Got to agree that had Old Who written all over that and apart from Stolen Earth was the best cliffhanger to date.
The End Of Time Part 1 - Comment & Grading SPOILERS
- Thread starter Tom
- Start date
Got to agree that had Old Who written all over that and apart from Stolen Earth was the best cliffhanger to date.
While as a group, yes, I agree, but there have been some Time Lords who The Doctor would most certainly miss: Susan, Romana, Drax, Rodan, Damon, K'anpo Rimpoche, Azmael, to name a few.
Hm, that's definitely a good way of looking at it. And I'm willing to bet thatt "The Waters of Mars" makes the situation all the worse.
Hmmm...I think you're onto something!God in heaven!
I just figured out some thing horrid about the new episode!
We have met a commentator narrator presentor of the facts from gallifrey before!
Every inch the otherworldly Dan Rather!
Runcible the Fatuous.
And here was I thinking that he was the War Chief.
This must be done.(BTW, if Dalton's character is killed at the end of the special, I think he should regenerate into Pierce Brosnan!)
That would be insanely brilliant!
Yes, come to think of it, especially considering...
When Wilf says "I don't want you to die," he's holding his gun.
Hmmm...oddly I don't have a problem imagining Ainley's Master doing something akin to what Simm's Master has done. I guess my problem is I keep thinking "Is this something Delgado's Master would do?" and conclude "Absolutely not." But I should be viewing The Master as a whole, not just one part. Just like I can't imagine The First Doctor gurning like The Tenth Doctor.I agree it had a classic feel to it...in fact I can just imagine several hundred Anthony ainley's laughing maniacally ala the Simms at the end.
Thing is, Delgado's incarnation hasn't been put through the brain-wringer, repeatedly. He's nowhere near as damaged goods as Ainley, and he in turn is nowhere near as mindfucked as Simm's incarnation has been. By this point, he is *insane* - completely, and in the clinical sense of the word.
Last edited:
Indeed, I'm definitely getting to that perspective. Add to the number of times The Master has been near death or worse, it's no surprise his mind has decayed greatly.
Also have to remember that timelord personalities change with each regeneration. Think of all the things Ten has done that you'd never in a million years imagine Pertwee or Davison doing.
Right. Like I said, I can't imagine The First Doctor gurning like The Tenth Doctor.
Yeah...dash about, wear trainers, use the brainy specs...hang on!
But I'm sure there are things about every doctor it would be hard to reconcile with Hartnell? I mean, can you see the 1st Doctor judo chopping people like Pertwee?
The whole "What would Delgado's Master would do or Ainley's Master would do" is silly. Both of them would do what the script told them to do. The problem with the Master is that he's more of a plot device than a real character therefore there is no consistency (which is true for most of Dr Who's enemies). Honestly Delgado's Master tried to summon Satan and made out with the Queen of Atlantis. Putting his head on every human isn't far fetched.
What is interesting about the Master in "End of Time" is the way he IMPROVISED. Normally he would have some convoluted plan that the Doctor would figure out near the end and at the last moment foil. This time he just rolled with it and maybe that's why people found out of character.
What is interesting about the Master in "End of Time" is the way he IMPROVISED. Normally he would have some convoluted plan that the Doctor would figure out near the end and at the last moment foil. This time he just rolled with it and maybe that's why people found out of character.
Above average. 4/5
A pretty fun episode. The degenerate Master was actually well portrayed and intresting to watch. Bernard Cribbins was great as always. David Tennant was in top form. All of that makes a fun episode.
However, I just saw it less than 12 hours ago and the plot is hard to recall. There wasn't much of it really. A big problem was that so much of the plot had already happened and stuff was in place. The Master's resurrection, and anti-resurrection atttempts. The guy who "found" and tried to develop the alien tech. The aliens trying to take it back. Etc. This story was more of an introduction to what was already well in progress. I don't think the narration was helpful, but heck, they had to showcase that Timothy Dalton was in the show.
I hope the Time Lords do come back. At first, I didn't like that they weren't in the show. Then I liked it. The Last of the Time Lords is a neat descriptor for the Doctor. And, the burden it places on him was interesting to watch play out, especially near the end. But, I will be glad if they do come back.
A couple of guesses, pure speculation:
Wilf and Donna are not human. Dalton said the human race had ended yet those 2 were still their, and unchanged. The Master specified a human template and it affected all humans. Therefore, they're not human. That, plus the Doctor's previous comments to Wilf.
The Time Lords are using Earth like miners use canaries in a mine, well, sort of. Dalton said repeatedly about the day the the human race ceased. They must've had that event set up as their wake up call. Why? Because Earth is the Doctor's favorite planet and he's always here making sure it's ok. So, if the human race ended, then something *really* bad was afoot.
There will obviously be some grand reset. The Time Lords will be brought back and the humans will be restored. But, it'll cost the Doctor.
Wilf will shoot the Doctor.
Wilf and Donna might be Time Lords in hiding. If so, Rassilon and Susan? Or Romana?
Mr Awe
A pretty fun episode. The degenerate Master was actually well portrayed and intresting to watch. Bernard Cribbins was great as always. David Tennant was in top form. All of that makes a fun episode.
However, I just saw it less than 12 hours ago and the plot is hard to recall. There wasn't much of it really. A big problem was that so much of the plot had already happened and stuff was in place. The Master's resurrection, and anti-resurrection atttempts. The guy who "found" and tried to develop the alien tech. The aliens trying to take it back. Etc. This story was more of an introduction to what was already well in progress. I don't think the narration was helpful, but heck, they had to showcase that Timothy Dalton was in the show.
I hope the Time Lords do come back. At first, I didn't like that they weren't in the show. Then I liked it. The Last of the Time Lords is a neat descriptor for the Doctor. And, the burden it places on him was interesting to watch play out, especially near the end. But, I will be glad if they do come back.
A couple of guesses, pure speculation:
Wilf and Donna are not human. Dalton said the human race had ended yet those 2 were still their, and unchanged. The Master specified a human template and it affected all humans. Therefore, they're not human. That, plus the Doctor's previous comments to Wilf.
The Time Lords are using Earth like miners use canaries in a mine, well, sort of. Dalton said repeatedly about the day the the human race ceased. They must've had that event set up as their wake up call. Why? Because Earth is the Doctor's favorite planet and he's always here making sure it's ok. So, if the human race ended, then something *really* bad was afoot.
There will obviously be some grand reset. The Time Lords will be brought back and the humans will be restored. But, it'll cost the Doctor.
Wilf will shoot the Doctor.
Wilf and Donna might be Time Lords in hiding. If so, Rassilon and Susan? Or Romana?
Mr Awe
I hope there is no reboot. The grace and skill with which RTD continued the program after such a long hiatus, and made it fun for long term and new fans alike, was quite amazing. For him to undo that in his last episode would be quite dissappointing.
Let Doctor continue to be a continuation of the series.
I suppose it's possible to have something in between a continuation and a reboot. Suppose they use the immortality machine on a dying doctor. He won't survive the regeneration due to too much damage. So, they use the machine to heal him. Maybe he reverts back to his original template, the first Doctor? It's not really the first Doctor but is based on him? And, potentially the machine fixes the TARDIS too, which is psuedo living, and reverts that back to the original design.
This is now my theory for what will happen! This wouldn't be too bad. It's not a reboot, but a twist on a continuation.
Mr Awe
I assumed Donna is unaffected due to her metacrisis and Wilf is unaffected due to being in that anti-radiation chamber. It stopped the Master getting into his head before he gave the planet the full Malkovich treatment so I assume the chamber also prevented Wilf being subject to the transformation.
Wilf could be a Time Lord of some description, but I highly doubt Donna is. Or, at least, wasn't until the metacrisis. Perhaps the Master's use of the Gate has unwittingly healed her so she's able to live normally whilst remembering all the adventures she's had now...
Wilf could be a Time Lord of some description, but I highly doubt Donna is. Or, at least, wasn't until the metacrisis. Perhaps the Master's use of the Gate has unwittingly healed her so she's able to live normally whilst remembering all the adventures she's had now...
RE: Wilf and Donna
I'm of two minds on Wilf...he was shielded inside that chamber which is what kept him from changing into the Master...but then, there must be something up with him that allowed him to actually remember the bad dreams. I'd be pleasantly surprised if he turned out to be an arched Time Lord hiding out on Earth, but I'm not holding my breath.
As for Donna, if her mind is half-human and half-Time Lord, with the Time Lord portion being suppressed, I wonder if somehow she's now fully Time Lord, with the human half being transformed into Time Lord by the Immortality Gate? Maybe the Doctor will have some help on the "outside" thanks to the Doctor Donna? If that's the case though, I don't see her staying Time Lord at the end though...maybe the Gate can somehow heal her while allowing her to retain her memories of the Doctor?
EDIT: Yeah, apparently Happy Day Riot had the exact same thoughts at the same time as I did...
I'm of two minds on Wilf...he was shielded inside that chamber which is what kept him from changing into the Master...but then, there must be something up with him that allowed him to actually remember the bad dreams. I'd be pleasantly surprised if he turned out to be an arched Time Lord hiding out on Earth, but I'm not holding my breath.
As for Donna, if her mind is half-human and half-Time Lord, with the Time Lord portion being suppressed, I wonder if somehow she's now fully Time Lord, with the human half being transformed into Time Lord by the Immortality Gate? Maybe the Doctor will have some help on the "outside" thanks to the Doctor Donna? If that's the case though, I don't see her staying Time Lord at the end though...maybe the Gate can somehow heal her while allowing her to retain her memories of the Doctor?
EDIT: Yeah, apparently Happy Day Riot had the exact same thoughts at the same time as I did...
I thought it wasnt too bad, the ending reminded me of reddwarfs rimmerworld tho
I actually thought of Rd Dwarf's "Me Squared". The one where Rimmer couldn't get along with himself. I wondered how long it would be before all of the Master's started squabbling? Each wanting to be in charge of everything!
Mr Awe
Wilf was sheided in the chamber, remembe,r he did start to see the Masterr in his head then he entered the chamber, and the Doctor filtered the chamber.
Donna was probrably protected because she has some timelord in her due to the Meta-Crisis situation.
Last edited:
If Donna did become a full timelord maybe the lady in white is a future incarnation of herself!
That would be pretty sweet! Maybe not as awesome as the lady in white being Susan or Romana, but still...
However, I just have a feeling though that she's going to be someone we've never seen before...
I suspect that like any society, Iran, Iraq, whatever. The power leaders on Gallifrey may be corrupt but there are a lot of average people, or Time Lords, that are good. We've seen them as well throughout the classic series.
Mr Awe
Similar threads
- Poll
- Poll
