the Earth-Vulcan mixture, which created in that.. tiny body.. a fierce determination to survive."

This is the way i heard it, and it certianly makes the most sense. Mind you, the whole thing about Spock being born in a cave in TFF is, in MHO, a load of crap. That isn't even really even feasible, and frankly the odds of Spock surviving that wouldn't be all that high. IMO, anyways.

And on another subject mentioned, Sarek married Amanda becuase he LOVED her, odd as it may seem. Sure, part of it may have been because he was ambassador, and it was logical, but they no doubt "clicked", and it probably just worked, despite them being different races and all that.

^ and i agree, T'bonz, that writer does need a kick with a pointy-toed boot!

How absurd it all is,
TPC

 

[T'Girl]

^^^ It wasn't actually a cave, it was a "traditional birthing chamber", smack in the middle of a fully equiped hospital.

 

[Zeppster]

It was a cave. And yes TFF was that badly written. The movie was about a search for God, enough said.

I would think that if Spock were born it's obvious Amanda carried him. Maybe there was help one the medical issues with the differences between humans and vulcans so they probably had to help with that, But I would think that Amanda could carry a vulcan baby. There's apparently more similarities between if they can manage to have sex.